Direct Port Nitrous & PD Blower-Low/High Pressure Fuel? Experierenced Advice Needed
12-27-2016, 09:53 PM
#1
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Direct Port Nitrous & PD Blower-Low/High Pressure Fuel? Experierenced Advice Needed
I have posted this in another forum but yet to have many responses.
This is on a 5th Gen Camaro
I'm having a new 430ci LSx block being assembled with a lot of premium components and would not desire for a failure right out of the gate.
Just looking for some reassurance or opinions from those more educated in nitrous than myself.
This direct port nitrous system is on a maxed out overspun TVS2300 PD Blower with approx. 15-16lbs. boost and using E85. I already have a squash fuel system, ID1300's and sufficient fuel for whatever power level I settle for.
I will have a dedicated fuel system for the nitrous using Ignite or Renegade E98.
Currently on the fence on which way to go about my fuel pressure setup for the nitrous. Low pressure (7 lbs-10 lbs) or High pressure (43lbs-58lbs)
I will be boost referenced either way.
If I assume High Pressure (43lb-58lb) fuel for initial tune of about a 100 shot, this will require a jet size of approx. 20n-10f. How likely is it with this small of fuel jet (10F-14F) that blockage with trash or anything would occur?
I will have a quality ethanol compatible 10 micron filter in line after the regulator on the dedicated.
My intention is to work my shot size up the ladder and probably wind up with a 200-250+ shot (12-14 fuel jet) to reach my HP goals.
My concern is the smallish fuel jet (10f-14f) with high pressure system. Some say I should be OK with the 10 micron fuel filter and others say a low pressure fuel setup with the associated slightly larger fuel jetting may offer a little insurance against some sort of contamination clogging the fuel jet.
High pressure would offer more resolution in fine tuning the fuel.
Low pressure (16f-20f) would offer less resolution but slightly larger fuel jets
I would appreciate some input from those more educated in nitrous than myself
This is on a 5th Gen Camaro
I'm having a new 430ci LSx block being assembled with a lot of premium components and would not desire for a failure right out of the gate.
Just looking for some reassurance or opinions from those more educated in nitrous than myself.
This direct port nitrous system is on a maxed out overspun TVS2300 PD Blower with approx. 15-16lbs. boost and using E85. I already have a squash fuel system, ID1300's and sufficient fuel for whatever power level I settle for.
I will have a dedicated fuel system for the nitrous using Ignite or Renegade E98.
Currently on the fence on which way to go about my fuel pressure setup for the nitrous. Low pressure (7 lbs-10 lbs) or High pressure (43lbs-58lbs)
I will be boost referenced either way.
If I assume High Pressure (43lb-58lb) fuel for initial tune of about a 100 shot, this will require a jet size of approx. 20n-10f. How likely is it with this small of fuel jet (10F-14F) that blockage with trash or anything would occur?
I will have a quality ethanol compatible 10 micron filter in line after the regulator on the dedicated.
My intention is to work my shot size up the ladder and probably wind up with a 200-250+ shot (12-14 fuel jet) to reach my HP goals.
My concern is the smallish fuel jet (10f-14f) with high pressure system. Some say I should be OK with the 10 micron fuel filter and others say a low pressure fuel setup with the associated slightly larger fuel jetting may offer a little insurance against some sort of contamination clogging the fuel jet.
High pressure would offer more resolution in fine tuning the fuel.
Low pressure (16f-20f) would offer less resolution but slightly larger fuel jets
I would appreciate some input from those more educated in nitrous than myself
12-27-2016, 10:15 PM
#2
Welcome to the forum.
I have no experience with multi port systems to offer, but I understand your dilemma.
Perhaps the solution lies in dropping boost and adding more jet all around?
I would try to run it with at least 45psi.
Hell, with a built 427, maybe you might be better off without the TVS and just throw some bigass jets in it and let her eat? Not trying to be a dick, but with that size motor and assuming a good sized cam and good heads, you're probably going to have to spin the *** out of that TVS to make 15+ psi anyhow, and you could easily make up that power with a multi port system. Just pointing out the obvious...
I have no experience with multi port systems to offer, but I understand your dilemma.
Perhaps the solution lies in dropping boost and adding more jet all around?
I would try to run it with at least 45psi.
Hell, with a built 427, maybe you might be better off without the TVS and just throw some bigass jets in it and let her eat? Not trying to be a dick, but with that size motor and assuming a good sized cam and good heads, you're probably going to have to spin the *** out of that TVS to make 15+ psi anyhow, and you could easily make up that power with a multi port system. Just pointing out the obvious...
12-27-2016, 11:05 PM
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Welcome to the forum.
I have no experience with multi port systems to offer, but I understand your dilemma.
Perhaps the solution lies in dropping boost and adding more jet all around?
I would try to run it with at least 45psi.
Hell, with a built 427, maybe you might be better off without the TVS and just throw some bigass jets in it and let her eat? Not trying to be a dick, but with that size motor and assuming a good sized cam and good heads, you're probably going to have to spin the *** out of that TVS to make 15+ psi anyhow, and you could easily make up that power with a multi port system. Just pointing out the obvious...
I have no experience with multi port systems to offer, but I understand your dilemma.
Perhaps the solution lies in dropping boost and adding more jet all around?
I would try to run it with at least 45psi.
Hell, with a built 427, maybe you might be better off without the TVS and just throw some bigass jets in it and let her eat? Not trying to be a dick, but with that size motor and assuming a good sized cam and good heads, you're probably going to have to spin the *** out of that TVS to make 15+ psi anyhow, and you could easily make up that power with a multi port system. Just pointing out the obvious...
Yeah my previous build was a TVS 2300 416CI with a 102 plate setup with a 200 shot. Found limits of ls3 aluminum block. 100% street mostly 1/8 mile setup with 15" Welds S76 beadlocks, Hoosier 29x10.5 W's slicks, Skinny's. I agree blower is small but makes for a fun street ride even without the nitrous. Nitrous gets the nod for when its time to play with others.
New build has MAST Large Bore 6 bolt heads ported to work well with nitrous, titanium intakes, Inconel ex, crower steel shaft mount rockers, Isky needleless lifters, LSx block machined for 1/2" studs, piston oil squirters, Diamond, Callies magnum, Callies Ultra Rods, Cam Motion 24x-25x-660-115+
Just need to figure out the best fuel route to go with the nitrous. Never realized how small a 10 or 12 fuel jet was until you try to see through one.
12-28-2016, 02:17 AM
#4
Personally I think you are better off with high pressure since it is boosted. Just as a safety in case your boost reference line happens to have some kind of issue, then you still have at least some fuel even though it would still be lean. If you get good fuel you shouldn't need to worry about any contamination though. Also make sure you set the jets up for whatever fuel you use, because E98 will require ~40% bigger jets than race gas/pump gas. I would suggest asking your preferred nitrous company these questions as well. I use Nitrous Outlet and they have been super helpful with anything I have needed. I also spray a pretty big shot on top of a PD blower.
Last edited by SquirrelyNutz; 12-28-2016 at 02:23 AM.
12-28-2016, 08:59 AM
#5
Personally I think you are better off with high pressure since it is boosted. Just as a safety in case your boost reference line happens to have some kind of issue, then you still have at least some fuel even though it would still be lean. If you get good fuel you shouldn't need to worry about any contamination though. Also make sure you set the jets up for whatever fuel you use, because E98 will require ~40% bigger jets than race gas/pump gas. I would suggest asking your preferred nitrous company these questions as well. I use Nitrous Outlet and they have been super helpful with anything I have needed. I also spray a pretty big shot on top of a PD blower.
In fact, that's a question I have posed before on another thread on this forum:
Why don't more of the nitrous guys with a standalone fuel supply use methanol or ethanol blends, instead of high octane leaded fuel, as their N2O fuel augmentation? Obviously, the advantage is that with alcohol, once you get the jetting sorted, you get additional cooling and octane, even with a small amount of nitrous, which obviously has its own IAT cooling effect.
But as you have pointed out, the added benefit here for the OP in using E98 is that he won't have to worry about the fuel jet being easily blocked due to being so small, since the fuel jet will be so much bigger with alcohol.
I'm all ears on this stuff, since I'm pretty sure that I'll be adding a multi-port, standalone supplied nitrous system to my Heartbeat setup at some point.
12-28-2016, 09:05 AM
#6
Thanks
Yeah my previous build was a TVS 2300 416CI with a 102 plate setup with a 200 shot. Found limits of ls3 aluminum block. 100% street mostly 1/8 mile setup with 15" Welds S76 beadlocks, Hoosier 29x10.5 W's slicks, Skinny's. I agree blower is small but makes for a fun street ride even without the nitrous. Nitrous gets the nod for when its time to play with others.
New build has MAST Large Bore 6 bolt heads ported to work well with nitrous, titanium intakes, Inconel ex, crower steel shaft mount rockers, Isky needleless lifters, LSx block machined for 1/2" studs, piston oil squirters, Diamond, Callies magnum, Callies Ultra Rods, Cam Motion 24x-25x-660-115+
Just need to figure out the best fuel route to go with the nitrous. Never realized how small a 10 or 12 fuel jet was until you try to see through one.
Yeah my previous build was a TVS 2300 416CI with a 102 plate setup with a 200 shot. Found limits of ls3 aluminum block. 100% street mostly 1/8 mile setup with 15" Welds S76 beadlocks, Hoosier 29x10.5 W's slicks, Skinny's. I agree blower is small but makes for a fun street ride even without the nitrous. Nitrous gets the nod for when its time to play with others.
New build has MAST Large Bore 6 bolt heads ported to work well with nitrous, titanium intakes, Inconel ex, crower steel shaft mount rockers, Isky needleless lifters, LSx block machined for 1/2" studs, piston oil squirters, Diamond, Callies magnum, Callies Ultra Rods, Cam Motion 24x-25x-660-115+
Just need to figure out the best fuel route to go with the nitrous. Never realized how small a 10 or 12 fuel jet was until you try to see through one.
But, as I said before, with that combo, I doubt you will be able to make nearly the same boost as before without seriously over spinning the blower, so you may want to just go ahead and hit it with a 200-250 shot straight away to cool down the IATs nicely.
That thing ought to scoot pretty good when you're done with it.
12-28-2016, 02:00 PM
#7
^^^^^^Some good info and advice, I think.
In fact, that's a question I have posed before on another thread on this forum:
Why don't more of the nitrous guys with a standalone fuel supply use methanol or ethanol blends, instead of high octane leaded fuel, as their N2O fuel augmentation? Obviously, the advantage is that with alcohol, once you get the jetting sorted, you get additional cooling and octane, even with a small amount of nitrous, which obviously has its own IAT cooling effect.
But as you have pointed out, the added benefit here for the OP in using E98 is that he won't have to worry about the fuel jet being easily blocked due to being so small, since the fuel jet will be so much bigger with alcohol.
I'm all ears on this stuff, since I'm pretty sure that I'll be adding a multi-port, standalone supplied nitrous system to my Heartbeat setup at some point.
In fact, that's a question I have posed before on another thread on this forum:
Why don't more of the nitrous guys with a standalone fuel supply use methanol or ethanol blends, instead of high octane leaded fuel, as their N2O fuel augmentation? Obviously, the advantage is that with alcohol, once you get the jetting sorted, you get additional cooling and octane, even with a small amount of nitrous, which obviously has its own IAT cooling effect.
But as you have pointed out, the added benefit here for the OP in using E98 is that he won't have to worry about the fuel jet being easily blocked due to being so small, since the fuel jet will be so much bigger with alcohol.
I'm all ears on this stuff, since I'm pretty sure that I'll be adding a multi-port, standalone supplied nitrous system to my Heartbeat setup at some point.
12-29-2016, 05:25 PM
#8
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Sounds like a badass setup for sure.
But, as I said before, with that combo, I doubt you will be able to make nearly the same boost as before without seriously over spinning the blower, so you may want to just go ahead and hit it with a 200-250 shot straight away to cool down the IATs nicely.
That thing ought to scoot pretty good when you're done with it.
But, as I said before, with that combo, I doubt you will be able to make nearly the same boost as before without seriously over spinning the blower, so you may want to just go ahead and hit it with a 200-250 shot straight away to cool down the IATs nicely.
That thing ought to scoot pretty good when you're done with it.
I am concerned about 8 fuel jets the size I cant even see through
01-07-2017, 05:19 PM
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You are probably right about the actual boost number as I do not have a way to increase pulley/blower speed any more. (Its maxed) but I should make more power due to much better efficiency. I will rely on well designed nitrous setup to get to the numbers I desire. The 200-250 shot is what I plan on top of blower.
I am concerned about 8 fuel jets the size I cant even see through
I am concerned about 8 fuel jets the size I cant even see through
I was thinking about a 10 micron e85 compatible filter in line just prior to the solenoids.
Is there a better way to insure an adequate filter system to help eliminate clogging my very small size fuel jets for the nitrous? I am going with E98 in the dedicated tank and E85 for the main fuel.