Dyno tune time! Help me become an educated consumer
04-01-2012, 07:45 PM
#1
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Dyno tune time! Help me become an educated consumer
OK my C6 will be profesionally dyno tuned this year. I am not an total idiot when it comes to tuning, I had my old supercharged mustang tuned many times. But I am not as familiar with tuning LS engines. I have a tuner I trust, but could use an overview of C6 tuning. I don't need enough info to tune the car myself as I don't have time or interest for the learning curve. But I want to make sure all my interests are covered, when I am there. Knowledge is power so to speak.
My car is a basic bolt on 05 LS2 MN6 with LTs, CAI, FAST102 etc....
First question is a general tuning question. Last time we tuned my mustang we welded a bung close to the collector for the wide band. Will that be necessary on my C6 or is the tailpipe wide band good enough for NA tuning?
What are the tuner options for a C6, I believe my tuner has SCT and HP tuners? Whats good and bad and why?
Typically should the ECT or IAT spark retard functions be adjusted?
What is torque management, and should I have it removed?
Can the CAGS be turned off?
Fuel tuning should be done with with the MAF table correct?
If tuned right my LFTs will be near 0 in closed loop correct?
I am running a 160 stat so I should have the fans adjusted, what temp and %?
What tables are used for fuel and spark power tuning?
Can a tuner make any changes to the commanded throttle position vs actual throttle plate angle?
Is there anything else I should have done while my C6 is being tuned?
Thanks for you help.
My car is a basic bolt on 05 LS2 MN6 with LTs, CAI, FAST102 etc....
First question is a general tuning question. Last time we tuned my mustang we welded a bung close to the collector for the wide band. Will that be necessary on my C6 or is the tailpipe wide band good enough for NA tuning?
What are the tuner options for a C6, I believe my tuner has SCT and HP tuners? Whats good and bad and why?
Typically should the ECT or IAT spark retard functions be adjusted?
What is torque management, and should I have it removed?
Can the CAGS be turned off?
Fuel tuning should be done with with the MAF table correct?
If tuned right my LFTs will be near 0 in closed loop correct?
I am running a 160 stat so I should have the fans adjusted, what temp and %?
What tables are used for fuel and spark power tuning?
Can a tuner make any changes to the commanded throttle position vs actual throttle plate angle?
Is there anything else I should have done while my C6 is being tuned?
Thanks for you help.
04-01-2012, 10:47 PM
#2
Safety Car
First question is a general tuning question. Last time we tuned my mustang we welded a bung close to the collector for the wide band. Will that be necessary on my C6 or is the tailpipe wide band good enough for NA tuning?
Most shops that use a dynojet or mustang dyno will use tailpipe, welded in bungs are great as well if you are going to tune it yourself/
What are the tuner options for a C6, I believe my tuner has SCT and HP tuners? Whats good and bad and why?
HP Tuners is the norm for custom tuning, it is what I use and what I would suggest you have used on your car in case you need adjustments down the road.
Typically should the ECT or IAT spark retard functions be adjusted?
The ECT table will already be at 100% on the vette so I dont think there is much to gain there, but yes the IAT tables needs to be desensitized or else you will have timing retard when the IAT sees 88°
What is torque management, and should I have it removed?
Since you asked about CAGS then I assume you are a M6, there is only torque management on the engine side. I removed mine, it does wake the car up some on how power ramps in. That part is up to you.
Can the CAGS be turned off? YES
Fuel tuning should be done with with the MAF table correct?
There is the MAF table, the PE table and several others that a good tuner will adjust.
If tuned right my LFTs will be near 0 in closed loop correct?
LTFT only report what the car is seeing during part throttle cruising, in theory yes they should be as close to zero as possible.
I am running a 160 stat so I should have the fans adjusted, what temp and %?
GM now uses a PWM controller (pulse width modulated) to run the fans. The lowest you can turn the fans on is 192° (I would not suggest as if you do then the fan will come on at key on and run all of the time). I have a 160° in my car, I have the fans set to come on at 196° around 50% or so and ramping up pretty quick from there. My car currently runs around 175-195° while driving and sitting in traffic.
What tables are used for fuel and spark power tuning?
There are several, there are 2 timing tables (hi/lo), as I said earlier a good tuner will know which ones should be tuned.
Can a tuner make any changes to the commanded throttle position vs actual throttle plate angle?
Is there anything else I should have done while my C6 is being tuned?
One area I am going after on my tuner is the throttle decay rates, I cant stand how GM makes the throttle hang when you release the throttle.
Most shops that use a dynojet or mustang dyno will use tailpipe, welded in bungs are great as well if you are going to tune it yourself/
What are the tuner options for a C6, I believe my tuner has SCT and HP tuners? Whats good and bad and why?
HP Tuners is the norm for custom tuning, it is what I use and what I would suggest you have used on your car in case you need adjustments down the road.
Typically should the ECT or IAT spark retard functions be adjusted?
The ECT table will already be at 100% on the vette so I dont think there is much to gain there, but yes the IAT tables needs to be desensitized or else you will have timing retard when the IAT sees 88°
What is torque management, and should I have it removed?
Since you asked about CAGS then I assume you are a M6, there is only torque management on the engine side. I removed mine, it does wake the car up some on how power ramps in. That part is up to you.
Can the CAGS be turned off? YES
Fuel tuning should be done with with the MAF table correct?
There is the MAF table, the PE table and several others that a good tuner will adjust.
If tuned right my LFTs will be near 0 in closed loop correct?
LTFT only report what the car is seeing during part throttle cruising, in theory yes they should be as close to zero as possible.
I am running a 160 stat so I should have the fans adjusted, what temp and %?
GM now uses a PWM controller (pulse width modulated) to run the fans. The lowest you can turn the fans on is 192° (I would not suggest as if you do then the fan will come on at key on and run all of the time). I have a 160° in my car, I have the fans set to come on at 196° around 50% or so and ramping up pretty quick from there. My car currently runs around 175-195° while driving and sitting in traffic.
What tables are used for fuel and spark power tuning?
There are several, there are 2 timing tables (hi/lo), as I said earlier a good tuner will know which ones should be tuned.
Can a tuner make any changes to the commanded throttle position vs actual throttle plate angle?
Is there anything else I should have done while my C6 is being tuned?
One area I am going after on my tuner is the throttle decay rates, I cant stand how GM makes the throttle hang when you release the throttle.
04-02-2012, 12:22 PM
#3
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
The ECT table will already be at 100% on the vette so I dont think there is much to gain there, but yes the IAT tables needs to be desensitized or else you will have timing retard when the IAT sees 88°
GM now uses a PWM controller (pulse width modulated) to run the fans. The lowest you can turn the fans on is 192° (I would not suggest as if you do then the fan will come on at key on and run all of the time). I have a 160° in my car, I have the fans set to come on at 196° around 50% or so and ramping up pretty quick from there. My car currently runs around 175-195° while driving and sitting in traffic.
Can a tuner make any changes to the commanded throttle position vs actual throttle plate angle?
TJay74- Thanks for the info.
04-02-2012, 04:35 PM
#4
Safety Car
I want to make sure were are talking the same thing here. ECT is electronic controlled throttle, or are you refering to engine coolant tempature?
Yes 192 is the minimum unless you have a custom OS loaded into the ECM which is very rare and expensive using HPT for just a bolt on car, most dont worry about that until they get into the wild setups.
Only other way to command the fans sooner is to use one of the new PWM over ried switches that have came out recently, even then you have to be carefull as from what has been said if you run the rans at 100% for too long it will melt the connected to the fans.
Yes 192 is the minimum unless you have a custom OS loaded into the ECM which is very rare and expensive using HPT for just a bolt on car, most dont worry about that until they get into the wild setups.
Only other way to command the fans sooner is to use one of the new PWM over ried switches that have came out recently, even then you have to be carefull as from what has been said if you run the rans at 100% for too long it will melt the connected to the fans.
04-02-2012, 08:10 PM
#5
Former Vendor
The 05 C6 is an E-40 computer. Only 05 had that computer.
From the listed mods it should be a very basic tune. There is a bunch of table's that should be changed to get the most out of drivability/throttle response ect but I doubt the local tuner will hit most of them.
If SCT is used you'll pay an extra charge for a tuner you don't need. HPT would be the choice in your situation.
Get rid of CAGS, set fan lower,delete TM,Adjust idle area for 102 intake, delete codes as needed for headers, Tune in LTFT with MAF/VE close to 0.
DO NOT- copy high octain timing table to the low timing table.
That should be a good start.
Most of the times the tuner will tell the customer what they are doing or what should be done.
From the listed mods it should be a very basic tune. There is a bunch of table's that should be changed to get the most out of drivability/throttle response ect but I doubt the local tuner will hit most of them.
If SCT is used you'll pay an extra charge for a tuner you don't need. HPT would be the choice in your situation.
Get rid of CAGS, set fan lower,delete TM,Adjust idle area for 102 intake, delete codes as needed for headers, Tune in LTFT with MAF/VE close to 0.
DO NOT- copy high octain timing table to the low timing table.
That should be a good start.
Most of the times the tuner will tell the customer what they are doing or what should be done.
04-02-2012, 08:27 PM
#6
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
I want to make sure were are talking the same thing here. ECT is electronic controlled throttle, or are you refering to engine coolant tempature?
Yes 192 is the minimum unless you have a custom OS loaded into the ECM which is very rare and expensive using HPT for just a bolt on car, most dont worry about that until they get into the wild setups.
Only other way to command the fans sooner is to use one of the new PWM over ried switches that have came out recently, even then you have to be carefull as from what has been said if you run the rans at 100% for too long it will melt the connected to the fans.
Yes 192 is the minimum unless you have a custom OS loaded into the ECM which is very rare and expensive using HPT for just a bolt on car, most dont worry about that until they get into the wild setups.
Only other way to command the fans sooner is to use one of the new PWM over ried switches that have came out recently, even then you have to be carefull as from what has been said if you run the rans at 100% for too long it will melt the connected to the fans.
04-02-2012, 08:31 PM
#7
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
The 05 C6 is an E-40 computer. Only 05 had that computer.
From the listed mods it should be a very basic tune. There is a bunch of table's that should be changed to get the most out of drivability/throttle response ect but I doubt the local tuner will hit most of them.
If SCT is used you'll pay an extra charge for a tuner you don't need. HPT would be the choice in your situation.
Get rid of CAGS, set fan lower,delete TM,Adjust idle area for 102 intake, delete codes as needed for headers, Tune in LTFT with MAF/VE close to 0.
DO NOT- copy high octain timing table to the low timing table.
That should be a good start.
Most of the times the tuner will tell the customer what they are doing or what should be done.
From the listed mods it should be a very basic tune. There is a bunch of table's that should be changed to get the most out of drivability/throttle response ect but I doubt the local tuner will hit most of them.
If SCT is used you'll pay an extra charge for a tuner you don't need. HPT would be the choice in your situation.
Get rid of CAGS, set fan lower,delete TM,Adjust idle area for 102 intake, delete codes as needed for headers, Tune in LTFT with MAF/VE close to 0.
DO NOT- copy high octain timing table to the low timing table.
That should be a good start.
Most of the times the tuner will tell the customer what they are doing or what should be done.
Do you also adjust the IAT retard tables?
Is there any way to directly manipulate the relationship between throttle pedal position and actual throttle angle?
04-02-2012, 11:25 PM
#8
Safety Car
Yes there is a table called Area Opening Rate, though on the Vette it is already set to 100% from the factory. It opens as fast as you depress the throttle on the Vette. Some other GM cars though it is tapered in how the TB opens in relation to the pedal input.
04-03-2012, 06:51 AM
#9
Former Vendor
Member Since: Aug 2011
Location: Tampa Fl
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St. Jude Donor '12
Corvette Camaro GTO Trans Am Modification tuner in Tampa
on the first page of the www.TampaTuning.com website, it addresses most of your questions. When I tune a car, I enjoy talking to the vehicle owner and explain what changes Im making and why.
Phil
Phil
04-07-2012, 08:35 AM
#10
Heel & Toe
Member Since: Mar 2012
Location: cincinnati ohio
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in my vette, i can press the throttle a little and the engine doesnt respond. is there any way to adjust that? its a real pain when taking off from a stop or trying to shift gears smoothly.
