thats were the stops

 

i ran the 1/4 with abs fuse pulled no difference in time

 

Your brakes have nothing to do with your qtr mile time, especially if you have AH off. Only two things will apply your brakes, AH and you. ABS will not apply your brakes, it just stops your tires from locking up.

 

Your brake system is the interface with AH.

 

I'm a believer in "Statistical Process Control". Basically, what that says is that to understand what the results are from changes, you have to make changes one step at a time under controlled conditions and measure before and after results.

Like I said, I believe his module does something, I just don't know how it can be proven to relate directly to the TM settings. I've seen strange things happen on the drag strip in "Competitive" mode that did not happen when I turned it completely off.

I've also outrun Z51 cars when I had everything turned off, and they had AH & TC turned on. And these are friends of mine who will tell you that I flat drove away from - not beat them on a launch or shift. Their cars were Z51 and mine F55, otherwise identical cars.

 

is your gear ratio the same as the z51

 

No, I have the "slower" F55 ratios.


NOTE TO PARTICIPANTS OF THIS THREAD...

I first want to say that I appreciate the fact this thread has remained civil. I like playing the devils advocate, but I do think there has been very good information on this thread. I don't dispute that TM does have some presence, and that Carteks module may have some effect - regardless of how it does it.

But most of all, I want to ask an important question. What the hell are we doing debating this on a Saturday night? What a pathethic bunch of car junkies we are

 

 

i dont no what model is slower or faster. i guess it depends on a lot of facters, options, weight of driver, miles or even a computer glitch when tm was programed in the ecm at the factory

 

 

Yes, and? Your starter button is your interface with the car. Your tires interface with TC.

What is this explaining?

By interface do you imply the brakes and AH speak different software language. Or do you mean you operate the AH system by applying the brakes? Possibility, but then your accelerator would also be your interface with AH.

I am thinking you guys now are just implying TM uses the same sensors as the ABS system. That I agree with, among other sensors like the accelerator pedal and the ECU or PCM whatever we call it in this car.

I read an tech info page that actually stated the accelerator position is also used in some TM systems.

I thought you fellows were trying to say the C6 reduced torque by applying the brakes during WOT. That is impossible, so that is why I was confused.

 

It is a good thread. Sort of a brainstorming thread. I like the fact the subject is being looked at from so many angles.

I even understand the ABS connection a little, I think.

Maybe I do, now I am not sure again.

 

i certianly hope a car with the following mods. would run better than stock.

Kook’s 1 ¾” headers, high flow cats, 3.90 gears, HD output shaft, 160 thermostat, line lock kit, 17” ET Streets and TA wheels.

the gears are gonna have the greatest impact on the 60' foot times.

how can one prove the existance of TM by saying that a car with these mods and a TM elimination module runs better than stock and therefore it MUST be the TM module that made it so.

if the 'module' sits in-line it would be very simple, and you software engineers know this, to 'trick' the cars computer into thinking everything was just normal. if your box is inline and an input comes in that would normally be out of range, for the ecm, your box simply reformats the information, sends it to the ecm, then takes the ecm output adds too it and then sends it on it's way to the rest of the system.

now, let's back to figuring this darn thing out.

 

Rob are you serious? their is not one car in the 1/4 mile performance challenge, that can come close to there time or 60 ft. and if you research a little most the guys have some type of sticky tire 373 390 410 gears. and how does a line loc give you a better et or 60 ft. and we are forgeting the fact he did it a year before anyone else.

 

lets get a poll how many guys would love to just have those mods and run close to there time. i know i would. sure would have saved a lot of money

 

how many other cars in the 1/4 mile challange have the same types of mods, not just one or two of the mods but at least all of them the same ??

17" tires are gonna improve your times.

a line-loc will improve your times.

3.90 gears, gonna improve times.

just those three are gonna make a big difference, but now add the others and a 'box' that no one knows what it does, and imo, so-be-it, it's his invention and should be his own secret, i'm just saying, who knows what it does, for all we know it could bypass the ecm and be it's own aftermarket inline ecm.

but knowing this doesn't help us figure out TM.

how does a modded car with a tweaked computer provide insight into the workings of TM ?

i can go into the computer and adjust timing, injector pulse width, etc. and make a difference in the performance but that doesn't prove or disprove tm.

heck, we don't even have an agree upon definition of what TM is, much less how it works.

we gotta agree upon something before we can try to figure it out. even if it's wrong. if it's wrong we should be able to conclude that from analysis. if something we agree upon turns out to be wrong and we can prove it then we would try another definition and try again. and keep going until we figure the darn thing out.

 

Dennis, one of the most troubling aspects of this entire "debate" is that I keep asking the same question that nobody has an meaningfull answer to. If its so simple to make such a big difference, then why aren't people having the TM tuned out of their cars?

Please don't tell me it's to save their drivetrain. We have plenty of people adding cams, headwork, blowers etc. Certainly that has to be harder on the drivetrain as deactivating TM.

Which brings me to another question. It TM is limiting the output of the engine to horsepower and torque values set up in the tables, then how are those folks getting more horsepower out of their modded engines?

 

i, for one, wouldn't mind. the 3.90 gears are gonna help 1/4 mile and not hurt top end too much. and some of the others, yes, not bad. i'd probably add a cam, do some head work, clean up the intake, and a couple others tweaks, but otherwise, yes i wouldn't mind.

 

is the computer being reprogrammed at all, after these mods.

someone mentioned that the TM system used inputs and values from numerous tables. if that's the case, then it may be possible that the other edits change the threshold for tm.

would only be valid if the computer is not edited.

 

because no one can really take it all the way out but they seemed to have mastered it.and lots of the people i have seen run 17 inch wheels and 18 inch and they don't have those sixty ft times. and i never seen a line lock make a car faster just heating tires easier and no roll out at the line