Dano523

Just keep in mind that if you are tuning for pump E-85, you really don't know that percentage of E your really getting in the fuel instead.

Hence you need to run a Ethanol sensor, and it will clip the timing as needed when the pump E85 you get is not really 85% instead.

As for a meth kit, you running a mix of 50/50, and the meth 50 percent is used to push you over the top of the octane rating you are tuning for as a safety margin, and the 50 water is being used to cool the pressurized air so you don't end up with a time retard from the engine sucking in hot air isntead.


Bluntly, race E85/high octane race fuel is a thing of beauty, since you have a fixed octane rating they you can push the timing for as a constant. With pump E85, it all over the map in regards to Ethanol percentages isntead. Plus keep in mind that you burn about 15% more E85 than standard Petro, so basic cruising now cost a bit more as well isntead.

Bluevet2006

If you take off your supercharger let me know how much you want for it. Thanks

Pitufina

Will do. Thanks.

chpmnsws6

And pray you don't have water contamination

Joe_G

I totally understand your position Pitufina.

When my heads/cam C5 got stolen I swore I was going too keep my car headers only, mid 11's and enjoy it.

Of course, I didn't, I put in a big cam and heads and FAST and raced the heck out of it.

Which is great, but after breaking a rear end and having my transmission rebuilt three times... I realized the cold hard truth that our c6's are very reliable as a mid 11 car, but when you add enough power to put them in the 10's, they are no longer reliable. A c6Z drivetrain IS reliable at the mid-high 10 level so that is another option for you.

Which means I haven't been to the track in a long time - I get 1.4 60 foots and run 11.8's... but one of these times launching at 5500 rpm I'm going to break something and I'm tired of paying for repairs.

Plus, my car with measley 475 rwhp is still usable on street tires. I think 500 rwhp is about the limit for street tires.

A long winded answer to say I understand where you are at, and if I was you I'd be very inclined to de-mod the car so you can actually enjoy it more and not worry about breaking it or getting banned from the track for not having a cage and parachute.

BTW I went to the track with a buddy with his new C7Z 8 speed over the weekend...OMG has GM come a long way with traction control. With street tires, 30 psi right off the highway, he was cutting 1.7 60 foots and not spinning a tire at all. Try that with a c6.. lol with traction control on it's a 2.5 60 foot.

Mike's LS3

Some very good points! One way to de-mod is to pulley up to bring down some boost. With less boost you might be able to add timing. Remove meth, if your climate is not to warm and target around 550 rwhp. This will help traction, but not resolve it. 550 rwhp is plenty of power without stretching the limits of reliability. It's the 600 plus range when we start to stretch the limits. Some get away with it and others pay the price.

NormWild

You ARE making the assumption that nothing breaks on high hp NA builds, seems to me that failures are just as likely in both scenarios. I know plenty of people with NA that are always breaking stuff.
I am also still a bit confused on what you consider additional maintenance, I top my meth off every month and change my SC oil every 7K miles. Other than that I don't do jack, **** I'm still running my original belt after 40K miles

I don't monitor anything either, always thought I should, but by the time you run it out of fuel, its too late anyway. Plus the last thing I want to be doing on a 3rd gear WOT pull is staring at an A/F gauge.

My plan is to run, enjoy it, when it goes, just swap out to a forged SB and keep it the same.

Pitufina

Was wondering when you were going to post. I respect your opinion and suggestions since you are very experienced in this platform and especially in drag racing.

You seem to understand very well my dilemma of run faster at the track, not have traction on the street, complicated systems, spend more money in the process for safety and possibly break more parts As well or stay around 475-500rwhp, not really need to spend on safety equipment, more traction and fun on the street, simple set up, and less chances to break parts.

If I do in fact remove the sc, I'm going to install a vararam, heads or gears, and possibly port the oem intake. I do feel that gears would be the most fun and can help compliment the cam with the higher powerband. The current cam was spec'd for the blower and driveability in mind which I love.

Btw, I saw the videos you posted on your YouTube channel Those z06s are a 10 sec car straight from factory.

Joe_G

^^^ Thank you for your kind words!

Check out my friend Jordan's build from a few years ago. This car was solid at this performance level and nearly as quick as you, though not as fast. My point is, you won't be losing very much by going back N/A if you hone your craft driving the car. Your heads are great, I'd leave them alone. Justin had good results with a BER ported intake as you'll see. Vararam has the best performance but frankly, in your car, you might try using the stock air cleaner and prop the shroud open, let me know if you need a link or search for toggle bolt ram air (use all thread and bolts and washers like HOXXOH instead of toggle bolts).

Your car has a 6060 trans and better rear so it's more reliable than my t56 and c5 rear.

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...1-48-60ft.html

For enjoyment, you'll like 4.10 gears and the COW Booster more than the blower. People will castigate me for this comment but try it and report back.

Here is my thread on mods with some good dyno sheets and discussions on gears:

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...ast-heads.html

Here is my thread on the Booster explaining what I like about it.

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...-buck-mod.html

BTW I'm so impressed with the new c7 and c7Z... those cars, with street tires, put the power down like a GTR. It's amazing how well traction control has come in the new cars, no spinning, just squat and go. Our cars are turning 2.5 60 foots with traction control on.

My buddy's car will go faster, we're chasing some gremlins - shows the value of scanning at the track vs. just doing a dyno tune.

Heres a thread where we are discussing it if you're interested.

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...trip-pass.html

Pitufina

Hmmm. That's another option, but with me being me and since I'm more of a drag racer, a supercharged set up that runs the same Or barely faster than a n/a car with bolt on is just a waste of money in my book. On the other hand you are right that having better traction on the street may be just more fun. I'll keep that option in mind.

I never said that n/a cars don't break but there are less chances for it to happen. The powerbands are drastically different and the odds of breaking will always go to the sc ride or the one with the most power. You have the sc unit that can break, the idlers, the belt, the methanol system. Some parts are under a lot more stress on a daily basis on a sc car.

Additional maintenance no matter how you paint it IS additional. Normally you don't have to worry about it with an n/a engine. SC oil, belt inspection or replacement and methanol purchase and refills. I still have the same belt that came with the kit, but that doesn't mean that you don't need to inspect it regularly as well since they are under a lot more stress that a regular drive belt. It sucks to be broke down on the side on the road due to a belt. Methanol lasts me quite a while and yet I wouldn't just assume that everything is fine with the system at all times. Methanol is a very dangerous liquid and I feel that is not a system that it's "fire and forget" because a leak into the engine bay can be catastrophic.

I wish I could think like you. I also appreciate your input because it brings another point of view to the table.

NormWild

ignorance is bliss I'm sure you are like most of us and don't DD this thing, so for me it makes it easier to not care if it breaks, and it will eventually break. You just have to plan for it. I believe you have to be happy with a good solid 600 whp set up. When you start pushing the limits at 700+ it becomes a reliability nightmare. I've just never understood all the monitoring and data logging, all that does is make it easier to figure out WHY it broke, LOL. A good tune will shut everything down if you run out of fuel or meth. Every year I throw it on the dyno and make sure everything is still according to plan.

Your needs are also important, if you are going to auto-X or bracket race, N/A is obviously the way to go. When I was going to stay N/A the plan was Trick Flow/AFR, cam, FAST, 550ish whp, and is solid set up for an LS2. Your scenario is easier because you are starting with better heads. By the time I was done I was creeping into supercharger $$ anyway. Plus I didn't like being stuck at a certain hp level if I got me a$$ handed to me by a mustang, lol.

It seems the resounding theme with FI is most failures are fuel related. It's been proven pretty regularly that low effort FI setups 8-10 psi can live a pretty long time with good fueling. It also seems that N/A failures are more commonly valve train related.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

schpenxel

Y'all don't DD supercharged Corvettes? What is wrong with you?

K I guess there's a difference between "have" to DD if it's your only car vs. "can" DD it if you want

NormWild

It always reminds me of when I turned my DD CJ7 into a hardcore trail riding/rock crawling rig. The stress of sitting 6 miles from the trailhead Sunday night with coyotes screaming 100 yards away trying to weld a driveshaft together so I can get to work at 8AM the next day was AWESOME! If I HAD to DD this thing I probably wouldn't own it.

That's always the way though, if you don't give a **** about it and don't need it, it never breaks!!

Pitufina

I was DD the heck out of it until I bought my wife a new car and now I DD her old truck.

No plans are set in stone yet and it would depend on how much grief I get at the track from the tech officials. I can hardly do WOT runs on the street so my option is always the track (drag race).

Joe_G

Don't forget you can jam on the brakes on the last 60 feet and scrub 5 or even 10 mph off quickly and not affect your ET to get around the 135 rule if you're getting close on a hail mary run in October or April when the weather is great - your track is at 550 real elevation so it's pretty much impossible to set a "internet record" in STL. MIR, ATCO and SAC or the other track in SF are at sea level and get the same cold weather with dry, high baro conditions. STL gets some perfect record setting weather but the track is never open then, unlike MIR and ATCO and SAC.

Have you broken anything with your current setup? With your 6060 trans and your rear, your car is going to be pretty reliable I'd think.

I think what's bothering you is that your car is pretty much useless on the street. What tires are you using on the street?

I'd suggest you try some Nitto DR's for street use, they will be a lot better than street tires and still allow you to drive in the rain. They won't be that good at the track, but you still have your M/T's for that use.

Mark my words here. If you de-mod your car and make it slower, you're not going to be happy. Just like I was when I went from a H/C c5 running low 11's into a stock c6 running high 12's.

Pitufina

I hear you man, but what fun would that be to let off early?

Luckily I haven't broke anything yet. The oem clutch started slipping under hard launches with the m/t, so I replaced it with an RXT which I love.

I think you are right in which I don't have any fun with a car that just slips and slides until 3rd gear. I use bridgestones pole position which are leaps and bounds better than the oem run flats. I get slightly better traction in 2nd gear when the temps are warm.

The bridgestones are fairly new and have maybe 5k miles. I appreciate your suggestion, but to be honest, I hate to use drag radials on the street since they're always throwing rocks in the wheel wells. Pretty annoying if you ask me, plus they nick the paint on the process too. I had Nittos Drs on my first 5.0 fox body and just couldn't keep them on.

That's my only concern that what if I regret removing and selling the sc? I did the same thing years ago with my 04 mustang gt with a novi 2k. True, that car was somewhat slow even with the sc. It was a high 11s car, but today my vette even with exhaust and tune only would murder it.

I'm going to have to sit on this and rethink it over and over again.

Joe_G

My wife tells me I always try to find a solution to everything. I think it's a virtue, she, not so much.

You do know you can put c6 Z06 rear fender flares on your car and they will prevent ANY rock chips... and more importantly, zero rubber from doing burnouts. Plus, I think they look good and they are cheap.

By the way I don't get rocks thrown around by my Mickey Thompsons... FWIW.

Here they are in an old video of mine. I think I did a thread on it way back when like 9 years ago, as I recall I used a screw on the top and bottom and double faced tape in the middle. I know I saw the roll of double faced tape in my toolbox the other day and wondered why I had it, now I remember. lol

5knives

This is an interesting dilemma. The C6, much like any car, loses a certain level of refinement once you mod beyond a certain point. I remember when I went from stock to cam/headers. I won't lie, on the drive home from picking it up I had a little bit of regret. It was nasty sounding and fast. But it no longer had the sophistication GM built into it. Believe me I understand the anxiety of worrying about whether every noise you hear is your motor on the verge of complete self destruction. If the car will be able to take you on a long trip without something going wrong. It can be exhausting and completely take the fun out of driving it. I have long since modded beyond even that and have learned to live with it. Of course now that it is no longer a DD, it's more enjoyable when I take it out.

I have 2 suggestions, neither of which are very profound but it's honest advice from someone who's been there with other builds.

Option 1. - Learn to live with it. It's possible you're just in a bit of a slump and/or burnt out with the extra perceived maintenance. Perhaps some time off from driving the car or even try a friend's slower less powerful C6 if you have that opportunity. Put your car's power back into perspective. I don't think you'll be happy if you demod. You'll miss that power as soon as you mash the peddle. I don't think lower boost/power will make you happy either. Do you really want to run slower at the track with a S/C C6? You already said the NA builds are nipping at your heels. So again, give your neuroticism a break and try and enjoy the car as is.

Option 2 - This probably won't be a popular one. Sell the car. It sounds like the C6 may not be the car for you. You've pushed the car passed the point where it can efficiently put the power down. You want WOT traction in all gears but that is not going to happen at your power level on street tires. It may be time to look at other cars that can achieve that or close to it, from the factory. C7Z, GTR, AMGs, etc. This is of course a considerable expense.

Regret is a powerful force. You're already feeling some of it. But piece of mind is just as powerful. Which one will win out if you demod/sell?

Pitufina

Wow! You are right on point. I've been through those exchanges in my head and what you say makes a lot if sense.
Funny you mentioned the GTR because a couple of weeks ago I went to TX2k and two of my friends own GTRs. Putting the power to the ground at all times and feel the power 100% is nothing but amazing. Shoot, one of those GTRs puts about 600awd and it felt insane. My vette easily compares but once it gains traction in 3rd gear.

I won't be spending money any time soon on another car for sure. So I'm going to stick to the vette and focus on getting better traction on the street.

Thank you for your input and suggestions.

Suns_PSD

The traction thing is interesting. I only have 500 rwhp, but I also have 345 R888s in the rear, and traction is quite the issue. When it's cool outside anything below 40-50 mph is hopeless. even in the heat of the summer hooking up under 30 mph doesn't really happen.

I often wonder what the LS7 guys do with 650+ rwhp. Is there gearing just so long that they can hook much better?

That said, I'm close to pulling the trigger on 4.10s so the car pulls harder from 90 on up, not that I need that much. It just seems dumb to have a car that is stock geared to drive 245 mph, a speed which it will obviously never obtain.