Is it really that hard to change oil pump?
06-18-2017, 11:17 AM
#1
Is it really that hard to change oil pump?
Hello Everyone,
I have a 2008 vette base with the wet sump. I am having a cam installed by a local performance shop. But since I live in Australia, nobody knows much about working on vettes. Anyway, the cam kit I got from the US included everything including the high pressure melling oil pump. I talked to the shop owner and he says the sump has to be removed to change the pump? I checked on this forum and previous threads said people have changed it without touching the sump and others by lowering the sump a small amount. What are the chances of damaging the sump gasket and/or pinching the pickup tube o ring? Is it really that difficult to do it this way? How many people would remove the sump to do it this way? I'm obviously trying to get out of unnecessary labor costs, if the risk of damaging either the pan gasket or the o ring is not that great? Thanks, Brian
I have a 2008 vette base with the wet sump. I am having a cam installed by a local performance shop. But since I live in Australia, nobody knows much about working on vettes. Anyway, the cam kit I got from the US included everything including the high pressure melling oil pump. I talked to the shop owner and he says the sump has to be removed to change the pump? I checked on this forum and previous threads said people have changed it without touching the sump and others by lowering the sump a small amount. What are the chances of damaging the sump gasket and/or pinching the pickup tube o ring? Is it really that difficult to do it this way? How many people would remove the sump to do it this way? I'm obviously trying to get out of unnecessary labor costs, if the risk of damaging either the pan gasket or the o ring is not that great? Thanks, Brian
06-18-2017, 12:11 PM
#2
Safety Car
you DO NOT repeat DO NOT have to drop the sump, it can/has been done with just the timing cover off, if they can't see how you picked the wrong shop. send me your email and I will send you a pictorial of a camswap including the pump change. and a Melling M295 would have been just fine for a new pump
The following 4 users liked this post by CMY SIX:
06-18-2017, 02:15 PM
#3
Drifting
Ya, no need to remove the oil pan. You will need to put some silicon on the lower corners of the timing cover where it seals to the block and oil pan cover. When replacing the oil pump if the pump is rotated into the the pickup tube snout you won't pinch the O ring. Just make sure it seats all the way. If you can find the "blue" colored O ring it's the thickest and seals really well. As CMY say's I would replace the factory pump with the Melling since your in there.
Hardest part of the job is moving the rack and r&r the balancer. Since CMY is sending the procedure, I won't go into it.
You should also replace your valve springs when installing an aftermarket cam along with (at least) 5/16" chrome molly push rods. Depending on the cam "size" the stock size (7.4) may still work if the cam is not too big and the heads haven't been shaved. But always be safe and check the length.
It's also a good habit to degree the cam (to make sure correct profile). Lot's of people don't with LS engines and get away with it though.
Good Luck!
Hardest part of the job is moving the rack and r&r the balancer. Since CMY is sending the procedure, I won't go into it.
You should also replace your valve springs when installing an aftermarket cam along with (at least) 5/16" chrome molly push rods. Depending on the cam "size" the stock size (7.4) may still work if the cam is not too big and the heads haven't been shaved. But always be safe and check the length.
It's also a good habit to degree the cam (to make sure correct profile). Lot's of people don't with LS engines and get away with it though.
Good Luck!
The following users liked this post:
rajahhindi (06-19-2017)
06-18-2017, 09:56 PM
#4
Safety Car
Ya, no need to remove the oil pan. You will need to put some silicon on the lower corners of the timing cover where it seals to the block and oil pan cover. When replacing the oil pump if the pump is rotated into the the pickup tube snout you won't pinch the O ring. Just make sure it seats all the way. If you can find the "blue" colored O ring it's the thickest and seals really well. As CMY say's I would replace the factory pump with the Melling since your in there.
Hardest part of the job is moving the rack and r&r the balancer. Since CMY is sending the procedure, I won't go into it.
You should also replace your valve springs when installing an aftermarket cam along with (at least) 5/16" chrome molly push rods. Depending on the cam "size" the stock size (7.4) may still work if the cam is not too big and the heads haven't been shaved. But always be safe and check the length.
It's also a good habit to degree the cam (to make sure correct profile). Lot's of people don't with LS engines and get away with it though.
Good Luck!
Hardest part of the job is moving the rack and r&r the balancer. Since CMY is sending the procedure, I won't go into it.
You should also replace your valve springs when installing an aftermarket cam along with (at least) 5/16" chrome molly push rods. Depending on the cam "size" the stock size (7.4) may still work if the cam is not too big and the heads haven't been shaved. But always be safe and check the length.
It's also a good habit to degree the cam (to make sure correct profile). Lot's of people don't with LS engines and get away with it though.
Good Luck!
Last edited by CMY SIX; 06-18-2017 at 10:01 PM.
06-19-2017, 01:00 AM
#5
Hello Everyone,
I have a 2008 vette base with the wet sump. I am having a cam installed by a local performance shop. But since I live in Australia, nobody knows much about working on vettes. Anyway, the cam kit I got from the US included everything including the high pressure melling oil pump. I talked to the shop owner and he says the sump has to be removed to change the pump? I checked on this forum and previous threads said people have changed it without touching the sump and others by lowering the sump a small amount. What are the chances of damaging the sump gasket and/or pinching the pickup tube o ring? Is it really that difficult to do it this way? How many people would remove the sump to do it this way? I'm obviously trying to get out of unnecessary labor costs, if the risk of damaging either the pan gasket or the o ring is not that great? Thanks, Brian
I have a 2008 vette base with the wet sump. I am having a cam installed by a local performance shop. But since I live in Australia, nobody knows much about working on vettes. Anyway, the cam kit I got from the US included everything including the high pressure melling oil pump. I talked to the shop owner and he says the sump has to be removed to change the pump? I checked on this forum and previous threads said people have changed it without touching the sump and others by lowering the sump a small amount. What are the chances of damaging the sump gasket and/or pinching the pickup tube o ring? Is it really that difficult to do it this way? How many people would remove the sump to do it this way? I'm obviously trying to get out of unnecessary labor costs, if the risk of damaging either the pan gasket or the o ring is not that great? Thanks, Brian
BTW: There's a special procedure for installing the Melling pump (if that's what you have) using three feeler gauges. I think I posted photos of that too. Let me know if you have any questions or need help, pictures, etc.
BTW: Which kit did you get and what components are included?
06-19-2017, 09:45 AM
#6
you DO NOT repeat DO NOT have to drop the sump, it can/has been done with just the timing cover off, if they can't see how you picked the wrong shop. send me your email and I will send you a pictorial of a camswap including the pump change. and a Melling M295 would have been just fine for a new pump
06-19-2017, 09:59 AM
#7
Brian, check the Magnuson thread that I posted some details of my cam change on. As stated already, you don't need to touch the oil pan, just use a little silicone in the corners to seal the timing cover against the block and oil pan where those two join when you're putting it back together. You won't damage the sump gasket unless you're really careless.
BTW: There's a special procedure for installing the Melling pump (if that's what you have) using three feeler gauges. I think I posted photos of that too. Let me know if you have any questions or need help, pictures, etc.
BTW: Which kit did you get and what components are included?
BTW: There's a special procedure for installing the Melling pump (if that's what you have) using three feeler gauges. I think I posted photos of that too. Let me know if you have any questions or need help, pictures, etc.
BTW: Which kit did you get and what components are included?
I almost pmed you about the oil pump, but for some reason,
I did not think you changed your pump. I will go back through
your SC thread. The cam kit I got is from Shane Hinds/Fap. It is a proven stock stall cam with great driveability, nice lope and
makes good power. Shane tunes remotely so I bought hp tuners pro
and a wideband, so he can tune it for me. He posted up a dyno run 2 days ago of a chev ss, ie Australia's Commodore that is exported to the US. It had long tubes, cold air and the same cam. Made 450/414 rwhp/torque on a mustang dyno. yeah, I know dynos are all different. The kit Shane puts together includes everything including springs, push rods, chain, sprockets, oil pump, gaskets and trunion upgrage kit. The cam is from Cam Motion. I'm pretty excited about it. Now I have to read up on how to flash his e-mail tune with Hp tuners. Then starts the real study of learning the basics of tuning.
06-19-2017, 10:32 AM
#8
You have to pull the Melling pump apart to install it correctly. I'll find the Melling video that schpenxel posted up somewhere showing how it's done. That made life much easier for me. It's nothing to fret over. Just take your time. Here's a picture of mine when going on my car:
Last edited by CI GS; 06-19-2017 at 10:33 AM.
06-19-2017, 10:53 AM
#9
You have to pull the Melling pump apart to install it correctly. I'll find the Melling video that schpenxel posted up somewhere showing how it's done. That made life much easier for me. It's nothing to fret over. Just take your time. Here's a picture of mine when going on my car:
06-19-2017, 10:54 AM
#10
You have to pull the Melling pump apart to install it correctly. I'll find the Melling video that schpenxel posted up somewhere showing how it's done. That made life much easier for me. It's nothing to fret over. Just take your time. Here's a picture of mine when going on my car:
06-19-2017, 11:14 AM
#11
Safety Car
I used red Loctite on mine and I also had the ARP bolt lock plate but the one thing I forgot was too bend the tabs over before I closed it up, the stock bolts are barely torqued, I got mine really tight by hand and don't think there will EVER be a problem.
06-19-2017, 02:49 PM
#12
Yes. Cleaned the holes out first with a Q-tip soaked in acetone and then blow dried them with compressed air. Ditto for the oil pump and pickup bolts. I think I used blue locative on the oil pump and pickup tube bolts. actually.
I'm a bit paranoid about bolts coming loose inside an engine.
I'm a bit paranoid about bolts coming loose inside an engine.
06-19-2017, 03:00 PM
#13
BTW: the easiest way to work on everything up front is to put the car up on jackstands or the lowest setting on a lift, so that the nose of the car is about waist high, so that you can lean over the front of the car with the hood off. Then take everything out the front, including the AC core (it's easy to recharge your AC later). Once you got all of that crap out of the way, then you can tackle the steering rack.
Here's how it did mine - twice:
Take the rack bolts out and disconnect the links from the spindles, take off the PS lines from the head of the rack, disconnect the steering wheel shaft - MAKE SURE THAT THE SHAFT DOESNT GET TURNED AROUND AFTER YOU PULL THE RACK OUT- and then slide the rack over slightly to the passenger side and rotate the "head" of the steering rack so that you can get it over far enough to lift the drivers side steering link upwards as high as it can go. To do this operation, I first took some big cable ties and tied all the hoses and wire harnesses together to keep them out of the way from hooking up on the rack when you're pulling it out. Once you have it over far enough to lift the end link up all the way, then you can haul the whole damn thing out the top of the car by carefully pulling it over the drivers side fender.
That worked great for me. By the second time around, I had it down pat.
With that rack and everything else out of the way, working on the cam, oil pump, etc., was a pleasure, compared to the last time I did it, hanging upside down like a bat in my truck.
Not sure how it works on your right hand drive Vette though...
Look at all the space:
Here's how it did mine - twice:
Take the rack bolts out and disconnect the links from the spindles, take off the PS lines from the head of the rack, disconnect the steering wheel shaft - MAKE SURE THAT THE SHAFT DOESNT GET TURNED AROUND AFTER YOU PULL THE RACK OUT- and then slide the rack over slightly to the passenger side and rotate the "head" of the steering rack so that you can get it over far enough to lift the drivers side steering link upwards as high as it can go. To do this operation, I first took some big cable ties and tied all the hoses and wire harnesses together to keep them out of the way from hooking up on the rack when you're pulling it out. Once you have it over far enough to lift the end link up all the way, then you can haul the whole damn thing out the top of the car by carefully pulling it over the drivers side fender.
That worked great for me. By the second time around, I had it down pat.
With that rack and everything else out of the way, working on the cam, oil pump, etc., was a pleasure, compared to the last time I did it, hanging upside down like a bat in my truck.
Not sure how it works on your right hand drive Vette though...
Look at all the space:
Last edited by CI GS; 06-19-2017 at 03:08 PM.
06-19-2017, 05:35 PM
#14
Le Mans Master
you DO NOT repeat DO NOT have to drop the sump, it can/has been done with just the timing cover off, if they can't see how you picked the wrong shop. send me your email and I will send you a pictorial of a camswap including the pump change. and a Melling M295 would have been just fine for a new pump
06-20-2017, 10:45 PM
#15
BTW: the easiest way to work on everything up front is to put the car up on jackstands or the lowest setting on a lift, so that the nose of the car is about waist high, so that you can lean over the front of the car with the hood off. Then take everything out the front, including the AC core (it's easy to recharge your AC later). Once you got all of that crap out of the way, then you can tackle the steering rack.
Here's how it did mine - twice:
Take the rack bolts out and disconnect the links from the spindles, take off the PS lines from the head of the rack, disconnect the steering wheel shaft - MAKE SURE THAT THE SHAFT DOESNT GET TURNED AROUND AFTER YOU PULL THE RACK OUT- and then slide the rack over slightly to the passenger side and rotate the "head" of the steering rack so that you can get it over far enough to lift the drivers side steering link upwards as high as it can go. To do this operation, I first took some big cable ties and tied all the hoses and wire harnesses together to keep them out of the way from hooking up on the rack when you're pulling it out. Once you have it over far enough to lift the end link up all the way, then you can haul the whole damn thing out the top of the car by carefully pulling it over the drivers side fender.
That worked great for me. By the second time around, I had it down pat.
With that rack and everything else out of the way, working on the cam, oil pump, etc., was a pleasure, compared to the last time I did it, hanging upside down like a bat in my truck.
Not sure how it works on your right hand drive Vette though...
Look at all the space:
Here's how it did mine - twice:
Take the rack bolts out and disconnect the links from the spindles, take off the PS lines from the head of the rack, disconnect the steering wheel shaft - MAKE SURE THAT THE SHAFT DOESNT GET TURNED AROUND AFTER YOU PULL THE RACK OUT- and then slide the rack over slightly to the passenger side and rotate the "head" of the steering rack so that you can get it over far enough to lift the drivers side steering link upwards as high as it can go. To do this operation, I first took some big cable ties and tied all the hoses and wire harnesses together to keep them out of the way from hooking up on the rack when you're pulling it out. Once you have it over far enough to lift the end link up all the way, then you can haul the whole damn thing out the top of the car by carefully pulling it over the drivers side fender.
That worked great for me. By the second time around, I had it down pat.
With that rack and everything else out of the way, working on the cam, oil pump, etc., was a pleasure, compared to the last time I did it, hanging upside down like a bat in my truck.
Not sure how it works on your right hand drive Vette though...
Look at all the space:
10-02-2018, 10:16 AM
#17
1st Gear
Member Since: Oct 2018
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you DO NOT repeat DO NOT have to drop the sump, it can/has been done with just the timing cover off, if they can't see how you picked the wrong shop. send me your email and I will send you a pictorial of a camswap including the pump change. and a Melling M295 would have been just fine for a new pump
10-03-2018, 02:09 PM
#18
Advanced
Member Since: Mar 2017
Location: West Palm beach Florida
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Would the Melling M295 be the same pump to put in a 2012 Grand Sport M6 with dry sump? I emailed Melling and they replied they don't sell a "dry sump" oil pump for that year and LS3? I find that hard to believe since I see people referencing it all the time.
I just don't like to order the wrong parts
I just don't like to order the wrong parts
06-09-2019, 08:20 AM
#20
