Owenco

In need of cam choice feedback, and recommended shops in the Phoenix area or within 6hrs or so...I have always done the work on my car myself, but the apt complex I moved into wont allow me to do any modifications to my car here. So I'm kind of stuck with having a shop to do my install. I don't think I can finish the job overnight before anyone sees me and don't want to get fined. My car is a 2007 z51 m6 Corvette with a full factory z06 exhaust(manifolds back), Vararam, ported stock intake manifold, 3.90's, and a tune. My goals have always been a streetable car with its factory potentials realized as it should have been from the factory, without being too extreme. I don't do any type of racing and mostly drive like a grandpa, but feel the factory cam lacks the personality of the car. Seems like more of a torque/truck cam and doesnt compliment the 3.90's. I obviously would need to pass Arizona OBD style emissions and would love to retain street manners/reliability/gasMPG,ect... After researching the "forum experts" I think I am deciding to go with the comp cams XER273HR 224/230 .581 .588 114, lunati 1pc pushrods, lunati gold dual valve srings .660 max lift, c5R timing chain, new oil pump, arp stud. Does anyone else have any other suggestions on my cam choice? Most importantly, does anybody know of a reasonable/reputable shop that I can trust to do the install? I am located in the Phoenix area and don't mind driving 6hrs or so for the right place. Or better yet, anybody have a nice air conditioned garage with a lift and cam install experience?!?! Anyone's help and feedback would be much appreciated.

Jfryjfry

Turbo6TA

Owenco ...

Here is a set of Comp Cam lobes that have the same duration, but a slightly higher lift that what you posted above.

These XFI lobes are the latest design from Comp Cams for the LSx engines ... this would be my choice



You can order a cam from Hinson Super Cars with whatever lobes, LSA and ICL you want on the website below. Looks like the cam alone will cost you $366.85

https://www.hinsonsupercars.com/p-59...t-package.aspx

If you select a 114 LSA ... an ICL of 112 will get you 2 degrees advance on the cam ... Personally, I would get the cam with a 115 LSA and a 113 ICL (better street manners and slightly more idle vacuum)

old motorhead

Spend $45 and have Pat G. spec you a cam. He's been there, done that, and takes your whole car (not just the engine) into account before making a recommendation. He normally gets Cam Motion to build his cams. Some of the smoothest, quietest cam lobes around. I'm not much of a Comp Cams fan. Their XFI lobes have been around for a while.

Wallacefl

Turbo6TA

Ragtop 99

Going less than 220 on the intake will result in disappointment, especially when the OP stated the stock cam feels truck like and does not match his 3.90s. His original thought of 224/230 114 with a degree or two of advance would do fine. That cam on a 115 LSA with 2 degrees advance would be completely tame at idle and not cause a huge hit to MPG but the top end would pull through the 3.90s very nicely.

A cam like a 218/230 114 would have been something to consider if he had the stock LS2 exhaust manifold and wanted a snappy low end.

Owenco

I don't know enough about cam variations effect on the nature of the ls2 and their reaction to my somewhat minor flow enhancing modifications. I do know that the stock cam is VERY linear with max power around 5900rpm. I am not against the fat low end torque of the stock cam for street-ability, but I am willing to sacrifice some torque since for one, there is so much of it, and two, the 3.90's magnify it. Now what I've lost in gearing(5mph per gear) I would hope to gain with a cam, raising the power band by 300-400rpm. I would still like to keep my rev-limiter no more than 6700 to preserve my bottom end and supporting valve-train. I know it would take away some of the low rpm lugging capability used in nutty hypermiling street driving, but that's ok with me as long as the car isn't bucking and surging. Nothing extreme. I've always wanted the car to perform as I believe it should have from the factory. I wouldn't want someone to get in my car, drive it, and instantly tell that it's been modified. Kind of keeping it a sleeper, so to speak. That's why I just installed the NPP system for the mufflers, and kept everything as close to factory as possible. Obviously reliability and overall stress on internal components is very important as well. I don't suppose anyone really knows where to draw that line, since its probably negligible. But I'm not the guy that points at the biggest cam or the highest PSI blower pulley. I'm hoping to be between 420-430rwhp, with no other future mods besides MAYBE a fast 102. Obviously coil-overs, bigger brakes, and other handling mods. Thank you everyone so far on their feedback. BTW I got a quote for a cam+supporting mods install for 950$labor and 550$ tune. Waiting on a quote from Cunningham(though they only install their own cams/components) and will be contacting a couple other shops. Back in Ohio, Id be tearing it apart myself right now. I don't like other people working on my car being as particular as I am. I am sure some of you can understand that.

old motorhead

Don't buy a cam with secret specs either. If you don't like it for whatever reason, you don't know which way to go....unless you get advice from the same vendor for a different secret cam that they just happen to sell. Usually at a premium over what you can get a custom cam for.

I agree with Ragtop about going with a sub 220 (or even sub 224 for that matter) intake cam. Total waste of time and money. I ran a 219/231 115lsa cam and liked it. It had a blower on top giving 9psi of help filling the cylinders though. Without a blower, you just need a bigger cam than that. Keep the overlap below 0 and you'll have a very well behaved setup. Especially with 3.90's in the back. The 224/230 115 that Ragtop mentioned, + whatever advance it takes to get the DCR correct, would check in at -3 degrees of overlap. That would give up very little down low, scream up top, and be a total pussycat on the street.

myredhead1

Owenco

On Brian Tooley's website he has the same cam I originally chose(XER273HR, 224/230 114LSA) except his is listed with 114+2LSA...Would he have ground in the extra 2DEG? No other vendor including Comp Cams themselves have it listed with the +2 LSA. Maybe I should give him a call? Based on your suggestion the extra 2DEG is what I would want, right? I'm not the most cam savvy, so maybe this is an easy explanation. Thanks!

jaybee924

Brain Tooley puts out good stuff. The 224/230 114 LSA cam from him is -1.00 degrees overlap so it should drive very good with stockish manners. But I would call Brain Tooley or do the Pat G recommendation for cam.

Owenco

So he takes the factory shelf Comp Cam(XER273HR) and customized it to sell on his store? Here is the link. Same Comp Cams stock# and everything. No other website has that cam listed with the +2. I guess I should call him tomorrow to see what up and maybe get a suggestion. I "THINK" this is the cam I want...haha. If my confidence is still wavering, I'll get in touch with Pat G. Thanks

https://www.briantooleyracing.com/co...54-444-68.html

jaybee924

The +2 (112) is the intake centerline. You can call Brian Tooley racing and let them know what you want or expect out of the cam and they can lead you in the right direction. Or you can fill out their custom camshaft spec sheet also.
https://www.briantooleyracing.com/br...eet-37804.html

I would give them a call I'm not cam guru by any means.

Ragtop 99

+2 is the intake center line. It does not change the LSA. The LSA is key in determining overlap. Once you have the duration and LSA, the overlap is set. Next is to consider whether you want advance or retard. Changing the advance changes the intake valve close, which has a big impact on the start and finish of the powerband. Most people add some advance (between +2 to +4) to try to keep the bottom end from feeling mushy. Not advancing the cam can will make it a little stronger at 6000 rpm and above. I'd put 2 degrees of advance in that cam and it will pull strong to about 6500 given you have Z06 manifolds and still drive ok at 1200 rpm on the highway.

HOXXOH

Regarding your original request, regardless of what cam you use, send me a PM or email for a local Phoenix recommendation of a place to do your own work and can get help as needed.

BTW, here's one other thing to consider when specing a cam. In the future, you would get more power and better street manners by swapping to LS3 heads and manifold for about the same money, than a FAST manifold with your LS2 heads. However, you will need to tell whoever specs the cam, that you plan LS3 heads as a future mod, so they know the valve clearance concerns without having to flycut the pistons.

Owenco

PM sent, thanks!

mcm95403

Hi Owen,
I recently bought almost a twin of your C6 - 07 Z51 MN6, but with 3.42's. It already had long tubes with 3" catted x-pipe and I replaced the insanely loud B&B Bullets with Z06 NPP mufflers. It was supercharged but I didn't like the blower and removed it, replacing it with an MSD Atomic intake (ported by Tony Mamo), Vararam, and had ECS do a mail-order tune. I've been looking at the exact same cam for all the reasons you state. The only reason I was looking at some of the low-lift versions of the same type of cam is reduced valvetrain stress since I drive 30K+ miles a year and don't want to have to get new valve springs installed every couple of years. The cam we're looking at is similar to the C5 LS6 cam, but with a little more duration and a little less LSA. It looks like it would certainly do well for either of us since our goals are similar. That said, you should REALLY look into either getting the stock heads ported or getting aftermarket heads. Tony Mamo has some great new heads available for a couple of grand and would be a huge step in helping you get more power out of less cam (improved airflow and cylinder filling) - hopefully that makes sense.

Also, LSA - lobe separation angle - is (as was posted earlier) the physical difference between the centerline of the lobes. It partially affects the overlap period when both valves are open at the same time (along with lobe shape) - meaning the intake valve is starting to open as the exhaust valve in closing. The +2 degrees you saw refers to the INSTALLED centerline. You can only determine this by "center lining" the cam at the time of install. Basically, you need a dial gauge and a large wheel (degree wheel) that bolts to the nose of the crank. Using the dial gauge to see when the lifter for #1 cylinder is at what position, you can then determine the installed centerline. This varies from engine to engine due to production tolerances, chain slack/wear, etc. You can't assume that all-new parts are automatically "correct". The usual rule of thumb is that a street car won't see a difference between +- 1 degree (probably not even 2), and for a normally driven street car I'd call that good enough - HOWEVER, we're Corvette guys "Good enough" usually isn't.

It's a lot of work to change the cam and NOT change the heads since you still have to change the valve springs. I would bet that in a good shop it's not much more time to change the heads at that point than to just change the springs as that's a tedious job. The head change could easily net you as much power as the cam change with no cost in drivability. It's a little more expensive, but I really think it's well worth it. You should talk to Tony Mamo about a set of heads and an MSD intake - especially with your 3.90 gears and wanting more top end. He'll probably have a different cam choice for you though.

https://www.mamomotorsports.com/

PS: An underdrive crank pulley would help too. The stock pulleys aren't made well so while you're in there doing the cam, do the underdrive pulley and pick up another 10 or so HP to the wheels.

quadracr

Lots of good info on here. If it were me I would take the advice to get a custom grind with your end game in mind. Yeah it might not work perfectly at first because the supporting mods aren't in place yet, but in the end it will. Also HOXXOH has a ton of good info. He and I had a few good conversations over at his place. Cordes is a well known shop over in Mesa that has worked on a couple of my buddies cars. I've not heard anything negative about them. Joe will take the time to answer any questions you have and will set you up with good service. cordesperformanceracing.com

Owenco

As an update to this thread, I have decided against my original XER273HR cam because I was informed that the XER lobes, though they provide a little more power, have aggressive lift rates that put more stress on valvetrain. Though its likely somewhat negligible, I decided to go with Brian Tooley's stage 1 223/230 .610"/.573" 115+2. This was the suggested cam after I spoke to my chosen tuner and Brian Tooley, so they both agree given my modest goals. As for installer, I am going with Cordes Performance here in the Phoenix area. Joe is the owner. He is super knowledgeable and has been great in terms of information. Its not very often that someone wins over my confidence when it comes to trusting them with my car. Hopefully the attention to detail comes out as anticipated. In terms of reasonability, he is over 1500$ less than AHS, which is substantial. Cunningham never returned my email with a quote, but they also informed me that they only install their in-house cams, so it was off the table anyways. I am scheduled for my install on August 8th, which includes a preliminary dyno baseline. I will certainly post my results and overall review of for anyone else that may be interested in similar goals/mods/tuners in the future. I appreciate all the incite!! Stay tuned!!