Captain Z

Anyone done 440 cubes in LS7 with longer stroke?

Worth it? How much power gained? Does it consume more oil?

Thanks.

JD

The Highlander

Not worth it...

Makes same power as the 7L.
Like the lighter weight of the rods.

ramairws6

Really?? Well for example my 441 does 680hp at the crank.....think your 427 could do that??

lane_change

The way I see it is that you are gaining 13ci which is roughly 3% increase over stock, so I would assume that you can gain roughly 3% more in power with the same mods.

600whp 427 = 618whp 440

Obviously you can make gains over a stock 427 with a built 440, but I think built to built, you are not going to see a huge improvement. At that point it just comes down to money, how much more will it cost for a built 440ci compared to a built 427ci? These are just my layman opinion on the subject, I do not build motors for a living. So unless you can make some benefit in revs, weight (torque), etc....you would just have to evaluate the cost difference and see if it's worth it to you.

ERL sells a 500ci aluminum short block...that would make a sizable difference and probably yield some crazy power increases over stock, mod to mod.

4CEFEDGTO

Unless your stock crank needs replaced, I would say it isnt worth it. Its only 13 more Cubic Inches.

0Randy@DRM

We have done a few. Like said before most need a crank anyways. You will gain some extra power in the mid range!

Randy

The Highlander

Like Randy says..

We have a 440ci doing 586 to the wheels with full P/P heads and ceramic coating everywhere and a 427 doing 591whp with just milled heads.

One does 550wtq (440) and the other one does 541wtq (427).

The one with the 440 has a bigger cam in it.

099blancoss

We go even bigger and deliver a 457 if you like No issues as long as its maintained and tuned right.

Power gains.. about 1.2 hp per cubic inch but that could jump as high as 2 hp per cid depending on how efficient your current setup is. (cam/heads)

We've picked up a little over 2hp per cubic inch on the last LS7 we stroked to a 457. I would call that unusual and lay blame on the previous build for not being all that it should have been. It was a preferred power vendor on tech that did the original setup for this guy and in their typical fashion delivered a sub-par engine. The customer was not happy with it called us and we took care of him. Not only was this engine cammed wrong ( by a vendor who is know for their cams, it was honed wrong as well and the engine burnt oil all the time, same vendor with the supposed best cams).

SO your power gains are subjective.. but we will gain as much as you possibly can given your application

BADZ

My brother's ride: 440ci:

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/texas-...32rwhp-na.html


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVrmd...layer_embedded

The Highlander

Very nice....

HNK

Well my 440 with a decent cam and massaged heads and fast intake did 586 rwhp and 540 tq on a dynopac and bad cats. Next day gutted the cats and noticeable difference was felt. I believe I am more at 600 plus than under. Will see how the KB cf112 alongside the nw102 will add to that.

MPM IV

I have a 440 and love it, but I went fom 346. For me it would not be worth it to change from 427. If you can figure out the intake to support it I'd look at the ERL 500ci lsx or something similar with an RHS block.

I opted to spray for more power.

099blancoss

The tall decks bring their own issues and costs to deal with but.

Here is a very modest effort:

The blue is after our upgrade to the cubic inches and a much much smaller cam without touching the heads.

The cam in this engine is a 236 duration, the customer said he would not be reving it past 6000 rpms so it was a conservative cam. 10* more and it would have been over 600 hp.

The red is a built forged 427 by one of our competitors. All we did was add 30 cubic inches and put in a smaller cam ( but proper) than what it had (252/252) and use the same heads. ( It was what we could do within the customers budget, we would have gone with different heads if that was an option).

0Myhardtop

Man, you are ALL over the place.

What is really your overall goal? Once you figure that out then go from there.

I asked because I see you asking about many different scenarios and I would hate to see you go down the wrong/more expensive path for no reason. I'm asking because I personally know you...cool?

Just ask your tuner to perform a leakdown test on your car seeing what condition your motor is in, and if all goes well, then simply worked the heads(more compression), get bigger injectors, E85 then add a little 75 or perhaps a 100HP shot to get your feet wet and enjoy.

Thanks,
Carlos

OregonC6

It always amazes me why people mod engines like this. It's expensive and has got to be done right. Even if it is done right by good people the chances of it breaking are always present.

If you break it you buy it as the sign in the china shop reads.

So, you have no warranty. So you are self insuring against loss unless the builder will warranty the engine. The long and the short of it is that for all this money, time, and RISK you could probably more than afford a new ZR-1.

I may be missing something but I think a new ZR-1 would have more power, status, performance AND a warranty!

I guess it must be the challenge of doing this kind of mod that drives people to do it....to have something different.

I'd be willing to skip the challenge, skip the "different" , and "settle" for a little ole ZR-1.

099blancoss

Well its kind of subjective. Whats the cost of the new ZR1 compared to spending say 10-15k on what you already have? There are definitely options to weight out for sure but to say that the engine has a greater chance of breaking is not accurate. Not at all.

If your hammering the crap out of your engine I would much rather have a forged engine with better rods, rod bolts, lifters, pushrods, rockers, valve springs, etc than the factory stuff.

I agree the ZR1 is a beast but $100,000 is a far stretch from 10-15,000

600+ rwhp is actually more than you can use on the streets but if you need more than that we can deliver and if you want by going the FI route. The engine would be 17,000. The FI systems maybe 10k call it 15 to be on the safe side.. Thats 32,000 and I'll make more power than that ZR1 by a couple hundred ponies. Factory HP is more expensive. They have unions to pay Dont get me wrong the ZR1 is an awesome car.

kumar75150

You will get more power out of a bigger bore than the stroke if you have the heads/intake to support it.

099blancoss

Well they actually fought this out with a 454 and the stroker made a little more power than the all bore did but it was close enough to call it the same. Erik will tell you cubic inches are cubic inches, but as you said you need a head to support it.

dfinke23

PM Sent

obzidian

CI is CI but I would first look into the heads/valvetrain/intake first when looking for power... assuming that the bottom end is up the the challenge.