BgBoost1

I have used both the REV Replacement 1pc SS Valve and the one from Ferrea. I have to admit that the Ferrea Valves look a little better in person (Cosmetic wise), but I use more of the Rev Valves as I have heard that they are both made in the same factory in Argentina, and the Rev Valves are considerably cheaper. I have seen both at 10-15K miles and they wear almost exactly the same.

If $$ is no object I would go with the Katech Ti Exhaust Valve. I have yet to work with a set of them, but everything Katech puts out is always top notch! I would only assume that these would be the same!

Like others are telling you please find a reputable head shop with experience replacing guides on LS7 heads and have them do the work for you. Installing the guides, the valve job, quality of the guides and the final honing process are all very important. You will not want to try and save any money on this process. Pay WCCH, LPE or someone highly capable to do a good job so you will sleep well at night!

RedZ4me

Wow !! again?..... really ??

'06 Quicksilver Z06

Higher than what it should be.

When you have a hole in your block, and you're loooking at a $17k repair, due to one of them failing, who cares?

Again, should one of them result in you having a windowed engine block, what does it matter?

All that really need be known, is that they have a long record of failure in these cars.

That alone is enough for many to discard them.

toxin440

That's what I had done -- I paid a visit to LG Motorsports in North Dallas and had them do a wiggle test on my 08 Z06 - 23K miles.

They came back and told me "i'm good - recommend a re-check in 10 to 20K miles" For 275 they did the wiggle test on a few valves... little pricey for just that little bit of work, but I know they are a top tier shop, and it's worth the extra bit to me knowing if LG thinks they are good, then I know they are good.

If LG looked at my valves and says I'm good, I'm quite a bit more confident driving it. Warranty expires in 2 months. I would REALLY love to get a basic head/port/valve job... sadly I don't have the tools or experience to do the labor myself. And more importantly I don't have the extra cash sitting around at the moment. If anyone wants to drop $3k in my coffee cup haha that would be super

Mark2009

The typical low information response, intended to promote fear instead of understanding. Translated, it says: "Do what you're told and don't ask questions (because we don't have any answers)".

Mark2009

You were just asked to describe just how long that record of failure was (failure rate) and you refused to provide an answer... but you instead repeat the same claim. Don't you know the answer? If not, why do you keep making the claim?

'06 Quicksilver Z06

When looking at this situation, one has to weigh advantages and disadvantages of the stock valves, vs the solid stemmed stainless valves typically used in their place.

Many, when going about it this way, many, when considering sticking with the stock exhaust valves, determine that the disadvantages of them out weigh any potential practical advantages which they may offer.

Some of the quickest and fastest C6 Z06s on this board, run the "heavier than stock" solid stainless exhaust valve.

So there has not been any practical performance penalty. And their durability in this application has been stellar.

So before anyone hollers "lighter valve train", well that may be true, but at what cost? So one has a "lighter valve train" with the stock stuff. So what?

The "cost", is being still eligible for a seat at the broken exhaust valve table. Where there seems to always be room for one more, and where no one who has ever simply insisted on sitting there, has been turned away.

The original poster's question was:

We're telling him, solid stemmed stainless, whatever brands the top cylinder head shops discussed on this forum recommend, have used, and have had success with. And we're telling him why.

The guy just got his car, and doesn't want to be next on the dropped stock OEM exhaust valve list, a list which continues to grow, just as fast as it ever has, and I, for one, don't blame him.

Why some of you guys get so upset, when someone says, "No, I will not be next", is interesting.

Sage advice.

Mark2009

No, you're not.

He's being told by solid stainless advocates that the OEM valves are 2 piece, implying -- with no facts -- that is bad. He is not being told that their is no evidence that the valves are breaking because of that.

He's being told by solid stainless advocates that the solid stainless valves are 1 piece, implying -- with no facts -- that is better. He is not being told that their is no evidence that a 1 piece valve would not also break if subjected to the same conditions as the OEM valve.

He's being told by solid stainless advocates that the OEM valves are hollow, implying -- with no facts -- that is bad. He is not being told that their is no evidence that the valves are breaking because of that.

He's being told by solid stainless advocates -- with no facts -- that the OEM valves have a high failure rate. He is not being told that this rate is about 15-20 valves out of about 240,000 valves in use (LS7 only).

He's not being told by solid stainless advocates that the most likely reason the valves are failing is due to extremely worn exhaust guides.

He's not being told by solid stainless advocates to check his guide wear to see if he even has a problem.

He's not being told by solid stainless advocates that a very respected shop advises the OEM valves are fine as long as the guides are checked.

So, the only things he is being told by solid stainless advocates are things to convince him to join their club; things that are not supported by any logical assemblage of facts, other than 'some OEM valves break but we don't know -- or care -- why'. Anything that may exonerate the OEM valve is withheld. Such biased, one-sided, and unsubstantiated proselytizing is simply not right, so that's where I come in

'06 Quicksilver Z06

You know, I just don't understand, why some of you guys, especially you guys still in warranty, get so upset, downright nasty even, when a fellow forum member makes an attempt to extricate himself from the "Dropped Stock Exhaust Valve Derby", and the expense which goes along with it. A "derby" which has resulted in much financial hardship for way too many members of this forum. Especially those whose cars might not be paid for, because they financed them.

Having to replace a motor, for these people, could result in them having to sell the car as a "roller" altogether.

But some of you guys, simply do not care about that.

It would seem, that you would be glad, that someone else was joining you in protecting themselves against calamity.

You have a warranty. They don't. Your *** is covered. Their's isn't.

They're doing the best that they can to protect themselves. You, need do nothing.

You'd rather argue, instead of helping show them, how they need not continue to be at such a big risk.

But I guess arguing, in an attempt to prove that your position is "right" is more important than any satisfaction you would get out of knowing that you won't be reading about someone else suffering a valve failure.

You don't care about these people in here Mark, and the risk they are under and exposed to. Seriously, we both know it. You could not care less about them. You are in warranty. And you don't track your car. In fact, your car, you say, has never seen redline. You care about only one thing and one thing only. Arguing. That's it. You don't care about these people, and the hard decisions they are faced with. You simply love to argue. For you, this is a game. A game where you have nothing at stake. Because you are in warranty.

Aside from your arguing, where are your contributions to this forum? Where are your technical write-ups, your pictures, what have you contributed?

Well, I'm done arguing with you. I'm going to do my best, to help this membership when it comes to this matter. And that means pointing them in the right direction, when it comes to minimizing their risk and exposure to the LS7 valve train issue.

Seriously, you got pissed, when myself and others, scoffed at "the tool" and that geometry exercise..

Now, apparently no longer able to argue that position, I don't hear you talking much about the measuring block to evaluate "geometry", no, now, you are advocating some "wiggle test".

A "test" that most GM dealers have likely never heard of, and the ones who have, probably cannot perform it with any degree of accuracy or repeatability.

Nobody, planning on driving hard, tracking, or looking at this over the long haul, is going to put any faith in any "wiggle test" at "Mr Goodwrench", which may or may not be performed correctly". Nobody using their car in this manner, is going to "bet" that the good results of their "wiggle test", are going to save them from a mishap. And well they shouldn't.

Hard decisions have to be made when it comes to actually protecting yourself in this matter. Some will make those hard decisions. Others, many of whom are not at any risk whatsoever, like yourself, because exactly like you, their cars never have, and perhaps never will see redline, and are in warranty, will continue to argue.

BgBoost1

...............I like Turtles.

Bill Dearborn

The situation is that nobody really knows why the valves fail. It could be the guides, it could be the valves, it could be a combination of both. We don't know. What we do know is at this point people who have had their heads redone with bronze guides and stainless valves haven't had a failure yet (whether there was a geometry issue with any of those heads is unknown). We also know the few people who have followed Katech's advice to use bronze guides and stock valves haven't had any failures to date. We do not know if you just changed to solid stainless valves your worry's would go away since there haven't been any reports of people taking a head with good guides and installing new solid stainless valves. We do know some stock engines go many thousands of miles without dropping a valve.

Here is what makes sense: Check the valve guides first because you may not need to do anything (that will cost you ~ $1K at a dealership). If the guides are bad and GM doesn't pick up the cost of repair then choose from the following: 1) Do the guides and go with solid stainless or; 2) Do the guides and go with stock. The one gets rid of both suspected sources of the problem, the second assumes the guides are the issue and since the same types of valves were used successfully in the LS6 and are going to be used in the new LT1 that they aren't a concern since GM doesn't seem to have any worries about them going into the future.

You pay your dues and you take your chances.

Bill

Michael_D

I do not have warranty. That went out the window the moment I tuned the car. I had a VERY REPUTABLE cylinder head guru CNC cut and hand port my OEM heads. He also addressed out of spec guides and seats. He uses OEM valves - all of them, on all but the most extreme race engines. Last time I was BS'ing with him, he had 8 sets of LS7 heads on the shelf, waiting surgery. They were all going to his customers, for RACE applications. And yes, they were all getting those ****** OEM valves.

I have had numerous conversations with a project manager for GM Racing Powertrains and Special Projects. The topic was our darling LS7. They use a bunch of them. Guess what, they use OEM valves. Now do you really think a corporate RACE TEAM would use a component that is known to fail??

If you REALLY did want to help this membership, you would give them factual information without the drama.

The only relevant fact that you have provided, is two engine failures where they had rebuilt heads and OEM exh valves. That piece of information is quite valuable, but it is also incomplete. I would like to know more about the work that was performed.

So why don't you start a sister thread to your Solid Stem exh vlv thread??? Throw it out there and find out how many are running OEM valves with REBUILT heads. Get the information from these folks to compliment your other thread....

And by the way, I'm not pissed. I do however get a bit irritated when facts are replaced with speculation. And you can believe me when I say that I can not afford a 17K engine failure. I would dearly love to know more about these valve failures - but only in the form of comprehensive and controlled failure analysis.

Les

lt1z

I use Tungsten exhaust valves. My extensive conversations with GM power train engineers led to this decision.

'06 Quicksilver Z06

I read with great interest your post below Michael_D. I'll respond to some of it's finer points.

To your parts in bold, and bold red, I'd point out that "corporate RACE TEAMS, and what they are able to do, is quite different from what the average owner and weekender struggling to make his monthly payments is able to do.

Professional corporate sponsored race teams are able to catalogue every part, and it's duty cycle, and replace everything they feel that they need to replace after 40hrs of track use. Less if they feel the need to.

They are able to completely rebuild their engines, replace parts, valves and all, and will do so, after so many duty cycles, so many hours of track use.

The average guy in here, can't do that.

Furthermore, it is said that the heavier solid stemmed stainless valve won't let the engine run up to red line as quickly as a lighter valve will.

Well, for a professional driver, who earns his living driving, and whose lap times are consistent down into the tenths, or hundredths even, where every fraction of a second counts, and can mean the difference of thousands of dollars in prize money and the difference in being able to continue to race for the remainder of that season, well that's one thing.

Besides, his engine is going to be rebuilt at a given hours of use interval, anyway.

But for the guy just looking to do a few HPDE's, and whose driving is nowhere near as consistent as a professional's is, and really could not tell you how fast his engine is spooling up, well his needs, and budget, are entirely different.

It's that guy who I'm concerned with.

Lets face it. He doesn't have the budget, nor the skills of the drivers that those on those pro race teams you reference have.

In fact, in many cases, he really shouldn't even be out there, because if he nails the wall, his insurance won't cover it, and if he blows a motor, he doesn't have the money to cover it.

It's that guy I'm concerned about.

He should go out there with some protection in the form of a stronger valve train because he cannot afford the amenities that a corporate sponsored pro race team can.

And his driving is not to the point to where solid stainless valves vs hollow stem sodium filled valves, is going to make a difference in his lap times or quarter mile times.

With regard to your part in bold, in the first post of my thread I have indeed included those which I know of who are currently running stock valves in redone heads.

I did so awhile back, when it was initially set up.

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-z...st-valves.html

Confused garage and musicmankeb
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-z...st-valves.html

FNBAD is going on when his car is done.

What I did not do in that listing, and made it a point not to do, however is list the people in here on redone heads, who stuck with the stock valves and had those valves later fail.

Scuba_steve and VRed

I didn't want to run the risk of appearing biased and showing them in a negative light, in the midst of such an overwhelming number of redone heads using solid stainless stemmed valves.

383vett

Titanium?

lt1z

No. I was joking because these threads are so ridiculous with arguing that an SS valve may be too heavy, I figured I would go all the way to the other end...

My heads have a Rev hollow stem intake and SS exhaust.

CHIWS6

wow! i was not expecting all this , lol. I guess i should take the valve covers first and do the wiggle test and go from there.

CHIWS6

btw any have any links where i can get the ss vlaves and bronze guides?

'06 Quicksilver Z06

WCCH. Google them.

West Coast Cylinder Heads. They are many of the people's choice here and elsewhere and do excellent work.