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2017 C7 Grand Sport w/Heartbeat 2300

 
Old 02-18-2019, 08:28 PM
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Default 2017 C7 Grand Sport w/Heartbeat 2300

Hey guys, I have the kit coming and wanted to know your thoughts. I'm trying to get close to 600RWHP without having to start getting into new pistons and fuel system upgrades. I understand through research that this isnt unrealistic (580-600 rwhp). The question I'm having, should I have a smaller pully ready to go to hit these target numbers? Right now as the car sits before the kit it has ARH 1 7/8 LT headers, high flow cats, and a Veraram intake.

I don't want to get married to a specific number, as dyno and weather changes, but you get what I'm looking for. I'm thinking I could order the pully and have it ready to be installed if the tuner cant get the boost I need stock.

Thoughts? Yes I know its way overkill for the street and all that, so is anything with more than 150 horsepower :P
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Old 02-19-2019, 09:26 AM
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My heartbeat came with 95mm upper pulley. This gave me around 7.5 psi with the stock engine/exhaust. Mustang dyno showed an increase of 120 rwhp (357rwhp stock to 477rwhp) , not sure how this compares to other dynos

My LT1 fuel system was not maxed out, based on lambda and HPT scan log. I bet you could probably go up to 85mm upper pulley (+3psi), but LT1 fuel components could be at their limits

Last edited by Corvette4ever; 02-19-2019 at 09:27 AM.
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Old 02-20-2019, 12:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Corvette4ever View Post
My heartbeat came with 95mm upper pulley. This gave me around 7.5 psi with the stock engine/exhaust. Mustang dyno showed an increase of 120 rwhp (357rwhp stock to 477rwhp) , not sure how this compares to other dynos

My LT1 fuel system was not maxed out, based on lambda and HPT scan log. I bet you could probably go up to 85mm upper pulley (+3psi), but LT1 fuel components could be at their limits
Thanks, not really looking to push the fuel system to the limits but I would like to get to its max safe potential with what I have. Did you use their tune? That is about what they claim for more power.
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Old 02-20-2019, 05:56 AM
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I did not use their tune. I used email tune from Patrick Guerra
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Old 02-20-2019, 12:03 PM
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Did you do the install yourself? Any tips? I was thinking about using Pat G, I sent him a p.m. but I never heard back I don't think he's around here anymore on this forum
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Old 02-20-2019, 02:31 PM
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I had a shop doing the install. It took them about 2 days. The mechanic said everything was straight forward, the difficult steps were replacing the stock crank pulley, and lifting the supercharger to install it on the engine as it requires two persons

Pat G is not much active on this forum, but he does respond to emails reasonably well (might take him a day or two sometimes)
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Old 02-21-2019, 11:15 PM
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Originally Posted by spinkick View Post
Hey guys, I have the kit coming and wanted to know your thoughts. I'm trying to get close to 600RWHP without having to start getting into new pistons and fuel system upgrades. I understand through research that this isnt unrealistic (580-600 rwhp). The question I'm having, should I have a smaller pully ready to go to hit these target numbers? Right now as the car sits before the kit it has ARH 1 7/8 LT headers, high flow cats, and a Veraram intake.

I don't want to get married to a specific number, as dyno and weather changes, but you get what I'm looking for. I'm thinking I could order the pully and have it ready to be installed if the tuner cant get the boost I need stock.

Thoughts? Yes I know its way overkill for the street and all that, so is anything with more than 150 horsepower :P
Without headers, you are going to be between 550-570whp on the LT1 running 7-8psi on the 95mm pulley. If you donít want to fix the fuel, then I would say, it is what it is as 7-8psi. Regardless, thatís where your power to the wheels will just exceed what a stock Z06 puts to the wheels...but your fuel is tapped...as I recall at that level, the hpfp is the first to go.

Last edited by hogurt; 02-21-2019 at 11:24 PM.
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Old 02-21-2019, 11:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Corvette4ever View Post
My heartbeat came with 95mm upper pulley. This gave me around 7.5 psi with the stock engine/exhaust. Mustang dyno showed an increase of 120 rwhp (357rwhp stock to 477rwhp) , not sure how this compares to other dynos

My LT1 fuel system was not maxed out, based on lambda and HPT scan log. I bet you could probably go up to 85mm upper pulley (+3psi), but LT1 fuel components could be at their limits
Those numbers are off. Do you have an automatic? Assuming yes, do you know what gear they used to run the dyno? Assuming they ran both in the same gear, letís say 5th, then the differences are valid, but the HP rating is not...and that would make sense that the number is low. Dyno numbers donít really matter (itís just a tool for tuning)...however, showing a 20-25% drivetrain loss on the dyno is clearly off.

based on the numbers I would suspect that either you are at a different elevation and numbers werenít corrected or that they ran a dyno in 4th or 5th...in both cases that would under report the power.

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Old 02-22-2019, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by hogurt View Post
Without headers, you are going to be between 550-570whp on the LT1 running 7-8psi on the 95mm pulley. If you don’t want to fix the fuel, then I would say, it is what it is as 7-8psi. Regardless, that’s where your power to the wheels will just exceed what a stock Z06 puts to the wheels...but your fuel is tapped...as I recall at that level, the hpfp is the first to go.
Always appreciate the advice. I've got Long Tube Headers, do you think I will need to pully or should it just be more efficient and around the same power levels? I dont want to hurt my baby I have been told its about 6lbs of boost with the headers. Do you think I am still tapped for fuel then? I wonder if I could get to 7 without nuking the HPFP?

How close is the Camaro to the c7 in this regard? Found a camaro post thats pretty much exactly my setup 1 7/8th headers, high flow cats etc. Only think he doesnt have is akrapovic after the high flow cats, but I doubt that is worth even mentioning:

QUOTE

"We just finished and delivered Lesbaer's beautiful Grey 16 M6 camaro.

We installed the Magnuson Heartbeat kit, along with ARH 1 7/8 coated LT headers, high flow cats and x pipe to factory NPP muffler.

We had the opportunity to dyno it stock, then with the ARH Headers and exhaust,, then with the Heartbeat on the as delivered tune, then I re-tuned it for final numbers.

Stock 418 RWHP 417 RWTQ

ARH 438 RWHP 440 RWTQ

Heartbeat and ARH 563 RWHP 544 RWTQ

Gain of 145 RWHP 127 RWTQ"

Last edited by spinkick; 02-22-2019 at 01:16 PM.
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Old 02-22-2019, 04:22 PM
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Talked to Magnuson and they said a 5 mm smaller pulley makes about 1.5 lbs more of boost. They also said that headers usually eat about 1lb of boost. They recommended running the stock pulley of course, then go from there. They wont ever recommend going down in size, probably for legal reasons if I break something or myself.

Last edited by spinkick; 02-22-2019 at 04:46 PM.
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Old 02-22-2019, 05:34 PM
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Originally Posted by spinkick View Post
Talked to Magnuson and they said a 5 mm smaller pulley makes about 1.5 lbs more of boost. They also said that headers usually eat about 1lb of boost. They recommended running the stock pulley of course, then go from there. They wont ever recommend going down in size, probably for legal reasons if I break something or myself.
This is what I expect. My LT4 Magnuson goes on next week. Their kit comes with 80mm pulley for about 12psi. I have the 75mm which just may do the trick. My set up includes 2Ē ARH with catted X-pipe. Weíll see but hoping for 12-13psi

Last edited by Habeas Corpus; 02-22-2019 at 05:48 PM.
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Old 02-22-2019, 10:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Habeas Corpus View Post
This is what I expect. My LT4 Magnuson goes on next week. Their kit comes with 80mm pulley for about 12psi. I have the 75mm which just may do the trick. My set up includes 2Ē ARH with catted X-pipe. Weíll see but hoping for 12-13psi
On my Camaro I run the 75mm pulley for 12psi, but I have headers, cam, and higher compression...with e85 I am running 776whp. *my setup is great because I can run straight pump e85 from 8-12psi with no need to make changes to my tune.

I am probably going to dial it back for the street...715whp @8psi or 745whp @10psi (maybe will stay [email protected] if I get better tires). I was over 800whp with the 70mm, but ran out of injector and time to keep tuning. The plan is to simply have a track tune in VP109 so that I can run in the 800ís with no alky...even though my Camaro is heavy, expecting a 9sec slip this summer.

The Camaro and the Corvette should have identical results with one exception. On the Camaro, I was able to upgrade the in-tank pump very easily and then with a voltage booster...it was rock solid to just over 800whp. I think the Vette needs more help on the low side.

My buddy was running his Camaro over 700whp on the stock LT1 last year, but he was using race fuel and Alky. I think to run over 700whp, you are going to need a cam because I donít see how you can get enough fuel without it. No chance I would try running the 70mm without e85 or alky injection...

Last edited by hogurt; 02-22-2019 at 10:45 PM.
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Old 02-23-2019, 02:40 AM
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Originally Posted by hogurt View Post
Those numbers are off. Do you have an automatic? Assuming yes, do you know what gear they used to run the dyno? Assuming they ran both in the same gear, letís say 5th, then the differences are valid, but the HP rating is not...and that would make sense that the number is low. Dyno numbers donít really matter (itís just a tool for tuning)...however, showing a 20-25% drivetrain loss on the dyno is clearly off.

based on the numbers I would suspect that either you are at a different elevation and numbers werenít corrected or that they ran a dyno in 4th or 5th...in both cases that would under report the power.
My car is an A8 and those numbers were on a mustang MD250 dyno that reads lower than dyno jet. They used 4th gear.

Originally Posted by spinkick View Post
Talked to Magnuson and they said a 5 mm smaller pulley makes about 1.5 lbs more of boost.
I can confirm this statement, As I was switching between 80mm & 85mm pulleys on my existing setup
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Old 02-23-2019, 11:55 AM
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[QUOTE=Corvette4ever;1598932352]My car is an A8 and those numbers were on a mustang MD250 dyno that reads lower than dyno jet. They used 4th gear.


There you go. So your numbers are useless for comparison. The 1:1 gear ratio is 6th gear. Running in 4th means your numbers are way deflated, not because of the dyno, but because of the gearing that will throw off the calculation. Itís just math because the gear ratios change the calculation.

Most commonly the dyno operators prefer running in 5th gear because in 6th, running up to 180mph is a bit scary. I think a M7 is supposed to run in 4th, so itís more likely your dyno operators just didnít know what they were doing.

As as an example, on a mustang dyno, my whp went from 735whp in 5th to 765whp in 6th. No changes....same day. Itís the difference in Hp calculation where the dyno software assumes a 1:1 gear ratio.

If you want to compare numbers you need to run in the 1:1 ratio,..otherwise your numbers are useful for tuning and comparing changes for your car only and they are very far away from representing what your car is actually running to the wheels.

Last edited by hogurt; 02-23-2019 at 11:58 AM.
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Old 02-23-2019, 03:47 PM
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I dont want to chase a number, but I'll be "happy" with 600 whp with just my headers etc. I think I'll need a pully. lol
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Old 02-23-2019, 05:11 PM
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Originally Posted by spinkick View Post
I dont want to chase a number, but I'll be "happy" with 600 whp with just my headers etc. I think I'll need a pully. lol
@spin, you should be reasonably close. I am interested in seeing how it works in terms of power. If you are running the 95mm, it will drop boost with headers, but the engine will be more efficient. I just donít know if that actually means more power at lower boost, or simply the ability to run a smaller pulley and generate the same boost. I would guess that on the 95mm, you will drop boost and maybe produce less power than a stock car running the 95mm. But you will be running 6psi vs 7psi for the stock. If you run the 90mm, you will definitely be there...except your hpfp will not be able to keep up above 575whp.

Thats when you get the big decision time:

1. With the stock config you will have more power than a Z for much lower cost. Happy?
2. Want more, upgrade fuel...but now how much more do you want because:
3. Increasing fuel, really requires a cam...
4. If you are getting in the motor, now is the time to do drop in rods and pistons.
5. Crap...you already did headers, but at this power level, cats donít last long...take them off...

welcome me to the slippery slope. 😳

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Old 02-23-2019, 05:57 PM
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Originally Posted by hogurt View Post
@spin, you should be reasonably close. I am interested in seeing how it works in terms of power. If you are running the 95mm, it will drop boost with headers, but the engine will be more efficient. I just don’t know if that actually means more power at lower boost, or simply the ability to run a smaller pulley and generate the same boost. I would guess that on the 95mm, you will drop boost and maybe produce less power than a stock car running the 95mm. But you will be running 6psi vs 7psi for the stock. If you run the 90mm, you will definitely be there...except your hpfp will not be able to keep up above 575whp.

Thats when you get the big decision time:

1. With the stock config you will have more power than a Z for much lower cost. Happy?
2. Want more, upgrade fuel...but now how much more do you want because:
3. Increasing fuel, really requires a cam...
4. If you are getting in the motor, now is the time to do drop in rods and pistons.
5. Crap...you already did headers, but at this power level, cats don’t last long...take them off...

welcome me to the slippery slope. ��
That's exactly the dilemma I face. So the big question is, do I run out of fuel first or stock pulley? If 575WHP is the safe limit for my fuel pump (Does asking this much fuel out of it actually hurt it / increase wear?)

I'm thinking the plan will be with the tuner to have the 5 mm small pulley on standby and see if we need it (or can actually use it) without other upgrades. I really dont want to get into a cam, pistons and fuel system upgrades just yet.

Last edited by spinkick; 02-23-2019 at 05:58 PM.
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Old 02-23-2019, 10:00 PM
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Originally Posted by spinkick View Post
That's exactly the dilemma I face. So the big question is, do I run out of fuel first or stock pulley? If 575WHP is the safe limit for my fuel pump (Does asking this much fuel out of it actually hurt it / increase wear?)

I'm thinking the plan will be with the tuner to have the 5 mm small pulley on standby and see if we need it (or can actually use it) without other upgrades. I really dont want to get into a cam, pistons and fuel system upgrades just yet.
I am starting another thread because I am facing the same issue with my Vette setup. I am afraid my config is going to push too much boost for the LT1 fuel system and ideally I would like to play it safe for the first round.

I thought it was much easier on my Maggie setup because the blower is so much more powerful that making changes were really much easier. As an example, on the Maggie, I could run 750whp without the blower even having to work hard. On the Lt4 blower that seems to be about all she has.
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