Shaka

I would have thought that a distinguished 5 star Seniour Member of such an exclusive club would be slightly curious as to why any dead stock C6 Vette in all it's forms forms has not been able to reach their manufactures claimed top speed by anybody outside of GM.
Apparently, you and other seniour members don't give a ......as to the real Cd of these cars and don't think it important. I can assure that the value is outside of the range that you have published.
I submit to you that it is because of GM's adherence to Corvette's design legacy. The adage that form must follow function, is not necessarily found in any marketing rule book but to a sports car enthusiast, the numbers are paramount. A top speed contest would require a C5 coupe body.
I would have thought that my posts would illicit at least some modicum of interest from Corvette guys who I had assumed were first and foremost, sports car enthusiasts, but instead, a bunch of egotistical, immature, cry baby girly men prefer personal attacks than the persuance of the truth. Quite frankly, I don't give a ...... Happy new year.

jackhall99

txsugar08

This is more BS!! Look at the license plate. Why would a test car need a Michigan license plate, arent the corvetts made in Kentucky.

jackhall99

You apparently don't know GM is based in MI and that their main proving grounds are in Milford, MI with a desert PG in Yuma, AZ.

LancePearson

I just read this thread and two or three of you, Shaka, Jack, etc., act like you are little children. How disappointing to read adults acting like five year olds. Your message is so clouded by your childishness you completely detract from the purpose of the thread.

Shame on you.

jackhall99

Don't stop here if you don't like us jabbing at each other. C'mon over to OT if ya really want to get upset.

Shaka

Thanks for the C7 information. My best friend Jack and me Shirley do appreciate it. Do you think the Cd of the C7 will be lower than the C5's Cd or will the high drag legacy design prevail?
My other buddy, who's name you failed to mention, is a very sensitive fellow, and you have hurt his feelings.

LancePearson

Nonsense. Since there is no published design for the C7 you cannot have any clue what the cd, horsepower, weight distribution, dimensions, speeds or technologies are.

Shaka

Zactly. This thread and all C7 threads are simply speculation. Why are you here? The C7 threads are for the courageous, the whimsical, the bewildered and the dreamers as well as the enlightened, the intelligent and the wise. Even you are welcome to comment. You may draw on your knowledge of Corvette's history, engineering, competition, economics, politics, etc. to entertain in any reasonable degree, with conjecture about the details that may immerge in the next Corvette.
By your comments, you will and have exposed yourself for who you are and will be judged accordingly by the distinguished members that you have already identified..

"Your message is so clouded by your childishness you completely detract from the purpose of the thread."

You may care to take a poke at this subject in this light, but unfortunately, you don't get a second chance at a first impression.

This is what the C7 will look like.

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images...wconcept.jpg/][/URL]


The stock coupe will weigh 2800lbs with 520hp and circle the Ring in 7 minutes flat with a starting price of $45 000.The Cd will be 0.25 and top speed will be 212 achieving 32 mpg HWY at 80 mph and 25 in town. It will have a 5.5 liter aluminum engine with two variable camshafts in block driving an on plane valve train weighing in at 400lbs. It will have a 7 speed sequential paddle shift xaxle. Young people will love it and so will the babes. Germans, Italians and the English, who are still pissed off for that episode in 1776, will hate it.
I invite you to dispute any of this information?

Endeka

>circle the Ring in 7 minutes flat with a starting price of $45 000

They're not going to run the base model around the ring. They'll run the halo models, so that the Japanese and Germans are embarrassed.

LancePearson

Why have a six or seven speed tranny? With all that power and high rpms, the car gets through first through third so fast it almost seems superfluous to have seven speeds, paddleshifting or otherwise. Why not some kind of continuous drive system? Dave Hill told a friend of mine that when they built the C5 anc C6 tranny they built it so bulletproof that you didn't need to even use the clutch from 1 to 2, just slam the gear and not waste the time.
At the speeds and rpms of these machines sensors and electronic controls are generally faster than humans can achieve anyway.

Isn't the manual transmission almost passe' at this level of engineering?

I keep looking here for word of the actual C7 hoping that they do something revolutionary instead of evolutionary with the C7.

C3DeedlyDee

All this talk of coefficients of drag and no one's talking about the frontal surface area? Both play a major role in calculating drag force, which is what matters in the end since that's what the C7 is going to be pushing against. Arguing about just the Cd is useless. F1 cars typically have a Cd that ranges from .7 to 1.1 (due to all the downforce aids), but they also have minimal frontal surface area which allows them (along with ample power) to still achieve 200+ mph speeds.

Shaka

Some may think that you must be realistic in this speculation, but that would be no fun. I'll leave that to the serious members. However, my suggestions are within the realm of possibility and everything I mention is already in race and some street Vettes. There is a 2 cam LS 3 somewhere in GM. Still a push rod OHV engine. Nothing wrong with that. If you have a chunk of aluminum and steel, why waist the material on all those cams and valves and things like all other manufacturers do with their crummy little V8s. Chevy can make the LS engines far cheaper, far smaller, far lighter with more HP and better gas mileage than all those other boat anchor things from Yoorope.
Stick an LS 7 into a F458 and you will improve the breed. Not only that, you can drive it to California without having to worry about getting there and get 30mpg in a faster car avoiding a gas guzzler tax.
Ferrari has no manual xmissions for 012 due to no demand for manual xmissions. The current paddle shift on a Vette belongs to a slushbox with multi epicyclic gear trains.They are heavy with lots of losses. VR trannies are not possible at the moment because of torque limitations and high losses.

This sequential xaxle in a Vette would enable you to keep the Rs around 1500 up to 60mph. It would shift continuously in rush hour at idle RPMs. When you floor it, the ECM will make optimum use of the power curve. 7 speed is good even with a wide flat torque curve. Flat torque values are only achieved artificially anyway with electronics. That is for drivablity and not economy.
It is not recommended to shift without using the clutch on any of the new manual xmissions and double clutching is forbidden. There are 3 sinco rings on 1st and 2nd and they must all line up within 3 degrees of rotation for a successful shift. All other gears have two including reverse. Double clutching will cause mis alignment and therefore a blocked shift. They are no longer made of silicon bronze. Trouble with the 'motor cycle' type gearbox like in F1 cars, you can't go from 4th to 2nd, etc. unless it is in the auto mode. Ferrari F458 tranny will learn the owners habits in the auto mode and shift accordingly and such shifts are then possible without driver input.
You can get such a tranny installed in your Vette right now for about $20gs but volume production would bring the price down to at least a T60.
Revolutionary designs are risky designs and GM answers to stock holders er make that unions. There is a production ready Caddy Cien lying around at GM. Stick some Corvette body panels on it and there you have it. As Asia grows, I can see a Caddy 16 and other Rolls Royce and Bentley challengers from GM, but the communists must be beaten at the next election for that to occur. There may be space for a mid engined Vette at that time also.
I did a feasibility study on a mid engine Vette. It would cost about $100000 to build this provo using the current chassis.
Here is a Cein chassis Vette and a C5 mid engine stock chassis Vette.

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images...idengine.jpg/][/URL]


http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/33/vettef12.jpg/][/URL]

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/51/vettef19.jpg/][/URL]

Shaka

Packaging determines frontal area. Total earo drag= A*Cd which is paramount for performance and economy. There is little one can do with A but much can be done to reduce Cd. Making the car pretty can cost you though.

LancePearson

dc electric drives are pretty uniform in applying power, quite powerful over a wide range of speeds and drive some enormous, powerful machinery at really high speeds from dead loads. Wonder if there is some way to take the gas engine, turn it into a generator to drive a set of dc motors on the four wheels and get rid of the transmission entirely?

Think revolutionary, not evolutionary?

In fact, isn't that sports car, Tesla, being made out in San Fran direct drive dc motor?

LancePearson

Even the newest QE II ship doesn't use drive shafts through the hull to drive props but, I think, they use motors on pods connected directly to the props and the whole pod turns to control direction...called Mermaids I think. The fuel driven motors are diesels to generate electricity to feed the Mermaids power. Different way to use power.....