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Old 02-14-2017, 12:19 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by patentcad View Post
I was looking from Oct and Nov., I figured the prices would start to get real with the winter approaching. And some of them did - in places like Michigan, California, etc, all far away from the NY area. I would presume that by now, two months after I bought a new car, reality may have started to permeate some of the thicker dealer and Corvette seller skulls. I mean, one can only hope. But it amazed me in the Fall that it wasn't already happening.

A firm grip on car market reality has never been a strong suit among the owners of used cars, individuals and business entities both regularly hold on too long for too much $. There is just too much stupid in the car market and there always will be, costs a lot of people a lotta dough.

Corvettes of course, are often the worst in this regard:

http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-cult...old-or-bought/

That was partly why I bought new, but even if you can find cars priced reasonably, finding the equipment, color, condition, pricing that makes sense - particularly on a stick shift car - can be very hard if you know what you want and you're not so flexible.
I started looking in January in a 50-100 mile radius in New England and you can find some good deals.

As I mentioned above some used cars often have inflated prices as the dealers are:
1. Hoping to find someone who will pay list price
2. They inflate the value of the car knowing that they will most likely need to negotiate.

Some dealers price the cars fairly and they move pretty quick, but not all do.

The more flexible you are in terms of color and options the better the deal will be if you are flexible. If you only want, say, a Laguna Blue car with a Z51 2LT package and black wheels.. Well...

Lot's of variables at play. I have done the math. I can definitely find a low mileage used C7 for $8-10K under MacMulkin/Kerbick, etc new pricing (i.e 14-15% off MSRP). It just comes down to if I am flexible on the color and options and how far I am willing to search. And if I am comfortable buying used vs new. One dealer near me has a 2014 LT3 with under $5K miles for $44495. Car looks immaculate. But it is black, and I really think I want a Z51 since I will track the car occasionally.. But if I was flexible on color and options? That car was $68K MSRP new so... Even with an extended warranty I would be saving $12K or so over the lowest price new one...

Buying cars at many dealers is a game. These guys have to make money buying and selling cars and they are very good at it. You just have to be flexible and very patient.

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Old 02-14-2017, 12:27 PM   #22
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My take is slightly different. IMO, most of the time after GM offers huge incentives and the dealers climb on with further discounts the prices never seem to get any higher in the long run. New base coupes can be picked up in $46-48k range right now.

Unless there is a serious drop in inventory prices will continue to sink. If GM makes significant changes to the C7 and includes a 30-40 hp increase it will only make used values drop further.

The only way out of this is to decrease inventory and make cars harder to find. But I doubt that would ever happen because GM is in the business of selling every car they can.
They have a months-long factory shutdown coming. I expect that will deplete inventory nicely.
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Old 02-14-2017, 12:30 PM   #23
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They have a months-long factory shutdown coming. I expect that will deplete inventory nicely.
You also have the 2018 model right around the corner though and, depending on the changes, a number of buyers might wait vs buy the "old" 2017 model.

The 2018 changes could also result in more 2014-2017 owners trading in and that means more used C7's.

I am amazed at how many used 2014-2015 models I find with under 12K miles.

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Old 02-14-2017, 12:38 PM   #24
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You also have the 2018 model right around the corner though and, depending on the changes, a number of buyers might wait vs buy the "old" 2017 model.

The 2018 changes could also result in more 2014-2017 owners trading in and that means more used C7's.

I am amazed at how many used 2014-2015 models I find with under 12K miles.
Do we even know that 2018 is bringing any changes besides the new paint shop (which won't even apply to most cars for a year or two)?
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Old 02-14-2017, 12:40 PM   #25
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Do we even know that 2018 is bringing any changes besides the new paint shop (which won't even apply to most cars for a year or two)?
There is a rumor of a 10 speed auto. Otherwise no, not yet.

And can you blame Chevy? If they already have 14K+ 2017 unsold Corvettes in inventory, they will probably wait to release news on the 2018 model so they don't impact sales.

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Old 02-14-2017, 01:48 PM   #26
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Used C7's are not overpriced *if* people are buying them, which, apparently, they are. The market decides values, not logic or some kind of mathematical formula.

The fact that there are only very slight differences between 2014 and new 2017 C7's, coupled with the fact that the early C7 years have a VERY good record for having extremely few "1st year" problems, is keeping the prices higher for the used units.

Also, for a lot of buyers, a $10k difference is an obstacle. A new Ferrari for $150k instead of $200K is a bargain, but it doesn't mean that I have $150k to spend, just because that price is 'cheap'. Similarly, just because someone feels comfortable spending $45k doesn't mean they can automatically jump to $55k, just because. For a lot of working people, there is a budget that they want to spend on a fun car, and overspending the budget reduces the enjoyment.

If the 2018 C7 has some major changes (and not just tiny nearly invisible details like the 15's, 16's and 17's had over the 14's), then we'll probably see some significant erosion in used C7 prices.

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Old 02-14-2017, 03:03 PM   #27
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first year of significant body style change typically higher resale for a few years. not only Corvettes.
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Old 02-14-2017, 03:19 PM   #28
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Congrats on planning to buy your first corvette. Options for the most part depreciate close to 100 percent so if you are planning to buy preowned don't limit yourself to a base vehicle. Pick the colors you want and try and get a z51 car if you can. You'll be glad you did and the increase in cost is minimal as a preowned car.

Jmo and have fun
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Old 02-14-2017, 04:11 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by patentcad View Post
WTF in my post makes you think I have it figured out? I'm just wondering why so many retail car dealers seem to have brain damage. Of course I was wondering that 25 years ago when I bailed on the car biz, and some of my pals who remain in that biz STILL can't figure it out.
You are right about dealers having brain damage. My local dealer has 10K market adjustment on every Corvette and 5K on every Camaro!!!!!
Unbelievable.
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Old 02-14-2017, 04:15 PM   #30
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I started looking in January in a 50-100 mile radius in New England and you can find some good deals.

As I mentioned above some used cars often have inflated prices as the dealers are:
1. Hoping to find someone who will pay list price
2. They inflate the value of the car knowing that they will most likely need to negotiate.

Some dealers price the cars fairly and they move pretty quick, but not all do.

The more flexible you are in terms of color and options the better the deal will be if you are flexible. If you only want, say, a Laguna Blue car with a Z51 2LT package and black wheels.. Well...

Lot's of variables at play. I have done the math. I can definitely find a low mileage used C7 for $8-10K under MacMulkin/Kerbick, etc new pricing (i.e 14-15% off MSRP). It just comes down to if I am flexible on the color and options and how far I am willing to search. And if I am comfortable buying used vs new. One dealer near me has a 2014 LT3 with under $5K miles for $44495. Car looks immaculate. But it is black, and I really think I want a Z51 since I will track the car occasionally.. But if I was flexible on color and options? That car was $68K MSRP new so... Even with an extended warranty I would be saving $12K or so over the lowest price new one...

Buying cars at many dealers is a game. These guys have to make money buying and selling cars and they are very good at it. You just have to be flexible and very patient.
I hope you can find a car. I think if you're patient you will. I had a trade-in which complicated the whole process. In the end I was happy with the deal I made; buying a new car the way you want it is worth something. Is it worth $15-$20K? I don't know. Maybe ONCE in my life. I was too particular about what I wanted, so it's mostly my fault, but I still can't understand all these dealers (who should know better) and what they're trying to accomplish with nosebleed asking prices on all these cars.
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Old 02-14-2017, 04:51 PM   #31
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I don't know when you were looking but I am in the New England are and am finding lots of cars out there for under $50K. Many of them low mileage and some Z51 cars and LT2 and LT3 base cars.
. . .


2LT and 3LT.


Dyslexia must run rampant amongst Corvette owners and advertisers, as this mistake is quite common.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JerriVette View Post
Congrats on planning to buy your first corvette. Options for the most part depreciate close to 100 percent so if you are planning to buy preowned don't limit yourself to a base vehicle. Pick the colors you want and try and get a z51 car if you can. You'll be glad you did and the increase in cost is minimal as a preowned car.

Jmo and have fun




With used cars, the options may increase the asking price somewhat, but nowhere near what they originally went for. I'd suggest going for, at a minimum, a 2LT Z51. It won't cost that much more... well, it's not my money!




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You are right about dealers having brain damage. My local dealer has 10K market adjustment on every Corvette and 5K on every Camaro!!!!!
Unbelievable.
That's absurd... even obscene. When the C7 first came out, we saw a lot of that crap from dealers, but with new inventory over 14K and the used C7 market pretty flush with cars, I can't imagine anyone paying those "adjustments". When I'm shopping for a vehicle and I see something like that, I make it very plain to the dealer that I will not give them my business, for a Corvette or any other vehicle I will be buying, now or ever.
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Old 02-14-2017, 04:59 PM   #32
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That's absurd... even obscene. When the C7 first came out, we saw a lot of that crap from dealers, but with new inventory over 14K and the used C7 market pretty flush with cars, I can't imagine anyone paying those "adjustments". When I'm shopping for a vehicle and I see something like that, I make it very plain to the dealer that I will not give them my business, for a Corvette or any other vehicle I will be buying, now or ever.
I can't disagree, but I've always found it odd the way consumers take umbrage @ car dealers slapping on surcharges - if you don't like it, don't buy from them. Doesn't make me angry, I just roll my eyes and go to another store. Most dealers I know are careful about doing that - they understand that there can be blowback. What's odder still is somebody talking about that in this market. My local dealer had to go under cost -$1k into the $2K holdback - to make the deal with me. So at the moment I don't think anybody is charging premiums on too many models anywhere, particularly @ Chevrolet.
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Old 02-14-2017, 06:22 PM   #33
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I can't disagree, but I've always found it odd the way consumers take umbrage @ car dealers slapping on surcharges - if you don't like it, don't buy from them. Doesn't make me angry, I just roll my eyes and go to another store. Most dealers I know are careful about doing that - they understand that there can be blowback. What's odder still is somebody talking about that in this market. My local dealer had to go under cost -$1k into the $2K holdback - to make the deal with me. So at the moment I don't think anybody is charging premiums on too many models anywhere, particularly @ Chevrolet.


Yeah, you would think in this market, charging a premium would not be possible! I was very surprised to see this.

I'm not sure I was taking umbrage per se, but I definitely reacted negatively. I shouldn't, as I believe in a free market! I just think it's wrong, but buyer beware! In one case, I told the dealer I would never purchase a vehicle from them, ever, not just a Corvette, because they were tacking on something like $15K. Their response? They asked if I would be a buyer at MSRP? Unbelievable. I just walked away, SMH. (this was a DGDG dealer)
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Old 02-14-2017, 07:02 PM   #34
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Yeah, you would think in this market, charging a premium would not be possible! I was very surprised to see this.

I'm not sure I was taking umbrage per se, but I definitely reacted negatively. I shouldn't, as I believe in a free market! I just think it's wrong, but buyer beware! In one case, I told the dealer I would never purchase a vehicle from them, ever, not just a Corvette, because they were tacking on something like $15K. Their response? They asked if I would be a buyer at MSRP? Unbelievable. I just walked away, SMH. (this was a DGDG dealer)
Go back and tell them dealers are going $1K into the friggin holdback to sell the cars all over the USA and you personally know plenty of guys like me who can attest to that. Or simply direct them to the Kerbeck website. I mean, that's kind of self-defeating in an age where you are two mouse clicks away from a price that's $10K lower. Go figure. I got $8K off list and they paid me at least $1500 more than I know my trade was worth wholesale locally. And that's @ a dealer 10 miles from my house. I just told them I didn't want to drive 200+ miles to buy a car, work with me, and so they did. Maybe I paid a little more, but in the end it was worth it, when I buy a new car, I'd rather not turn it into an epic crusade involving 500 miles of driving, etc. I would have gone that route had I not had a trade-in, but I did. We'll see next time.
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Old 02-14-2017, 07:33 PM   #35
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Why even bother trying to convince a dealer their prices are to high? Just go to other dealer with the price you like and be done with it.
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Old 02-14-2017, 08:04 PM   #36
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Go back and tell them dealers are going $1K into the friggin holdback to sell the cars all over the USA and you personally know plenty of guys like me who can attest to that. Or simply direct them to the Kerbeck website. I mean, that's kind of self-defeating in an age where you are two mouse clicks away from a price that's $10K lower. Go figure. I got $8K off list and they paid me at least $1500 more than I know my trade was worth wholesale locally. And that's @ a dealer 10 miles from my house. I just told them I didn't want to drive 200+ miles to buy a car, work with me, and so they did. Maybe I paid a little more, but in the end it was worth it, when I buy a new car, I'd rather not turn it into an epic crusade involving 500 miles of driving, etc. I would have gone that route had I not had a trade-in, but I did. We'll see next time.


I would tell them that, but I'm not buying now. This was a few years back when demand outpaced supply, and I was at the beginning of my always long journey towards purchase. New or used, it takes me forever to buy a car... not sure why!

Agreed that if you want to cut to the chase and get a good price, Kerbeck is the place to start.
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Old 02-14-2017, 08:34 PM   #37
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I've been in the market for a C6 GS for a while now and those prices are ridiculous. I can't find a decent one for under $35k. Many are still priced at $40k or higher! If some of you think C7 prices will be in mid to upper $30's, im definitely waiting too. Why would I buy a 7 year old car for just $5-10k less than a new one?
I've seen some members posting on here buying '17 base 1LT's with rebates for $48,000. No way imo that the value of a 2011 GS can only be $10k less? I know there are a ton of factors. Just venting out loud... I feel like the C6 GS should be sub $30k by now...
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Old 02-14-2017, 09:40 PM   #38
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Since you have it all figured out you should start your own used vette lot....sounds like you will have the market cornered
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Old 02-14-2017, 09:42 PM   #39
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Miles are a major factor with the Vette... deliveries started late 2013. Cars with 50K+ miles will be popping up at good prices late this year for the bargain hunters. Low mileage cars will still carry a premium.
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Old 02-14-2017, 09:48 PM   #40
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Miles are a major factor with the Vette... deliveries started late 2013. Cars with 50K+ miles will be popping up at good prices late this year for the bargain hunters. Low mileage cars will still carry a premium.
So what should I be afraid of on a C7 with 40k+ miles? Obviously the better maintenance records the easier to accept, but beyond that? I'm not looking necessarily for a pampered garage queen, because I'm gonna drive it and run it through car washes and apply liberal amounts of throttle with an inverse amount of elbow grease cleaning it perfectly.

Any common problems with 'higher' mileage?

thanks and cheers!
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