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I have it too apparently now that you shed some light on this horrific and often misunderstood illness.
One is a clown shoe that knows how to do just one thing. The other isn't so bad on the street and the track.
Both of them need a completely separate vehicle to haul stuff around for them? Now that makes a lot of practical sense.
Dodge and Chevy in the same family? I definitely need medication.
I like your choice of cars. I have heard that the new Prius works really well as a commuter car. Have a friend that has both the Prius and a Volt. We actually have a 2016 Corolla LE Eco like this one. I just don't think I have ever taken a picture of it!! Similar color to your Prius.
You might not get "ex-communicated," but it's only a matter of time before someone points out your Toyota hybrid is not a Chevy hybrid.
The issue is the car is a toyota, not so much that it isn't a second Chevrolet.
I loath toyota. The company has some very questionable business ethics and they flipped US regulators the bird when it was discovered they were cheating the US out of billions in taxes during the 1990s.
I wouldn't accept a free toyota nevermind pay $$ for one.
The debate about whether a vehicle today is "foreign" vs. "US" is now almost a meaningless concept. "Foreign" vehicles frequently have more US content than "US" cars, and more often than not are built in the US.
Hyundais and Kias are more now more US than many US cars. The industry today is truly globalized, and foreign manufacturers have created 100s of thousands of US jobs and strengthened the overall economy.
The question of U.S. vs foreign goes much deeper than just content. The Kogod Made in America Index is one way of calculating a broader measure of the impact on the U.S. economy of a vehicle. Made in America Auto Index. Frankly, even this does not go far enough. Where are the bulk of the manufacturers' Legal, HR, Finance, Engineering, Design, etc? Typically they are in the country where the auto maker is headquartered. There are a lot more than manufacturing jobs at stake.
The question of U.S. vs foreign goes much deeper than just content. The Kogod Made in America Index is one way of calculating a broader measure of the impact on the U.S. economy of a vehicle. Made in America Auto Index. Frankly, even this does not go far enough. Where are the bulk of the manufacturers' Legal, HR, Finance, Engineering, Design, etc? Typically they are in the country where the auto maker is headquartered. There are a lot more than manufacturing jobs at stake.
The question of U.S. vs foreign goes much deeper than just content. The Kogod Made in America Index is one way of calculating a broader measure of the impact on the U.S. economy of a vehicle. Made in America Auto Index. Frankly, even this does not go far enough. Where are the bulk of the manufacturers' Legal, HR, Finance, Engineering, Design, etc? Typically they are in the country where the auto maker is headquartered. There are a lot more than manufacturing jobs at stake.
There are many ways to look at this question, and our points are not competing ones. Mine were only that so-called "foreign" manufacturers make a very large net positive contribution to the US economy, and that when you're "buying US", you're also buying "foreign," and vice-versa. The link you posted proves that point well.
Many foreign models now are only produced in the US, and exported.
I have been stuck with a number of Toyota rental cars over the years and not one of them 'oozed quality' Quite the opposite, they reeked of the soulless plastic transportation appliances that they are. There are far better options in the plug in hybrid department from domestic marks. Putting my mother in law in a Ford C-Max now. Much peppier and better driving car with far better ergonomics than the Prius that she really thought she wanted.
Just for the sake of this 'your other car in the garage conversation' my daily driver is my Ford Excursion:
Decidedly NOT fuel efficient but pretty darn good for its size and capability. Sure wish GM would put the Duramax in the Suburban 2500HD. I might be persuaded to move on from this gal.
My disdain for toyota has less to do with where it is made, where the parts it's comprised of are made or its build quality than the company itself. They were one of only two auto manufacturers willing to sell trucks and other vehicles to the totalitarian regime with a stranglehold on the Burmese people. The other manufacturer is almost not even on the map, suzuki. Only after pressure from the US arm of toyota did they sell their stake in that joint venture.
As a result, it will be a long time before I consider a toyota made vehicle.
On a funny side note, I read a statistical paper on divorce and cheating which found
a majority of cheaters drive a toyota branded product, lexus.
Where are the bulk of the manufacturers' Legal, HR, Finance, Engineering, Design, etc? Typically they are in the country where the auto maker is headquartered. There are a lot more than manufacturing jobs at stake.
You nailed it.
While cars may be assembled in the U.S., the PROFITS go back to the nation of origin (Japan, Germany, etc.).
That is the problem.
Buying a foreign vehicle is not strengthening the U.S. Auto Industry.
Originally Posted by ZenicaPA
My disdain for toyota has less to do with where it is made, where the parts it's comprised of are made or its build quality than the company itself. They were one of only two auto manufacturers willing to sell trucks and other vehicles to the totalitarian regime with a stranglehold on the Burmese people. The other manufacturer is almost not even on the map, suzuki. Only after pressure from the US arm of toyota did they sell their stake in that joint venture.
As a result, it will be a long time before I consider a toyota made vehicle.
Let's not even get into all the Toyota trucks running around Afghanistan with guns mounted on them...
On a funny side note, I read a statistical paper on divorce and cheating which found
a majority of cheaters drive a toyota branded product, lexus.
Not surprising...a Lexus is for posers who think they are too good for plebian Toyotas.
Guess it's not really bipolarity - more like bookends.
Guess to be fair I should include what's in the driveway, too - Volvo XC90 Momentum+ and a Range Rover Evoque. Kind of the opposite of the Corvettes, but necessary in Central New York during the winter. Both very nice & very capable vehicles.
.
While cars may be assembled in the U.S., the PROFITS go back to the nation of origin (Japan, Germany, etc.).
That is the problem.
Buying a foreign vehicle is not strengthening the U.S. Auto Industry.
While "profits" may go back to the corporate HQ of the manufacturer home country, profit is a small percentage of the costs of each vehicle. The majority of those other costs stay in country of manufacture of either the parts or the vehicle.
Then there is the massive cost of building and maintaining a plant in the US that stays in the US. The salaries of the American workers who build the vehicles and maintain the plants stays in the US. Those workers purchase homes, cars, flatscreen TVs and pay taxes in the US. Those taxes build roads and schools in the US. There are many other ways those US-based plants also contribute to the US economy. Foreign manufacturers often incorporate their North American divisions as US companies.
Competition has also improved the US auto industry. It was foreign competition that transformed the Big 3 from builders of junk 30-40 years ago into companies now actually turning out world-class products.
Foreign manufacturers have indeed greatly strengthened the US economy and reinvigorated the US auto industry. And lastly, lest you forgot, the US manufacturers are a huge presence all over the industrialized globe and have been for decades.
The world is now a global economy. A weak economy in Europe or Asia drags down the US as well.
How many miles does it take to break even on a Prius vs. a Civic/other cheap econobox? Unless you are a VERY high miles driver, chances are you'll never recover the premium you paid by just your gas savings. If gasoline was over $10/gal as it is in Europe, the case could be much stronger.
I would think that for most buyers, it is NOT that they've run the numbers and they find can save money overall. Some just like the virtue signaling of driving a Prius -- "Hey, I'm saving the planet!" (the case for 100% of the people I know who have one). Some just see it as a contrarian choice, or a more interesting car than a Civic or Corolla and they are willing to pay more for that notoriety.
Like it or not, the car you drive says a lot about you.
Not too many miles when you are effectively paying the same price or less than you would for the Cruz, which may be the case thanks to $5600 in govt tax credits and Toyota's $3500 cash incentive. Regardless, any money you saved on the Cruz would go right out the window when the friggin car needs major repairs between 80-150K miles. That generally won't happen with a Prius, it has to be the most amazingly bulletproof car i've ever seen.
I bought a Corvette, I think it's great, but I don't RELY on the car, and I drive it 10K miles annually, not 30K.
Note to thread: owning two different Corvettes isn't bi-polar in the least. A truck and a Corvette? Perhaps. The Prius/Corvette combo is bi-polar.
As far as I'm concerned if Prius cars **** some of you off, well that's just a friggin soul-fulfilling bonus that can't be quantified in mere fiscal terms.
Last edited by Steve Garrett; 10-02-2017 at 10:04 PM.
Reason: Merged Posts
As far as I'm concerned if Prius cars **** some of you off, well that's just a friggin soul-fulfilling bonus that can't be quantified in mere fiscal terms.
Wow...I didn't think you would confess so easily.
Originally Posted by Foosh
While "profits" may go back to the corporate HQ of the manufacturer home country, profit is a small percentage of the costs of each vehicle. The majority of those other costs stay in country of manufacture of either the parts or the vehicle.
Then there is the massive cost of building and maintaining a plant in the US that stays in the US. The salaries of the American workers who build the vehicles and maintain the plants stays in the US. Those workers purchase homes, cars, flatscreen TVs and pay taxes in the US. Those taxes build roads and schools in the US. There are many other ways those US-based plants also contribute to the US economy. Foreign manufacturers often incorporate their North American divisions as US companies.
Competition has also improved the US auto industry. It was foreign competition that transformed the Big 3 from builders of junk 30-40 years ago into companies now actually turning out world-class products.
Foreign manufacturers have indeed greatly strengthened the US economy and reinvigorated the US auto industry. And lastly, lest you forgot, the US manufacturers are a huge presence all over the industrialized globe and have been for decades.
The world is now a global economy. A weak economy in Europe or Asia drags down the US as well.
Over the years, I've given my take on this issue at websites at least 10 times.
I don't have the desire to answer your post in detail.
Let's just agree to disagree here.
Originally Posted by 4thC4at60
You sound as if you're but a child - at least in a global or business sense. Toyota is an international company. It sells vehicles globally. Duh...!
And, before you or someone else gets a royal case of the a$$ - I spent 22 years in the US Navy working on five continents....
"...willing to sell trucks...."
You vegan too?
First of all, thank you for your service.
However, after reading your post and looking at your avatar...well, it did make me giggle (just a bit).
As far as I'm concerned if Prius cars **** some of you off, well that's just a friggin soul-fulfilling bonus that can't be quantified in mere fiscal terms.
That's pretty funny. Needed that on this horrific day.
I have a Ford C-Max for my wife to drive beside my 16 Vette. I see no issue with a hybrid usually - I see the new prius' license plate names it correctly. I am not a fan of any Japanese car - I have a long memory.
10-01-2017, 07:04 PM
Similar color to your Prius.
