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do a search on GM bowling green head of Quality control assurance you'll get his name. Just email him.
Will do but I'll give my local shop another opportunity to escalate it 1st. If they are not able or willing, will try to reach back to Mike Furman who we bought the car from. Mike moves a lot of Corvettes and I'd think if anyone on the planet that's at my level and would be able to reach GM Corporate it would seem to be him...
Hate to admit it but I really don't want to be "that guy" with the shop but I also want to address the root cause. It seems a touchup/repaint on the affected edges is a temporary band-aid approach.
I am not an engineer or an auto body professional but seems peculiar to me that I NEVER had any issues like this with my previous '09 C6 or any other GM product that also has similar "plastic" bumper covers...
I know Joe, but I believe a change was made to a lighter-weight type of SMC at some point during C6 production, and fully-transitioned into the C7.
During the infamous "flying roof" panel era of the C6 Z06 (it happened to my 06 Z06), panel de-bonding was blamed on the new lighter SMC material they used on the roof, and the fix was said to be going back to the previous heavier version of SMC they had been using. That's what they told me they did to my car. Whether that was a completely factual explanation or not, I do not know.
There are different types of SMC in terms of composition, and it would make sense for a lighter SMC material to have more flex.
The front fascia is made of a RIM(Reaction Injection Molded) urethane. Only the rear fenders are SMC on the C7, and I have not heard of anyone complaining of poor paint adhesion on the rear fenders. GM has also been painting "steel" cars that have urethane front fascias for many decades.
As for the 'flying roofs" on the C6 you again have it backwards. The C5 had a SMC(fiberglass filler) roof panel. For the 2005 C6, they made the painted roof panel from polycarbonate. The adhesive would not adhere properly to the polycarbonate panel, so GM had to revert back to using SMC(fiberglass filler) for the painted roof panels(which added 4 pounds of weight to the targa roof).
All C6 SMC panels used fiberglass as the filler material(except for the carbon filler front fenders on the Z06 and the front fenders and hood for the ZR1 . Beginning with the 2014 C7, they went to using a hi-density hollow glass sphere filer instead of using fiberglass filler, and for 2016 they went to a lo-desnity hollow glass sphere filler material.
Yes, there are different formulations for SMC panels(resin with either chopped fiberglass, chopped carbon fiber or hi-density or lo-density hollow glass spheres as fillers). But that has nothing to do with the material that the front fascia is made of.
Looking at the photos, it appears that the paint was not scratched, but has wrinkled on the front fascia indicating poor paint adhesion.
Regardless of the technical minutiae, the main point is that there has been an adhesion issue, which is what I said all along. Most old plant cars have been fine, but there are too many which haven't. I'm told the new plant process will address that, and only time will tell. While it's too early to know for sure, I'm aware of no reports of this on the new cars.
It's already clear to me I won't ever have the problem on my new plant 18. I've very closely examined all edges, and they are as evenly and beautifully finished as the rest of the car.
I don't think "pathetic" is quite the right term. I think they've tried hard to improve the paint process since moving to the use of SMC panels for weight-savings reasons.
SMC panels are one of the main reasons that the C7 is still the least expensive, light-weight, near-super, sports car in the world. Everything else has gotten fatter and fatter, and/or almost every other sports car with similar performance is at least 2X the price.
No matter how hard BG tried, I think it took building an entirely new paint facility, a totally new process, and new tooling, including new state-of-the-art robots, to address this and other paint issues. It's not like they didn't try to address it in the old facility.
There's a video floating around this forum where a BG plant executive explains the advantages of the new facility and process. Among the enhancements in the new plant and process is a new capability (more sophisticated robots) to spray panels at all angles, all the nooks, crannies, and edges, to produce better overall coverage and smoothness. It also includes a much longer and lower heat curing process also to help with smoothness and better paint adherence.
I'm sure each individually-painted panel in the old plant came out of paint covered, but poor paint adherence on the edges of some panels led to the chipping seen on some cars relatively soon after assembly. I doubt cars left the factory with visible edge chipping, but with uneven coverage and adherence issues, it didn't take long for it to appear either at dealerships or shortly after customer delivery. The flexible nature of SMC material is also a factor, and why you don't see things like edge chipping on metal-body cars. Ensuring paint adherence is easier on metal.
I have not seen this issue reported on any of the cars that came out of the new plant since it started operations in November.
making mistakes is ok sometimes, what is more important is how you react to the mistakes.
GM sucks *** and continues to **** on their customers. When my $100k car officially does not get repaired correctly, this will be my last GM vehicle after owning several.
happens all the time, happened to my 2014 and my 2017. I left it alone because I know someone who got it repaired under warranty and the car looked terrible after
Well, I guess my main point is that they reacted to long-standing complaints about Corvette paint finishes by spending $300-400M on a new paint facility, which just opened in November.
I agree it's a shame that some people have had problems getting their problems addressed in a satisfactory manner.
making mistakes is ok sometimes, what is more important is how you react to the mistakes.
GM sucks *** and continues to **** on their customers. When my $100k car officially does not get repaired correctly, this will be my last GM vehicle after owning several.
I agree, GM let a machining process get out of control(at one of their suppliers) for the entire run of the C6 Z06 and did absolutely nothing about it(there is a class action law suit against GM for the valve dropping LS7 crap).
It appears that GM has had a running process out of control problem with their painting. I don't recall a problem with the painting process for the C5 or C6, like we are seeing with the C7. After five years, it should be fixed, but like the valve problem with the LS7, it appears it isn't.
Joe, you can't say it hasn't been fixed at this point. The process of cars painted up until July 2017 and since November 2017 is entirely different. Early reviews of the new process have been very positive.
The process didn't change in LS7 production, and that was inexcusable. I lost an LS7 too, so I can completely relate to that. However, the paint process is now night and day different.
Joe, you can't say it hasn't been fixed at this point. The process of cars painted up until July 2017 and since November 2017 is entirely different. Early reviews of the new process have been very positive.
The process didn't change in LS7 production, and that was inexcusable. The paint process is now night and day different.
Hopefully, the new paint process will correct the problem, but the old paint process seemed to work on the C5 and the C6. Apparently it wasn't fixed back in the early 2018 production(that's four years after the C7 went into production) as shown by the OP's photos.
No it wasn't fixed in early 2018 production. 2018s painted through July 2017 were painted just like 2014s produced in August 2013 in the old paint facility. All 2018s built since the plant resumed production in November 2017 were painted in the new plant, built from the ground up with all new equipment, state-of-the-art robots, and a completely revised curing process involving much longer times at lower heat, among other process improvements.
No it wasn't fixed in early 2018 production. 2018s painted through July 2017 were painted just like 2014s produced in August 2013 in the old paint facility. All 2018s built since the plant resumed production in November 2017 were painted in the new plant, built from the ground up with all new equipment, state-of-the-art robots, and a completely revised curing process involving much longer times at lower heat, among other process improvements.
GM has continually upgraded their painting process at Bowling Green over the years..
I'm pretty sure it was all new for the 1997 C5 and then they spent millions to upgrade it during the early C6's production run, but I don't remember it being as bad as the early C7's production.
Yes, I'm sure they did, but there's only so much that could be done in the old facility with the space available. I can only speculate, but aging equipment could have had something to do with it, and GM finally was persuaded to spend big money on an entirely new and larger facility rather than trying to refurbish the old one. It's been on he drawing board for several years now, so I suspect they didn't spend a lot money on the old plant, other than basic maintenance, and limped along in the old facility for awhile, knowing the new one was coming.
Future production plans for new models, and the need to improve quality by rethinking the entire finishing process may have sealed the deal to go all new from the ground up. Apparently the new paint plant alone is about the same size as the rest of the existing plant.
Well, I guess my main point is that they reacted to long-standing complaints about Corvette paint finishes by spending $300-400M on a new paint facility, which just opened in November.
I agree it's a shame that some people have had problems getting their problems addressed in a satisfactory manner.
Being a finance guy, I'm sure quality was only a small portion of the reason to spend 300-400 million
The month and year built will be on your driver door panel placard near the door latch, but I can tell from the VIN that it is a car built before the plant closure and painted in the old plant.
If you look at the bottom of your first picture in the column where it says Torch Red, it looks like the panels were painted in Feb 2017. They are often painted well before assembly.
Saw this post from Foosh and got me wondering about timing compared to the OP. Seems if the info I'm reading is right, same month for both and makes sense that my car will likely also have "nose" problems...
Mine is a little "younger" with a 5/17 build. Took delivery on November '17 and have about 1,500 miles on it now.
The areas on the rear are right at the edge where the fascia meets the quarter panels on both sides.
Of note, beginning to see the early indications of the same issue with the front "nose" fascia as well where the cover meets the other panels...
Allen
Upper right-rear
Upper left-rear
Lower left-rear
This car is a prime example of a car that should use a toothpick or fine paint brush with a razor blade or sand paper to smooth the edges and GM matching touchup paint and be done with it. Its wrong that this is happening but don't let your dealer make it worse. Sorry but as I have mentioned taking off my front fascia bumper or fenders would not be a option for me even if they are $90,000 dollar cars.
That's the way to do it (factory painted). It takes only a few minutes to swap.
Something to check on with your dealer/body shop is that they order the nose badge as well and not re-use the existing one. The new fascia doesn't come with the nose badge.
By "Nose Badge" I assume you are referring to the Corvette Logo on the hood? I guess Im at the mercy of the dealership to make sure they line it up properly???
02-24-2018, 03:56 PM
Great job and no repaint or fender or front fascia removal and install!
