Having the engine idle
#1
Having the engine idle
It’s not often I start my Corvette up in the winter. For the most part it’s parked. However, every now and then I would have to start it up to move it several feet are either from the garage to the driveway or vice versa. When I would do this I would not drive the car for more than several feet. I would say I only did it two or three times last year. Generally speaking is this a bad idea? I highly doubt that by me doing it two or three times created any type of damage. I’m just asking if this is generally a bad idea.
#2
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St. Jude Donor '15-'16,'18
Not a good practice if you can avoid it. Car should be driven long enough to reach operating temperatures. That said, I would not lose any sleep if you cannot avoid it.
#3
Drifting
Your profile doesn’t show your state or city, but I assume a colder state.
Depending on the temperature where you store it, you should let the engine get warmed up completely. Moisture from a cold engine does not get a chance to dissipate unless you get the engine up to full temperature the longer you run it the better.
Depending on the temperature where you store it, you should let the engine get warmed up completely. Moisture from a cold engine does not get a chance to dissipate unless you get the engine up to full temperature the longer you run it the better.
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Johnp94 (04-15-2018)
#4
It's not recommended, but if you have to move it, you have to move it, and it's not going cause any significant damage. Just don't make a habit of it, and any time you start the car, try to drive it long enough to get up to normal operating temp, if possible. It often takes the oil 10-15 miles to get up to 175º. Coolant reaches normal temp much faster.
On the other hand, we all have to run 1-5 mile errands from time-to-time. What we're ultimately talking about here is that for max longevity and since most engine wear happens on engine start, you only start the engine when you can get all fluids up to temp if that's possible.
On the other hand, we all have to run 1-5 mile errands from time-to-time. What we're ultimately talking about here is that for max longevity and since most engine wear happens on engine start, you only start the engine when you can get all fluids up to temp if that's possible.
Last edited by Foosh; 04-15-2018 at 03:07 PM.
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Maxie2U (04-15-2018)
#5
Team Owner
Not a big deal, optimally you would not start it unless you were going to drive it long enough to get all fluids up to operating temperatures.
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Rebel Yell (04-15-2018)
#6
Your profile doesn’t show your state or city, but I assume a colder state.
Depending on the temperature where you store it, you should let the engine get warmed up completely. Moisture from a cold engine does not get a chance to dissipate unless you get the engine up to full temperature the longer you run it the better.
Depending on the temperature where you store it, you should let the engine get warmed up completely. Moisture from a cold engine does not get a chance to dissipate unless you get the engine up to full temperature the longer you run it the better.
#7
Le Mans Master
A couple of months ago I was watching the Velocity channel this particular show they were changing out the exhaust system for an upgraded exhaust system. When they pulled the pipes water literally poured out. The mechanic said that’s what happens when you only drive the car a few miles and/or starting it up but not getting the engine really hot.
Granted it was an older “show” car but I think it makes the point of what happens.
Granted it was an older “show” car but I think it makes the point of what happens.
#8
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St. Jude Donor '13
For the last 12 years, I have been starting our Corvettes every couple of weeks all winter (Chicago area).
I let it idle while I operate every switch and control in the cockpit, which takes a while and usually gets the oil temp up to normal. Then I go up and down our 100' (salt free) driveway a few times, starting in first and second gears manually, and letting the tranny shift itself a few times. Reverse, turn the steering full lock a few times, brakes, etc. Then back in the garage and on the tender.
We have had no engine problems, and no problems with other parts that might be associated from lack of use. Doing oil analysis after each change (twice per year) shows that the summer-only oil results are identical to the winter-run results. So it certainly hasn't hurt anything, and I suspect it is somewhat beneficial.
OTOH, many people let the car sit all winter and also have no problems. Not sure if they have any oil analysis reports to look at.
I let it idle while I operate every switch and control in the cockpit, which takes a while and usually gets the oil temp up to normal. Then I go up and down our 100' (salt free) driveway a few times, starting in first and second gears manually, and letting the tranny shift itself a few times. Reverse, turn the steering full lock a few times, brakes, etc. Then back in the garage and on the tender.
We have had no engine problems, and no problems with other parts that might be associated from lack of use. Doing oil analysis after each change (twice per year) shows that the summer-only oil results are identical to the winter-run results. So it certainly hasn't hurt anything, and I suspect it is somewhat beneficial.
OTOH, many people let the car sit all winter and also have no problems. Not sure if they have any oil analysis reports to look at.
#9
Instructor
I've been told long ago that doing a quick start-up and not letting it reach operating temperature can foul-up the plugs. As others have said, it's also good to let it warm up as it will evacuate moisture in the exhaust line.
So if you have to move it, no problem, but don't quickly shut it off after.
So if you have to move it, no problem, but don't quickly shut it off after.
#10
Race Director
A couple of months ago I was watching the Velocity channel this particular show they were changing out the exhaust system for an upgraded exhaust system. When they pulled the pipes water literally poured out. The mechanic said that’s what happens when you only drive the car a few miles and/or starting it up but not getting the engine really hot.
Granted it was an older “show” car but I think it makes the point of what happens.
Granted it was an older “show” car but I think it makes the point of what happens.
Liquid "pouring out" of exhaust sounds more like the car had a bad head gasket.
#11
For the last 12 years, I have been starting our Corvettes every couple of weeks all winter (Chicago area).
I let it idle while I operate every switch and control in the cockpit, which takes a while and usually gets the oil temp up to normal. Then I go up and down our 100' (salt free) driveway a few times, starting in first and second gears manually, and letting the tranny shift itself a few times. Reverse, turn the steering full lock a few times, brakes, etc. Then back in the garage and on the tender.
I let it idle while I operate every switch and control in the cockpit, which takes a while and usually gets the oil temp up to normal. Then I go up and down our 100' (salt free) driveway a few times, starting in first and second gears manually, and letting the tranny shift itself a few times. Reverse, turn the steering full lock a few times, brakes, etc. Then back in the garage and on the tender.
#12
Safety Car
For the last 12 years, I have been starting our Corvettes every couple of weeks all winter (Chicago area).
I let it idle while I operate every switch and control in the cockpit, which takes a while and usually gets the oil temp up to normal. Then I go up and down our 100' (salt free) driveway a few times, starting in first and second gears manually, and letting the tranny shift itself a few times. Reverse, turn the steering full lock a few times, brakes, etc. Then back in the garage and on the tender.
We have had no engine problems, and no problems with other parts that might be associated from lack of use. Doing oil analysis after each change (twice per year) shows that the summer-only oil results are identical to the winter-run results. So it certainly hasn't hurt anything, and I suspect it is somewhat beneficial.
OTOH, many people let the car sit all winter and also have no problems. Not sure if they have any oil analysis reports to look at.
I let it idle while I operate every switch and control in the cockpit, which takes a while and usually gets the oil temp up to normal. Then I go up and down our 100' (salt free) driveway a few times, starting in first and second gears manually, and letting the tranny shift itself a few times. Reverse, turn the steering full lock a few times, brakes, etc. Then back in the garage and on the tender.
We have had no engine problems, and no problems with other parts that might be associated from lack of use. Doing oil analysis after each change (twice per year) shows that the summer-only oil results are identical to the winter-run results. So it certainly hasn't hurt anything, and I suspect it is somewhat beneficial.
OTOH, many people let the car sit all winter and also have no problems. Not sure if they have any oil analysis reports to look at.
#13
All the advice given is correct in my opinion, but also in my layman's opinion you are talking about a very small percentage of engine life loss due to the harm in doing what you do. In other words you may get only 200,000 trouble free miles as opposed to 202,000.
There is a very high likelihood that the car saw more instances of short duration starts at the dealer and getting to the dealer before you took delivery than you will ever give it.
Sometimes I open the garage door and start my car just because the great grandson wants me too.
It's a Chevy. Enjoy it.
There is a very high likelihood that the car saw more instances of short duration starts at the dealer and getting to the dealer before you took delivery than you will ever give it.
Sometimes I open the garage door and start my car just because the great grandson wants me too.
It's a Chevy. Enjoy it.
#14
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St. Jude Donor '13
Unfortunately, nobody I know has done any organized collection and analysis of the data, so I'm left with a suspicion but nothing definitive. I believe that a quick start and then shutdown (not my procedure) is a poor idea like many others believe, but can't find any direct evidence to support that idea either.
Since my own oil reports indicate that my start and run until warmup procedure does no harm, and may help; I stay with it.
As for the benefit of driving the car up and down the driveway, my experience was that allowing an airplane to sit unused for more than a couple of weeks would increase the chances of something not working right when returned to service. Airplane parts are somewhat different from Corvettes, but they are also of higher quality. Again, I can't find any data to decide the issue either way and so I go with the information I have.
Some years ago there was a post here (C5 or C6 section?) where a GM engineer gave his opinion that an engine should be started and run occasionally while in storage, but he did not give the basis for his belief or how often he prefers to start. But he did not say to just let it sit without starting.
Everyone gets to make his or her own choice, based on very limited information.
#15
OK thanks for your explanation. Most of what I've read indicates there is no benefit, even though you're probably not doing any significant harm.
The engine is certainly not getting "exercised" under load, and none of the other drivetrain components are getting any exercise either. It seems like a waste of time and energy to me too.
I also wonder about additional valve deposit exposure with an engine just sitting there idling.
The engine is certainly not getting "exercised" under load, and none of the other drivetrain components are getting any exercise either. It seems like a waste of time and energy to me too.
I also wonder about additional valve deposit exposure with an engine just sitting there idling.
#16
Race Director
All the advice given is correct in my opinion, but also in my layman's opinion you are talking about a very small percentage of engine life loss due to the harm in doing what you do. In other words you may get only 200,000 trouble free miles as opposed to 202,000.
There is a very high likelihood that the car saw more instances of short duration starts at the dealer and getting to the dealer before you took delivery than you will ever give it.
Sometimes I open the garage door and start my car just because the great grandson wants me too.
It's a Chevy. Enjoy it.
There is a very high likelihood that the car saw more instances of short duration starts at the dealer and getting to the dealer before you took delivery than you will ever give it.
Sometimes I open the garage door and start my car just because the great grandson wants me too.
It's a Chevy. Enjoy it.
That's interesting information
Last edited by Kevin A Jones; 04-15-2018 at 10:16 PM.
#17
I've seen oil analysis reports of engines that were not started at all during winter storage, and some of them showed higher than normal levels of iron which was believed to have come from the beginnings of rust on the cylinder walls.
Unfortunately, nobody I know has done any organized collection and analysis of the data, so I'm left with a suspicion but nothing definitive. I believe that a quick start and then shutdown (not my procedure) is a poor idea like many others believe, but can't find any direct evidence to support that idea either.
Since my own oil reports indicate that my start and run until warmup procedure does no harm, and may help; I stay with it.
As for the benefit of driving the car up and down the driveway, my experience was that allowing an airplane to sit unused for more than a couple of weeks would increase the chances of something not working right when returned to service. Airplane parts are somewhat different from Corvettes, but they are also of higher quality. Again, I can't find any data to decide the issue either way and so I go with the information I have.
Some years ago there was a post here (C5 or C6 section?) where a GM engineer gave his opinion that an engine should be started and run occasionally while in storage, but he did not give the basis for his belief or how often he prefers to start. But he did not say to just let it sit without starting.
Everyone gets to make his or her own choice, based on very limited information.
Unfortunately, nobody I know has done any organized collection and analysis of the data, so I'm left with a suspicion but nothing definitive. I believe that a quick start and then shutdown (not my procedure) is a poor idea like many others believe, but can't find any direct evidence to support that idea either.
Since my own oil reports indicate that my start and run until warmup procedure does no harm, and may help; I stay with it.
As for the benefit of driving the car up and down the driveway, my experience was that allowing an airplane to sit unused for more than a couple of weeks would increase the chances of something not working right when returned to service. Airplane parts are somewhat different from Corvettes, but they are also of higher quality. Again, I can't find any data to decide the issue either way and so I go with the information I have.
Some years ago there was a post here (C5 or C6 section?) where a GM engineer gave his opinion that an engine should be started and run occasionally while in storage, but he did not give the basis for his belief or how often he prefers to start. But he did not say to just let it sit without starting.
Everyone gets to make his or her own choice, based on very limited information.
#18
Race Director
I would think that starting the engine from time to time would (if nothing else) reduce the chances of the same valve springs being held in the compressed position for however long its in storage. Not that it would be some big concern, but it counts for something.
#19
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St. Jude Donor '13
Cylinder walls on most engines, and I presume the C7, are iron or steel. That can rust.
Unlike most iron/steel parts inside the engine, they have piston rings designed to wipe (most) of the oil away with each stroke, then gravity removing more over time. The proper finish on the cylinder walls is important.
The insides of the engine are not laying out in the back yard exposed to rain, but they aren't hermitically sealed either, so rust is a possibility. Reciprocating airplane engines are quite prone to this, automobile engines probably less so but not immune, as indicated by the oil reports I mentioned.
Many people store the car unstarted all winter and notice no problems, that doesn't mean there isn't some subtle degradation going on.
Our C7 sat inside at the dealer for about 7 months before we bought it, they apparently started and moved it occasionally but no one knows how often. If I could have bought the same car that sat only a couple of weeks, I would have done so. But I didn't have that option and chose to buy the available car that had done some sitting. So I pay attention but don't obsess over unstarted storage.
Unlike most iron/steel parts inside the engine, they have piston rings designed to wipe (most) of the oil away with each stroke, then gravity removing more over time. The proper finish on the cylinder walls is important.
The insides of the engine are not laying out in the back yard exposed to rain, but they aren't hermitically sealed either, so rust is a possibility. Reciprocating airplane engines are quite prone to this, automobile engines probably less so but not immune, as indicated by the oil reports I mentioned.
Many people store the car unstarted all winter and notice no problems, that doesn't mean there isn't some subtle degradation going on.
Our C7 sat inside at the dealer for about 7 months before we bought it, they apparently started and moved it occasionally but no one knows how often. If I could have bought the same car that sat only a couple of weeks, I would have done so. But I didn't have that option and chose to buy the available car that had done some sitting. So I pay attention but don't obsess over unstarted storage.
#20
This made me google a few things, because I thought it was mostly aluminum, but it appears that there are quite a few iron components.
Learn something new every day.
Learn something new every day.