Help me understand the C7 re-sale?
06-12-2018, 04:02 PM
#61
Le Mans Master
Let's assume you get 3% interest on your CD, 25% of that goes to Uncle Sam and a fair amount to the state. I am in the 30% tax bracket, so the numbers are a compromise. $100,000 CD gets you#$3000, $750 goes to the Feds, and likely $250 goes to the State. Interest on you loan will be a large number than the bottom line of the loan, or at least real close. Calculate the final amount you pay for the car (including interest, taxes etc.). I know this will escape most "gotta have it now" folks, but facts is facts. You pay $100,000 (total)for a $75,000 car that is worth $55,000 or less in three years.
Borrowing Spending money for a depreciating asset Corvette is a bad financial decision, no matter what you think. Too many people are upside down on their cars, don't be one of them.
All you've proven is that if you pay cash instead of financing, you'll lose somewhat LESS money, but you are STILL LOSING ALOT OF MONEY either way. A Corvette doesn't magically turn into a 'good financial decision' just because you pay cash instead of financing.
The Corvette is basically an entertainment/hobby expense, not an asset whose worth is only determined by its financial evaluation, "no matter what you think", to use your words.
For some people, they get enjoyment out of the simple fact of paying as little as humanly possible, regardless of any other factors. If that makes them happy, then, by all means, do it. Enjoy. But thinking that a Corvette is somehow simply a financial instrument, whose primary determinator of enjoyment is a lower depreciation expense over X number of years/mileage, is to be out of touch with the majority of people who buy them and love them. I guess we're all a little crazy for that
Last edited by Kent1999; 06-12-2018 at 04:07 PM.
06-12-2018, 04:08 PM
#62
Le Mans Master
I dunno. I lost $7k driving my Z51 for 11k miles or so. Well, I bought a GS that had a sticker that was $8k more and I paid a difference of $15k for the upgrade.
Prorated I had
$1k is tire wear
$200 brake wear
$150 free oil change
$500 worth of warranty (?)
And if the car is good far 140k miles, that's about $5k of the life of the car itself.
That's $6750 right there.
and that's not really a fair breakdown. The first 10k of a car are worth a hell of a lot more than the least 10k, are more reliable, less headaches, and a lot cheaper. Of course, the car is new, as opposed to being a 10 year old car, etc. Plus I didn't have the risk of buying someone else's headache.
To each their own.
Prorated I had
$1k is tire wear
$200 brake wear
$150 free oil change
$500 worth of warranty (?)
And if the car is good far 140k miles, that's about $5k of the life of the car itself.
That's $6750 right there.
and that's not really a fair breakdown. The first 10k of a car are worth a hell of a lot more than the least 10k, are more reliable, less headaches, and a lot cheaper. Of course, the car is new, as opposed to being a 10 year old car, etc. Plus I didn't have the risk of buying someone else's headache.
To each their own.
06-12-2018, 04:11 PM
#63
Le Mans Master
Let's assume you get 3% interest on your CD, 25% of that goes to Uncle Sam and a fair amount to the state. I am in the 30% tax bracket, so the numbers are a compromise. $100,000 CD gets you#$3000, $750 goes to the Feds, and likely $250 goes to the State. Interest on you loan will be a large number than the bottom line of the loan, or at least real close. Calculate the final amount you pay for the car (including interest, taxes etc.). I know this will escape most "gotta have it now" folks, but facts is facts. You pay $100,000 (total)for a $75,000 car that is worth $55,000 or less in three years.
Borrowing money for a depreciating asset is a bad financial decision, no matter what you think. Too many people are upside down on their cars, don't be one of them.
Borrowing money for a depreciating asset is a bad financial decision, no matter what you think. Too many people are upside down on their cars, don't be one of them.
It's pretty easy to find a 2% investment. and if something happens, I still have the cash available.
06-12-2018, 06:38 PM
#64
Team Owner
Member Since: Aug 2005
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Co-winner 2020 C4 of the Year - Modified
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St. Jude Donor '09-'10-'11-'12-'13-'14-'15-'16-'17-'18-'19-'20
06-12-2018, 09:49 PM
#65
Melting Slicks
Member Since: Jan 2015
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St. Jude Donor '15-'16
I don't understand so many Z's for sale at 5K miles either. In December I found a loaded 2016 with 30K miles for the price of a new Z51. Grabbed it and couldn't be happier. Prior to this I had a 2008 which I bought in 2014. The Vettes have been the first cars that I bought used and the experience has been so good I will replace my DD with a used car when the time comes.
BTW, there was a recent thread about Z's for sale at low mileage.
BTW, there was a recent thread about Z's for sale at low mileage.
06-12-2018, 11:11 PM
#66
Safety Car
If you're flexible on options and color and trim combinations you can find a suitable new Corvette in stock at one of the bigger dealers or you can buy a used one. If you're ok with a car built to someone else's spec there's definitely big money to be saved by buying used.
But buying used is not an option for some serious Corvette enthusiasts who desire a car built to their exact unique spec. For them, someone else's spec just won't do. Cost is not such an issue when you're passionate about your hobby. For those people a Corvette built to their exact spec is much more rewarding to own and well worth the wait.
.
But buying used is not an option for some serious Corvette enthusiasts who desire a car built to their exact unique spec. For them, someone else's spec just won't do. Cost is not such an issue when you're passionate about your hobby. For those people a Corvette built to their exact spec is much more rewarding to own and well worth the wait.
.
Last edited by ZL-1; 06-12-2018 at 11:13 PM.
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ptran00 (06-13-2018)
06-12-2018, 11:35 PM
#67
Safety Car
What is there to understand. Others have already explained it well.. but to sum it up again a Corvette is a luxury item. And almost all luxury items depreciate heavily. This is rocket science people.. you have to pay to play. And for those who can afford it, a new Corvette is what they want.
06-13-2018, 01:56 AM
#68
Melting Slicks
Kind of a spin-off question, can someone answer?
If someone has the car custom built to their specs, are they paying full MSRP?
The reason I ask, I bought a car recently for $48k on a $76k sticker and the guy had it built to his specs, drove up to MacMulkin NH to pick it up at release. In this case, did the guy really take a $28k bath on it? I know that some people are arguing "we get them 15% off (or more) new", but this guy would have had to buy at full sticker due to having it built, right?
If someone has the car custom built to their specs, are they paying full MSRP?
The reason I ask, I bought a car recently for $48k on a $76k sticker and the guy had it built to his specs, drove up to MacMulkin NH to pick it up at release. In this case, did the guy really take a $28k bath on it? I know that some people are arguing "we get them 15% off (or more) new", but this guy would have had to buy at full sticker due to having it built, right?
My last truck, a 17 Ford, dealer actually told me he would take another 3K off the 6K I had negotiated off the truck I wanted if I would order it.
Ordered my 14 Stingray, same thing took money off.
06-13-2018, 02:04 AM
#69
Melting Slicks
One of my Mutual funds is paying 11.3% average the past four years, another is paying 8.6% average the past 10 years.
The interest rate on my 18 Grand Sport is 2.48%.
Please explain why I would want to pull 40K out of one of those two accounts? They are paying me, much more for my money than I am paying the credit union for their money. I'm at least 6% ahead doing it my way.
Yea, I had enough equity in my 14 trade that I only needed 40K more for the 18 3LT GS Carbon 65.
Explain how I could do it better????
06-13-2018, 02:16 AM
#70
Melting Slicks
I'm not upside down on any vehicle, nor have I been in the last 25 years.
Current Grand Sport, bought two months ago. MSRP 92K. I borrowed 40K from my Credit Union, I owe 39, right now. Not upside down.
My 17 F150 Platinum, MSRP 67K. I borrowed 35K at 1.59% from my Credit union. I owe 26,xxx on it. Not up side down.
Wife's Range Rover, 2014 paid for two years ago.
Much smarter to take a loan than remove money from mutual fund paying over 8% or the one paying over 11% .
That said, there is no time ever it is smart Financially to buy a Corvette, or other High End luxury car or truck. Financially smart would be a base model truck if you need a truck, and a base model Malibu or such.
I put more a month into my investments than my Truck and Corvette payment combined. I could retire a lot sooner if I did't buy a corvette, but I also like some enjoyment in life.
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ptran00 (06-13-2018)
06-13-2018, 03:27 AM
#71
Apparently being a rude ***** means your bad at math too. A 2014 Vette means the car is FOUR years old today...not SIX years old... You sound pretty "big league" to me...
Also, paying $40k for the same car you paid $80k for, doesn't make me a bottom feeder...it allows me to go buy that boat your wife wont let you buy, because she thinks your Vette payment is too high...
Also, paying $40k for the same car you paid $80k for, doesn't make me a bottom feeder...it allows me to go buy that boat your wife wont let you buy, because she thinks your Vette payment is too high...
Last edited by ptran00; 06-13-2018 at 04:18 AM.
06-13-2018, 03:37 AM
#72
Why bother with a CD that pays practically nothing? Dealer gave me a price discount and I took GM's 0% deal last summer and invested my down payment in the stock market that has earned 23% in the last 12 months.
Last edited by ptran00; 06-13-2018 at 04:19 AM.
06-13-2018, 03:41 AM
#73
Not always. My mutual funds pay lots more than interest rate I pay.
I'm not upside down on any vehicle, nor have I been in the last 25 years.
Current Grand Sport, bought two months ago. MSRP 92K. I borrowed 40K from my Credit Union, I owe 39, right now. Not upside down.
My 17 F150 Platinum, MSRP 67K. I borrowed 35K at 1.59% from my Credit union. I owe 26,xxx on it. Not up side down.
Wife's Range Rover, 2014 paid for two years ago.
Much smarter to take a loan than remove money from mutual fund paying over 8% or the one paying over 11% .
That said, there is no time ever it is smart Financially to buy a Corvette, or other High End luxury car or truck. Financially smart would be a base model truck if you need a truck, and a base model Malibu or such.
I put more a month into my investments than my Truck and Corvette payment combined. I could retire a lot sooner if I did't buy a corvette, but I also like some enjoyment in life.
I'm not upside down on any vehicle, nor have I been in the last 25 years.
Current Grand Sport, bought two months ago. MSRP 92K. I borrowed 40K from my Credit Union, I owe 39, right now. Not upside down.
My 17 F150 Platinum, MSRP 67K. I borrowed 35K at 1.59% from my Credit union. I owe 26,xxx on it. Not up side down.
Wife's Range Rover, 2014 paid for two years ago.
Much smarter to take a loan than remove money from mutual fund paying over 8% or the one paying over 11% .
That said, there is no time ever it is smart Financially to buy a Corvette, or other High End luxury car or truck. Financially smart would be a base model truck if you need a truck, and a base model Malibu or such.
I put more a month into my investments than my Truck and Corvette payment combined. I could retire a lot sooner if I did't buy a corvette, but I also like some enjoyment in life.
Last edited by ptran00; 06-13-2018 at 03:43 AM.
06-13-2018, 03:50 AM
#74
99% of the general population think ANY money spent on a Corvette is foolish. So, what is your point?
Corvette buyers are not a random selection of people. Most of them are much better off financially than average, and can AFFORD to spend on a car that is mostly recreational or for a 'hobby', even if some of that cost is <gasp!> interest.
If financing, the cost of the car includes the interest paid. If a Corvette buyer thinks the amount they pay (including interest) is worth it -- what does it matter if it is financed? When other people start paying my bills, then they can cast aspersions as to how I spend my own money.
The hoary old "if you can't pay cash, you can't afford it" mindset is outdated and ignorant. Credit is not "universally bad", but is a tool that can be used for good or evil, depending on the user.
Corvette buyers are not a random selection of people. Most of them are much better off financially than average, and can AFFORD to spend on a car that is mostly recreational or for a 'hobby', even if some of that cost is <gasp!> interest.
If financing, the cost of the car includes the interest paid. If a Corvette buyer thinks the amount they pay (including interest) is worth it -- what does it matter if it is financed? When other people start paying my bills, then they can cast aspersions as to how I spend my own money.
The hoary old "if you can't pay cash, you can't afford it" mindset is outdated and ignorant. Credit is not "universally bad", but is a tool that can be used for good or evil, depending on the user.
Last edited by ptran00; 06-13-2018 at 04:20 AM.
06-13-2018, 03:55 AM
#75
Let's assume you get 3% interest on your CD, 25% of that goes to Uncle Sam and a fair amount to the state. I am in the 30% tax bracket, so the numbers are a compromise. $100,000 CD gets you#$3000, $750 goes to the Feds, and likely $250 goes to the State. Interest on you loan will be a large number than the bottom line of the loan, or at least real close. Calculate the final amount you pay for the car (including interest, taxes etc.). I know this will escape most "gotta have it now" folks, but facts is facts. You pay $100,000 (total)for a $75,000 car that is worth $55,000 or less in three years.
Borrowing money for a depreciating asset is a bad financial decision, no matter what you think. Too many people are upside down on their cars, don't be one of them.
Borrowing money for a depreciating asset is a bad financial decision, no matter what you think. Too many people are upside down on their cars, don't be one of them.
Last edited by ptran00; 06-13-2018 at 04:14 AM.
06-13-2018, 04:05 AM
#76
Instructor
Hey Guys,
Im picking up my 2014 C7 (Z51/3Lt 7-Spd) tomorrow (literally cant wait). I think I got an AMAZING deal on my car... But to be educated, I keep looking at the FOR SALE section here for C7's and I just cant believe that over and over again, I keep seeing C7's (mostly Z06's) for sale with 4k to 8k miles on them, and they are selling for $25,000 to $35,000 less than what they paid... That equates losing around $4 to $6 PER MILE DRIVEN just for depreciation...cmon...
How can ANYONE (unless money is of no concern) justify buying a "new" Vette with THAT kind of depreciation hit? I was reading the other day where a post was about how a guy felt taking out a loan for a C7 was "ridiculous" yet he sold his Vette with a 25% depreciation hit...which FAR exceeds any interest your pay on a loan... It just boggles my mind how people dont actually do the math on a new car.
Just cant understand why you wouldn't take advantage of the used market more than people do. And if anyone says "Ill pay for that NEW CAR SMELL" than you deserve the biggest slap in the head...
Please share your thoughts on this...and please note - Im not picking on anyone buying a new Vette (not at all) Im just trying to understand why your ok with a 25% to 35% depreciation hit on a car that has 3k to 8k miles on it (barely used). Also, lets not start the "Im rich, your not BS"...cause like my grandfather always said to me: "If you have to brag about money...you dont have it".
Im picking up my 2014 C7 (Z51/3Lt 7-Spd) tomorrow (literally cant wait). I think I got an AMAZING deal on my car... But to be educated, I keep looking at the FOR SALE section here for C7's and I just cant believe that over and over again, I keep seeing C7's (mostly Z06's) for sale with 4k to 8k miles on them, and they are selling for $25,000 to $35,000 less than what they paid... That equates losing around $4 to $6 PER MILE DRIVEN just for depreciation...cmon...
How can ANYONE (unless money is of no concern) justify buying a "new" Vette with THAT kind of depreciation hit? I was reading the other day where a post was about how a guy felt taking out a loan for a C7 was "ridiculous" yet he sold his Vette with a 25% depreciation hit...which FAR exceeds any interest your pay on a loan... It just boggles my mind how people dont actually do the math on a new car.
Just cant understand why you wouldn't take advantage of the used market more than people do. And if anyone says "Ill pay for that NEW CAR SMELL" than you deserve the biggest slap in the head...
Please share your thoughts on this...and please note - Im not picking on anyone buying a new Vette (not at all) Im just trying to understand why your ok with a 25% to 35% depreciation hit on a car that has 3k to 8k miles on it (barely used). Also, lets not start the "Im rich, your not BS"...cause like my grandfather always said to me: "If you have to brag about money...you dont have it".
After 3k miles and 7 months, mines up for sale, lol. There's definitely a sweet spot with the Corvette. Part of it has to do with when you buy it - they're a lot like motorcycles. Spring-Summer are high prices, Fall are the same or slightly lower. Winter...especially in the north where they get a lot of snow...they're great prices. I practically begged my local dealers to match the deal this dealer in Boston was offering the car at...and no one would come within 7k for the SAME car!
I wish I could say I'll end up making some money on the car, but any difference in sales price will quickly be made up via the dealer fees (which bumped the price to $62.5k. Then of course there's the spoiler I had to replace after damaging the other one w/ a heat gun while installing the stage 2...that's $350. Of course, that doesn't include me wasting a months time trying to perfectly fix it myself w/ $500 worth of paint guns and auto paint supplies
New roof after forgetting to latch the one it came with $950 (thanks Kyle! 
). New speaker after the old one blew. $100. GM covered part of replacing the touchscreen, but I still had to cover $250 of it. Taxes were $550. Then insurance was about a grand for the year, so say another $500. 3k miles at 15mpg on 93 is another $600 for fuel. So, since day one...I've got a total of $55.7k in it (not including loan interest). If I get the $63.5 I want for it, that'll be an average of about $1.25-$1.33/mile. If I hadn't been a half wit and screwed up the spoiler and roof, I'd be under a buck a mile (at this point). Still, going out and playin around with other super cars makes it worth every penny Was playing with a Lambo Murcielago a few days ago, and happy to say the Z held her own. Man, that was fun and something I'll never forget I wouldn't normally choose to sell it because it's - by far - the most amazing machine I've ever owned....but, the wife's car is getting older and seems to be on it's last legs, so figured I'd sell the vette rather than risk her and the boys getting stranded somewhere. It's received a lot of interest at $63,500. Then there's that whole issue of the 650 ft-lb of torque...I can't keep my foot off the gas. It's too easy to take it from 0 to 70 (or more) in no time, lol...so the corvette is just a court date waiting to happen.
I don't think you can really slice it any other way. No matter what price you get a corvette at, you might as well accept its going to chug gas...and money, lol. I made the mistake of looking up the price of the tires since the rear spins up in first or second almost everywhere. $1600 to $2000....aye chihuahua!
Last edited by jdlev; 06-13-2018 at 04:08 AM.
06-13-2018, 04:17 AM
#77
Melting Slicks
Although the C7 has been out since 2014, the newer models (I bought a new 2017 model in 6/2017) fixed the bugs usually in 1st year models and has newer features (Apple Carplay, flat bottom steering wheel, new rim styles/colors, red brake calipers, self/soft closing trunk), and comes with a full 3 year warranty, 3 free oil changes valued at $100 each, no wear and tear of brakes/tires/fluids etc.
So my 18 came with the same warranty and 2 less oil changes
06-13-2018, 04:19 AM
#78
Melting Slicks
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ptran00 (06-13-2018)
06-13-2018, 05:39 AM
#79
Burning Brakes
Member Since: Mar 2014
Location: Greater Cincinnati Area
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I’d have preferred to buy used, but finding a C7 optioned exactly as I wanted it, in the color I wanted, just wasn’t going to happen, so I ordered mine. I’ve driven used cars all the way up to this one...including a lot of $400 cars. Because of those sacrifices over the years, as well as others, I can pay cash for what I want now. The $20k-$35k in depreciation I’ll realize when I sell simply isn’t a significant amount any more.
06-13-2018, 07:18 AM
#80
Melting Slicks
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St. Jude Donor '15-'16
I’d have preferred to buy used, but finding a C7 optioned exactly as I wanted it, in the color I wanted, just wasn’t going to happen, so I ordered mine. I’ve driven used cars all the way up to this one...including a lot of $400 cars. Because of those sacrifices over the years, as well as others, I can pay cash for what I want now. The $20k-$35k in depreciation I’ll realize when I sell simply isn’t a significant amount any more.
I was even thinking maybe museum delivery.