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With all the complaints about the dust, and with better technology out there, you would think that an improvement would have been introduced early on. It’s a little frustrating to be planning on replaceing pads on a brand new car, especially at the high price point. So I’ll drive, evaluate, and make a change if necessary.
for a street pad that makes no noise, it's actually a prettty impressive pad. You're giving up a lot of performance going to a dust free pad. It's not like there is something wrong with the pad. It's like a tire- there are tradeoffs for performance.
St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15-'16-'17-'18-'19-'20-'21-'22-'23-'24
Originally Posted by JerryU
The Z51, Grand Sport and Z06 all have the same pad compound and problem with very heavy dust. There is for a reason as they can be driven right to the track. Brake pad compounds are always a compromise! The Carbotech 1521 pads I switched to and work great but are NOT for Tracking. For those that do Track, Carbotech has 3 other racking pads (depending on the type of racing) that can be used but like most race pads are not "low dust." However the benefit of using those when tracking over the OEM pads is the compounds are compateable with the 1521 street pads and there is NO need to clean the rotors if swapping between the two types.
With my 2014 Z51 I did wait 6 months living with the dust, 6 months too long! I was cleaning my wheels every 100 to 200 miles NOT just because they looked bad BUT the dust was pitting my black wheels! When I got my Grand Sport there was no question change as soon as I got it home and no need to remove the brake pad residual that will be on the rotors after the 500 mile break-in. Your car your choice! It's an easy DIY to change. This is a PDF of my issues and installs: http://netwelding.com/Ceramic_Pads.pdf
No, the brake dust problem has been an ongoing thing since the C6 Grand Sport and ZO6, the thing is, you have options; deal with the issue and clean the wheels more frequently, or change the pads out for non-dusting pads. If you don't plan on tracking the car and just do basically normal driving, the no dust replacement pads will work just fine, you likely won't notice any difference in braking performance. If you do plan on tracking the car as I do with my ZO6, live with the dust for the superior braking on the track.
If you can live with the brake dust pitting your painted wheels (it was my black wheels) perhaps your solution works.
However as I mentioned, you can buy one of several racing pads from Carbotech depending if you are autocrosding, tracking or competeive racing then switch back to their 1521 Street only compound. There are all comparable and no need to clean rotors when switching.
Heck if you’re a “Real Tracker”. you can change pads when you put on the rotor coolers and switch to fresh racing brake fluid, as GM recommends!
As far as I know, the Z51 equipped cars use a different pad than the non -Z51 cars, and they create more dust. My 08 did not have the Z51 package and brake dust was never a problem.
Thanks for the info... LOL, I just ordered a Z51. OH WELL, guess I can join the others in figuring out what's best to do to remedy the dust problem.
If you can live with the brake dust pitting your painted wheels (it was my black wheels) perhaps your solution works.
However as I mentioned, you can buy one of several racing pads from Carbotech depending if you are autocrosding, tracking or competeive racing then switch back to their 1521 Street only compound. There are all comparable and no need to clean rotors when switching.
Heck if you’re a “Real Tracker”. you can change pads when you put on the rotor coolers and switch to fresh racing brake fluid, as GM recommends!
Never had a pitting problem with my C6 GS and no evidence so far on my new ZO6, but I'm only at 1,600 miles right now. I wouldn't exactly call myself a "real" tracker, just an occasional one, but I do want the best braking performance I can get. I'll deal with the dust to avoid a complete switchover every time I want to track the car. Best solution I've found is a really good cleaning of the wheels, both inside and out, then 2 good coatings of synthetic wax, for cleaning a good shot of high PSI air from my compressor does a nice job keeping the dust at bay.
I put the powerstops on my GS 2 days ago. So far NO DUST! I don't see any difference in the stopping power and I'll take brown rotors over the constant brake dust.
OEM pads won't suffice at the track, so you're gonna have to switch to a race pad if you go to the track anyway. On the street, just get something that won't dust. If you overheat your GS brakes on the street, stop towing trailers through the mountains with your Corvette.
Originally Posted by TKgs2010
... I'm only at 1,600 miles right now. I wouldn't exactly call myself a "real" tracker, just an occasional one, but I do want the best braking performance I can get. :
My comments about Carbotech 1521 ceramic pads versus Power Stop are strictly based on my experience! I have no affiliation with the company or Adam who is the Forum Advertiser that sells them! However recalled an old post where Adam discussed the companies Race Pads. Also looked at the Carbotech website in detail and did not know they mostly make race pads and list over 60 brands they fit, most performance cars including ncluding Ferrari, Porsche etc. Decided to post Adam's comments and info from their website that reinforces the cold pad performance difference I found better with the 1521 pads versus the Power Stop I tired and replaced that list their max temp at 1500F, more like some racing pads that have inferior low temp performance.
Village Idiot (who is an avid Tracker) makes an excellent point. Braking is a key part of achieving the best times. You want the best race pads you can use. You also want fresh racing brake fluid! GM recommends changing the fluid before a Tracking event for good reason. Tadge has a good forum post on the subject. Once the wheels are off in preparation for Tracking, changing brake C7 pads is easier than bleeding brakes!
DETAILS: Post by Adam re Racing Brake Pads:Carbotech has many racing compounds compounds ready to go. Take 5% off your order when using promo code z28 at check out or call us direct at 216-780-8825 to order. Pre bed option is also now available for all Carbotech brake pads. Looking forward to hearing from you soon. Please call or email us with any questions
The Carbotech™ 1521™ is our high performance street compound. The 1521™ compound is known for its release and modulation, along with unmatched rotor friendliness. 1521™ is also a very low dusting and low noise compound with an excellent initial bite. This compound's excellent linear torque production provides incredible braking force without ABS intervention. Carbotech™ 1521™ operating range starts out at ambient and goes up to 800°F (426°C+). (I have seen 900 F also listed.) 1521™ is suitable for ALL street cars, perfect for your tow vehicle or fleet vehicle. Carbotech™ 1521™ is NOT recommended for ANY track use.
Carbotech™ AX6™
The AX6™ is specifically engineered for Autocross applications. A high torque brake compound delivering reliable and consistent performance over a very wide operating temperature range of 50°F to 1000°F + (10°C to 537°C+). The advanced compound matrix provides an excellent initial bite, high coefficient of friction at lower temperatures along with very progressive brake modulation and release characteristics. Many drivers use the AX6™ for street driving as well, even though Carbotech™ doesn't recommend street driving with AX6™ due to possible elevated levels of dust and noise. AX6™ is NOT recommended as a racecompound in most applications.
Carbotech™ XP8™
A high torque brake compound with a wide operating temperature range of 200°F-1250°F+ (93°C to 676°C+). Carbotech™ XP8™ is the first of our racing compounds. Good initial bite at race temperatures, high coefficient of friction, excellent modulation and release characteristics. Extremely high fade resistance and very rotor friendly. Perfect for track day use with any tire and can still be driven safely to and from the track. Carbotech™ does NOT recommended XP8™ as a daily driven street pad due to elevated levels of dust and noise. Carbotech™ XP8™ is a great compound on the front & rear of most open wheel and sports racers.
Carbotech™ XP10™
When Carbotech™ unleashed the XP10™ to the general public it immediately gathered multiple regional, divisional, and national championships. The XP10™ has a very strong initial bite with a coefficient of friction and rotor friendliness unmatched in the industry. Fade resistance is in excess of 1475°F (801°C). XP10™ still maintains the highly praised release, excellent modulation and rotor friendliness that have made all Carbotech™ compounds so successful. Carbotech™ XP10™ is not recommended as a daily-driven street pad due to possible elevated levels of dust and noise.
Carbotech™ XP12™
Another highly successful XP™ series compound with an excellent initial bite, torque and fade resistance over and above the XP10™ compound. XP12™ has temperature range of 250°F to 1850°F+ (121°C to 1010°C+). The XP12™ has that excellent Carbotech™ release and modulation that has made all other Carbotech™ compounds so successful. The XP12™ is more rotor aggressive than XP10™, but compared to the competition the XP12™ is still very rotor friendly. XP12™ is NOT recommended for use as a daily driven street pad due to possible elevated levels of dust and noise.
Carbotech™ XP20™
The latest iteration of the highly successful XP™ series of compounds. XP20™ is a step up from the highly successful XP16™ compound. With an extremely aggressive initial bite, linear torque curve and excellent fade resistance the XP20™ is another major step in progression of the highly successful XP™ series line of compounds from Carbotech™. XP20™ has a temperature range of 275°F to 2000°F+ (135°C to 1093°C+). Carbotech™ XP20™ maintains our tradition of having the outstanding release and modulation that has made all other Carbotech™ compounds so successful. Carbotech™ XP20™ is NOT recommended for use as a daily driven street pad due to possible elevated levels of dust and noise.
Carbotech™ XP24™
XP24™ is the pinnacle compound of the extremely successful XP™ Series of compounds engineered by Carbotech™. This compound is based on the same fundamentals that exist in all other Carbotech™ formulations. XP24™ has even more initial bite, more overall bite, and more torque along with the most linear torque curve we have ever offered. The thermal characteristics are of the highest Carbotech™ offers along with one of the highest coefficient of friction ratings offered by anyone in the braking industry. This compound is the longest wearing compound Carbotech™ offers as it was originally engineered for endurance applications at the highest pro racing levels. This revolutionary new compound has been extremely successful with open wheel, closed wheel, sprint and endurance applications. XP24™ has a temperature range of 400°F to 2000°F+ (204°C to 1093°C+). Carbotech™ XP24™ is NOT recommended for use as a daily driven street pad due to possible elevated levels of dust and noise along with the necessary heat required to work properly.
Carbotech™ RP2™
The RP2™ compound was engineered for endurance racing based on our highly successful XP™ Series formulations. RP2™ has strong initial bite, a little less modulation than our XP12™, but still maintains the rotor friendliness of our XP™ series compounds. RP2™ has great fade resistance with a temperature range of 250°F to 1450°F+ (121°C to 787°C). RP2™ is as rotor friendly as our XP™ series compounds. Carbotech™ RP2™ is NOT recommended for use as a daily driven street pad due to possible elevated levels of dust and noise.
From Carbotech Website Carbotech Overview and Philosophy Carbotech Performance Brakes™ began 26 years ago. In the beginning we thought like everybody else and made brake compounds out of carbon & iron. The problem with carbon & iron is that when it heats up it forms carbide. Carbide is used in cutting tools, so imagine what that does to your rotors. Along with the fact that those compounds tear up rotors, they also produce very corrosive brake dust. While our competition stills uses carbon & iron as the main ingredients in their compounds, Carbotech started an entire new philosophy eight years ago.Carbotech Performance Brakes™, the world leader in Ceramic friction materials™. It was over eight years ago that Carbotech started building brake pads out of Ceramic, Kevlar, and Carbon for street, autocross and racing applications. Carbotech is the only brake pad manufacturer in the world with a complete line of Ceramic compounds for street, autocross, and track use. Carbotech-Ceramic™ compounds are known for their unsurpassed release & modulation, while maintaining very consistent torque control characteristics. Carbotech brake pads are extremely rotor friendly and contain contain non-corrosive brake dust, that’s something that has been unmatched by any other brake pad in the industry.Our competitor’s brake pads perform like an “on/off” switch. Brake pads that perform like an "on/off" switch are upsetting the balance of the car by violently throwing all that weight forward (not to mention that you don't get any modulation with an "on/off" type of brake pad). You don't realize how much it upsets your car until you have tried Carbotech Performance Brake pads. Carbotech has almost a seven year head start on the competition when it comes to our great philosophy on release & modulation, rotor friendliness, non-corrosive dust, and an unmatched consistent bite.Carbotech uses advanced friction technology to perfect all of our compounds for the street & track. Research & Development (R&D) is not just a company philosophy; it’s a way of life for Carbotech. In fact, R&D at Carbotech is a 365 days a year job. Continuous improvement is a cornerstone in Carbotech’s solid foundation we have built because because great compounds are not engineered overnight.You’ll find that no one else in the industry releases new compound formulations like Carbotech consistently does. We don’t believe in finding a good compound and resting. We are constantly improving an already great compound while at the same time continuing R&D on new compounds. Continuous improvement, with no end in sight.We strive in constantly improving our existing compounds as new technologies and materials come to market. In fact, the 1521™ compound is arguably our most successful compound, and it continues to gain enormous popularity among the performance industry. But, we didn’t rest on its success. We recently improved the 1521™ compound to be even quieter and smoother when applying and releasing the brake pedal while keeping its outstanding performance right on target.We have just developed another race compound that will exceed the XP20™. This new compound is our XP24™. XP24™ was officially released in the spring of 2014 after an extremely successful yet intense year of development with numerous Tudor United Sports Car Teams in 2013. For more on the XP24 and all other Carbotech compounds go to the following link. You will most likely find a Carbotech employee at many Pro, Club, Grassroots, and Track-Day/HPDE events providing customer support and troubleshooting any brake issues (even if it’s not pad related or even if they aren’t Carbotech brake pads).We don’t just sell you a set of brake pads; we deliver unmatched customer support and technical help. Carbotech Performance Brakes™ are also leading the way with Pro, Grassroots and Track-Day/HPDE groups and drivers. We can help you find the perfect set up for your vehicle by having an entire line up of street and track compounds for your application.Carbotech Performance Brakes™ allows drives to Go Deep™ into the corners and out brake the competition. Carbotech have won multiple national championships, pro races, and rally races all over the world. Our race compounds start with the letters "XP™" then they are followed by a number. The first number is 8 (XP8™), and as you go up in numbers the initial bite gets much stronger, higher fade resistance, higher torque, better wear rate, and an increase in the temperature range. On that same note, as you go up in our compound numbers you will get more aggressive on the rotors. That being said, all of our compounds are more rotor friendly than our competition.With all Carbotech compounds you will have to apply a little bit more pedal pressure to get the maximum amount of bite from the brake pads. That's because you have the ability to modulate your pedal with our ceramic/kevlar compounds. That's a huge advantage to any driver, especially a driver who has a good feel for their car. The more you can modulate your brakes the more car control you have under braking. The more control a driver has under braking gives the driver an edge in the braking zone and the first part of a corner. Control which in the end helps you attain faster and more consistent lap times. Go Deep™
SIDE BAR:
As noted, pads that operate at higher temps like the 1500 F listed by Power Stop, don't operate as well at low temps. I am reminded of a situation with the first new car I bought with every HD option offered in 1967, quick steering, HD springs, shocks and sway bar etc. My Uncle was the service manager of that large Chevy dealer at the time and tried to talk me out of the HD metallic brake option. He said he was having to change the metallic brake shoes on the police cars, where they came as standard, because in the mornings when backing out where they were parked for the night, they were "hitting" other cars etc!
I parked my new car on a relatively steep, narrow driveway at my home and would back into the street in the morning. It took going very slow and using a great deal of brake force to stop than non power brake car! Now drum brakes, which it had, don't have any self energizing braking force in reverse (you can google that feature of drum brakes) making stopping when going backwards harder but that metallic compound made it terrible. The car stopped great once the shoes were warm!
Sorry for the post length but for those who plan to Track it's worth the read!
I have used both the Carbotech and Power Stop pads. Both worked great for me and much less dusting. I really like to support products Made in the USA so my choice next time will be simple.
Installed the Powerstop Z26 pads on my '17 GS Collector Edition.... WOW what a difference in dust (or lack there of). I can't tell any difference in braking and as mentioned, there is next to no dust. What a relief !!
I had the Powerstop Z26 pads installed on my '19 GS at delivery. No dust, no squeal, and no brown rotors. Very happy with them. I believe they were $118 delivered from Rock Auto..
St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15-'16-'17-'18-'19-'20-'21-'22-'23-'24
Update on brake dust issue. I decided to install a set of Hawk Performance Ceramic Pads and actually did it myself. Not being a mechanic it was actually pretty easy. Found a couple of great You Tube videos.
I put on 150 miles last Sunday and so far I am very pleased. Definitely much less dust and great stopping power, and pedal feel. Will let you know what the long-term results are as I put on some miles .
Update on brake dust issue. I decided to install a set of Hawk Performance Ceramic Pads and actually did it myself. Not being a mechanic it was actually pretty easy. Found a couple of great You Tube videos.
I put on 150 miles last Sunday and so far I am very pleased. Definitely much less dust and great stopping power, and pedal feel. Will let you know what the long-term results are as I put on some miles .
Very nice FD! I have been planning on doing the same as you did using the same pads. I have to wait about a month before I can pick up my new GS at the NCM. First thing I do will be doing is replacing the pads with Hawk ceramics. I have a question for you, does a new Corvette come with a lug wrench? I know it's a 19 mm lug just not sure if the wrench is included. Anyway, is there a bedding procedure you will perform on these brakes?
St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15-'16-'17-'18-'19-'20-'21-'22-'23-'24
Originally Posted by MMD
Very nice FD! I have been planning on doing the same as you did using the same pads. I have to wait about a month before I can pick up my new GS at the NCM. First thing I do will be doing is replacing the pads with Hawk ceramics. I have a question for you, does a new Corvette come with a lug wrench? I know it's a 19 mm lug just not sure if the wrench is included. Anyway, is there a bedding procedure you will perform on these brakes?
No it doesn't come with a lug wrench just a key for the wheel locks. It is a 19mm and if you plan on removing the wheels occasionally I would recommend that you invest in a 1/2 in drive Torque wrench. The Harbor freight version works very well and is more than adequate for a backyard mechanic, and very reasonable. I did bed my pads by performing the following procedure. From 40 mph to 10 mph rolling stops 6 times in a row not letting the brakes cool, then 35 to 5 mph 6 times in a row and you should be all set. Good luck.
No it doesn't come with a lug wrench just a key for the wheel locks. It is a 19mm and if you plan on removing the wheels occasionally I would recommend that you invest in a 1/2 in drive Torque wrench. The Harbor freight version works very well and is more than adequate for a backyard mechanic, and very reasonable. I did bed my pads by performing the following procedure. From 40 mph to 10 mph rolling stops 6 times in a row not letting the brakes cool, then 35 to 5 mph 6 times in a row and you should be all set. Good luck.
Thanks for you're reply. Good info and I'll save this post. One last question, did the car come equipped with the wheels locks or did you order them when you bought your ride?
St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15-'16-'17-'18-'19-'20-'21-'22-'23-'24
Originally Posted by MMD
Thanks for you're reply. Good info and I'll save this post. One last question, did the car come equipped with the wheels locks or did you order them when you bought your ride?
Wheel locks are a dealer installed option. GM uses McGard with their logo on the package. That is my preferred brand but I buy the exact same locks from Amazon for ~40% less.
As mentioned it does not come with a lug wrench or jack. If all you plann to do is rotate tires then an inexpensive Harbor Freight hydraulic jack will do. You’ll need two jack pads and short jack stands as well as the torque wrench suggested. Lots of Threads on jacking the C7.
I would recommend trying the OEM pads on your car before switching. Doesn't cost anything to try them. I found that the brake dust problem is essentially a non issue on the Z51 (same pads). I used to get a little dust on the Miata but just wiped it every couple weeks. No corrosion, no staining. With the Z51, same thing. Just drove 80 miles city/highway mix and I couldn't notice any dust on the wheels (painted silver color). If wipe my finger, some dust is there. Just not objectionable at all (to me).
I love the way the OEM brakes stop the car. Not worth it for me at this point to switch. Your mileage may vary.
08-18-2018, 01:24 PM
