Houston we have a problem... new damaged car
09-14-2018, 01:02 AM
#161
Intermediate
What a crock of BS, Montanaman I am with you.
Not disclosing a damaged and repaired vehicle titled as new is the worst in honesty and morality.
I considered looking at cars at Dave Smith Motors, specifically a new pickup next year.
Guess what, after this story, there is one sale they have lost.
Keep the faith and if they rectify and change course then good on em, but I don't see it happening.
Total BS, I would be furious... those of you that wouldn't be upset are not being honest or your simply roll over when a wrong occurs...
Total Total Total BS!
Not disclosing a damaged and repaired vehicle titled as new is the worst in honesty and morality.
I considered looking at cars at Dave Smith Motors, specifically a new pickup next year.
Guess what, after this story, there is one sale they have lost.
Keep the faith and if they rectify and change course then good on em, but I don't see it happening.
Total BS, I would be furious... those of you that wouldn't be upset are not being honest or your simply roll over when a wrong occurs...
Total Total Total BS!
09-14-2018, 08:31 AM
#162
Melting Slicks
I think we would all be upset in the OP's situation. That said, as noted several times, cars getting damaged in shipping is not uncommon. Sometimes even at the factory. They are all repaired and sold as new. Not disclosing, within the law, is not unique to this dealer. I think you would be hard pressed to find any dealer that discloses all work done on new vehicles. We just found out about this one.
I think we all, as consumers feel like disclosing damage even amounts under the law is the "right" thing to do. That unfortunately is not how this business works. Many times the sales person probably doesn't even know the car was damaged and repaired. Outside of the Corvette lifers we have as some great selling and sponsoring dealers here, many sales people are not that invested in their role to follow the history of every vehicle on the lot -- or to look out for the conusmer's best interest, particularly when it is counter to theirs.
I think we all, as consumers feel like disclosing damage even amounts under the law is the "right" thing to do. That unfortunately is not how this business works. Many times the sales person probably doesn't even know the car was damaged and repaired. Outside of the Corvette lifers we have as some great selling and sponsoring dealers here, many sales people are not that invested in their role to follow the history of every vehicle on the lot -- or to look out for the conusmer's best interest, particularly when it is counter to theirs.
09-14-2018, 09:06 AM
#163
Drifting
I'm gonna be as unpopular as a turd in a swimmin' pool...
I read about half the initial post by the OP with sympathy; then I read the rest of the thread (and the rest of his post) for its' (humorous) entertainment (to me).
It's obvious that a lotta folks don't know how dealerships are structured, with various writers posting the procedures they'd either take or expect in a "soured" dealer transaction. Several things come to mind, flooding my thoughts with an 'overlap' of "deniable" actions.
The OP "detailed" the car on the showroom floor looking for flaws and found one one the bumper which he leveraged for a $20,000 discount. (I didn't read the entire thread, but I got that far.) In his post revealing the discount he negotiated, (paraphrasing) he claimed it would have been a great discount had the car been pristine/"brand new". Somehow, this discount is no longer enviable because the flaws he couldn't find were revealed solely by documentation from the dealer(!!). HE couldn't find it, and an inspection by a professional painter didn't find any flaws in the repairs.
I was an auto-painter in NorCal's largest Chevy/Honda/Lexus dealership for a spell and painted cars for 12 years. I taught auto painting as a course at the local trade school. I've got experience writing repair orders, assessing damage, and dealing with transport/lot damage. As much as there is outrage over the business practice of unreported repairs, it is not only common, but legal. I wouldn't doubt it if it was claimed that 20% of all the paint work in my former shop was "transport/lot damage". Shipping is different now, but back in my day, they were shipped on open railroad cars. LOTS of vandalism damage from rocks, eggs, etc. done by kids on the rolling stock.
Dealers don't separate loss by 'body', 'paint' or 'mechanical'... they're tallied as line items and totaled out; the owners only care about taxable profit/loss totals. On the showroom floor, only the (specific) shop foreman and the repair technician would ever know which car was fixed. Body/Paint repair orders don't follow the car to the floor; they're sent to Accounting. The sales force doesn't care how much the "overhead" was changed on a single vehicle, nor would they even know or hear about it unless it was common knowledge because of a spectacular accident/incident. Most, like the OP, couldn't find a repair if you pointed it out unless you explained to the viewer what s/he was looking at.
To claim that the dealership is somehow "liable" for some perceived slight is naive at best. (By "perceived slight", I mean that the OP never found any of the other repairs aside from the bumper; it took a pro to tell him that the documention confirmed what the pro couldn't detect--that there had been repairs done.) So... WHAT loss in resale value?? The Carfax didn't specify any body damage, the OP missed 'all' of it, and the pro he took it to couldn't find fault.
It was good for the morning laugh to read this thread; all his fuming and threatening, ranting about Euro cars, Ford, etc., etc. Jimmy crack corn. What's all that got to do with the price of a discounted white Corvette? Go to a gun store- how do you know that "new" gun hasn't been back to the OEM for repairs because the dealer found fault? (and you'll never know) Go to a furniture store... they'll never tell you if the showroom leather recliner had to be cleaned for transportation damage (grease, soda pop, mustard, anything)- it's all sold as new despite a thousand butts (and kids) testing/rocking the chair. Go to the grocery store and buy a jar of grape jam. Who's to say the lid at its' seal hasn't been wiped down with some dirty old rag because another jar broke and ants swarmed it for days until it was detected- buy a can of soup... who can say absolutely that the employees in the back haven't stood on the cans climbing inventory to get to something else that was stacked higher? Still sold as new, and for most ya'll, you opened it at home without a thought as that lid top that falls into your soup has been walked on by shoes that have been who knows where... "new".
Yeah, it's a $60-100,000 car. Flagship and all, "I'M BUYING A CORVETTE AND I EXPECT MORE". Um, I don't think so. It's a commodity; sold for profit by strangers to strangers. Laws have been created to define minimal sales conduct; whether the potential buyer likes the idea of undeclared "refurbished" goods or not, it's legally ethical to repair damaged products (up to a point) and sell them as new. And when he missed it all and thought he was getting a deal that even Carfax didn't reveal, it was all good.
Ah, entitlement... as a former professional painter with a completely different insight, that what it seems like; and the "complaint"/responses were a lot of fun to read. Flame suit on.
I read about half the initial post by the OP with sympathy; then I read the rest of the thread (and the rest of his post) for its' (humorous) entertainment (to me).
It's obvious that a lotta folks don't know how dealerships are structured, with various writers posting the procedures they'd either take or expect in a "soured" dealer transaction. Several things come to mind, flooding my thoughts with an 'overlap' of "deniable" actions.
The OP "detailed" the car on the showroom floor looking for flaws and found one one the bumper which he leveraged for a $20,000 discount. (I didn't read the entire thread, but I got that far.) In his post revealing the discount he negotiated, (paraphrasing) he claimed it would have been a great discount had the car been pristine/"brand new". Somehow, this discount is no longer enviable because the flaws he couldn't find were revealed solely by documentation from the dealer(!!). HE couldn't find it, and an inspection by a professional painter didn't find any flaws in the repairs.
I was an auto-painter in NorCal's largest Chevy/Honda/Lexus dealership for a spell and painted cars for 12 years. I taught auto painting as a course at the local trade school. I've got experience writing repair orders, assessing damage, and dealing with transport/lot damage. As much as there is outrage over the business practice of unreported repairs, it is not only common, but legal. I wouldn't doubt it if it was claimed that 20% of all the paint work in my former shop was "transport/lot damage". Shipping is different now, but back in my day, they were shipped on open railroad cars. LOTS of vandalism damage from rocks, eggs, etc. done by kids on the rolling stock.
Dealers don't separate loss by 'body', 'paint' or 'mechanical'... they're tallied as line items and totaled out; the owners only care about taxable profit/loss totals. On the showroom floor, only the (specific) shop foreman and the repair technician would ever know which car was fixed. Body/Paint repair orders don't follow the car to the floor; they're sent to Accounting. The sales force doesn't care how much the "overhead" was changed on a single vehicle, nor would they even know or hear about it unless it was common knowledge because of a spectacular accident/incident. Most, like the OP, couldn't find a repair if you pointed it out unless you explained to the viewer what s/he was looking at.
To claim that the dealership is somehow "liable" for some perceived slight is naive at best. (By "perceived slight", I mean that the OP never found any of the other repairs aside from the bumper; it took a pro to tell him that the documention confirmed what the pro couldn't detect--that there had been repairs done.) So... WHAT loss in resale value?? The Carfax didn't specify any body damage, the OP missed 'all' of it, and the pro he took it to couldn't find fault.
It was good for the morning laugh to read this thread; all his fuming and threatening, ranting about Euro cars, Ford, etc., etc. Jimmy crack corn. What's all that got to do with the price of a discounted white Corvette? Go to a gun store- how do you know that "new" gun hasn't been back to the OEM for repairs because the dealer found fault? (and you'll never know) Go to a furniture store... they'll never tell you if the showroom leather recliner had to be cleaned for transportation damage (grease, soda pop, mustard, anything)- it's all sold as new despite a thousand butts (and kids) testing/rocking the chair. Go to the grocery store and buy a jar of grape jam. Who's to say the lid at its' seal hasn't been wiped down with some dirty old rag because another jar broke and ants swarmed it for days until it was detected- buy a can of soup... who can say absolutely that the employees in the back haven't stood on the cans climbing inventory to get to something else that was stacked higher? Still sold as new, and for most ya'll, you opened it at home without a thought as that lid top that falls into your soup has been walked on by shoes that have been who knows where... "new".
Yeah, it's a $60-100,000 car. Flagship and all, "I'M BUYING A CORVETTE AND I EXPECT MORE". Um, I don't think so. It's a commodity; sold for profit by strangers to strangers. Laws have been created to define minimal sales conduct; whether the potential buyer likes the idea of undeclared "refurbished" goods or not, it's legally ethical to repair damaged products (up to a point) and sell them as new. And when he missed it all and thought he was getting a deal that even Carfax didn't reveal, it was all good.
Ah, entitlement... as a former professional painter with a completely different insight, that what it seems like; and the "complaint"/responses were a lot of fun to read. Flame suit on.
Last edited by dork; 09-14-2018 at 09:24 AM.
09-14-2018, 09:52 AM
#164
Racer
Thread Starter
I would not have purchased the car unless I had a full independent body shop inspect the car FIRST and they said it was all perfectly repaired. And then the price would have had to come down a bit more.
09-14-2018, 10:04 AM
#165
Racer
Thread Starter
I'm gonna be as unpopular as a turd in a swimmin' pool...
I read about half the initial post by the OP with sympathy; then I read the rest of the thread (and the rest of his post) for its' (humorous) entertainment (to me).
It's obvious that a lotta folks don't know how dealerships are structured, with various writers posting the procedures they'd either take or expect in a "soured" dealer transaction. Several things come to mind, flooding my thoughts with an 'overlap' of "deniable" actions.
The OP "detailed" the car on the showroom floor looking for flaws and found one one the bumper which he leveraged for a $20,000 discount. (I didn't read the entire thread, but I got that far.) In his post revealing the discount he negotiated, (paraphrasing) he claimed it would have been a great discount had the car been pristine/"brand new". Somehow, this discount is no longer enviable because the flaws he couldn't find were revealed solely by documentation from the dealer(!!). HE couldn't find it, and an inspection by a professional painter didn't find any flaws in the repairs.
I was an auto-painter in NorCal's largest Chevy/Honda/Lexus dealership for a spell and painted cars for 12 years. I taught auto painting as a course at the local trade school. I've got experience writing repair orders, assessing damage, and dealing with transport/lot damage. As much as there is outrage over the business practice of unreported repairs, it is not only common, but legal. I wouldn't doubt it if it was claimed that 20% of all the paint work in my former shop was "transport/lot damage". Shipping is different now, but back in my day, they were shipped on open railroad cars. LOTS of vandalism damage from rocks, eggs, etc. done by kids on the rolling stock.
Dealers don't separate loss by 'body', 'paint' or 'mechanical'... they're tallied as line items and totaled out; the owners only care about taxable profit/loss totals. On the showroom floor, only the (specific) shop foreman and the repair technician would ever know which car was fixed. Body/Paint repair orders don't follow the car to the floor; they're sent to Accounting. The sales force doesn't care how much the "overhead" was changed on a single vehicle, nor would they even know or hear about it unless it was common knowledge because of a spectacular accident/incident. Most, like the OP, couldn't find a repair if you pointed it out unless you explained to the viewer what s/he was looking at.
To claim that the dealership is somehow "liable" for some perceived slight is naive at best. (By "perceived slight", I mean that the OP never found any of the other repairs aside from the bumper; it took a pro to tell him that the documention confirmed what the pro couldn't detect--that there had been repairs done.) So... WHAT loss in resale value?? The Carfax didn't specify any body damage, the OP missed 'all' of it, and the pro he took it to couldn't find fault.
It was good for the morning laugh to read this thread; all his fuming and threatening, ranting about Euro cars, Ford, etc., etc. Jimmy crack corn. What's all that got to do with the price of a discounted white Corvette? Go to a gun store- how do you know that "new" gun hasn't been back to the OEM for repairs because the dealer found fault? (and you'll never know) Go to a furniture store... they'll never tell you if the showroom leather recliner had to be cleaned for transportation damage (grease, soda pop, mustard, anything)- it's all sold as new despite a thousand butts (and kids) testing/rocking the chair. Go to the grocery store and buy a jar of grape jam. Who's to say the lid at its' seal hasn't been wiped down with some dirty old rag because another jar broke and ants swarmed it for days until it was detected- buy a can of soup... who can say absolutely that the employees in the back haven't stood on the cans climbing inventory to get to something else that was stacked higher? Still sold as new, and for most ya'll, you opened it at home without a thought as that lid top that falls into your soup has been walked on by shoes that have been who knows where... "new".
Yeah, it's a $60-100,000 car. Flagship and all, "I'M BUYING A CORVETTE AND I EXPECT MORE". Um, I don't think so. It's a commodity; sold for profit by strangers to strangers. Laws have been created to define minimal sales conduct; whether the potential buyer likes the idea of undeclared "refurbished" goods or not, it's legally ethical to repair damaged products (up to a point) and sell them as new. And when he missed it all and thought he was getting a deal that even Carfax didn't reveal, it was all good.
Ah, entitlement... as a former professional painter with a completely different insight, that what it seems like; and the "complaint"/responses were a lot of fun to read. Flame suit on.
I read about half the initial post by the OP with sympathy; then I read the rest of the thread (and the rest of his post) for its' (humorous) entertainment (to me).
It's obvious that a lotta folks don't know how dealerships are structured, with various writers posting the procedures they'd either take or expect in a "soured" dealer transaction. Several things come to mind, flooding my thoughts with an 'overlap' of "deniable" actions.
The OP "detailed" the car on the showroom floor looking for flaws and found one one the bumper which he leveraged for a $20,000 discount. (I didn't read the entire thread, but I got that far.) In his post revealing the discount he negotiated, (paraphrasing) he claimed it would have been a great discount had the car been pristine/"brand new". Somehow, this discount is no longer enviable because the flaws he couldn't find were revealed solely by documentation from the dealer(!!). HE couldn't find it, and an inspection by a professional painter didn't find any flaws in the repairs.
I was an auto-painter in NorCal's largest Chevy/Honda/Lexus dealership for a spell and painted cars for 12 years. I taught auto painting as a course at the local trade school. I've got experience writing repair orders, assessing damage, and dealing with transport/lot damage. As much as there is outrage over the business practice of unreported repairs, it is not only common, but legal. I wouldn't doubt it if it was claimed that 20% of all the paint work in my former shop was "transport/lot damage". Shipping is different now, but back in my day, they were shipped on open railroad cars. LOTS of vandalism damage from rocks, eggs, etc. done by kids on the rolling stock.
Dealers don't separate loss by 'body', 'paint' or 'mechanical'... they're tallied as line items and totaled out; the owners only care about taxable profit/loss totals. On the showroom floor, only the (specific) shop foreman and the repair technician would ever know which car was fixed. Body/Paint repair orders don't follow the car to the floor; they're sent to Accounting. The sales force doesn't care how much the "overhead" was changed on a single vehicle, nor would they even know or hear about it unless it was common knowledge because of a spectacular accident/incident. Most, like the OP, couldn't find a repair if you pointed it out unless you explained to the viewer what s/he was looking at.
To claim that the dealership is somehow "liable" for some perceived slight is naive at best. (By "perceived slight", I mean that the OP never found any of the other repairs aside from the bumper; it took a pro to tell him that the documention confirmed what the pro couldn't detect--that there had been repairs done.) So... WHAT loss in resale value?? The Carfax didn't specify any body damage, the OP missed 'all' of it, and the pro he took it to couldn't find fault.
It was good for the morning laugh to read this thread; all his fuming and threatening, ranting about Euro cars, Ford, etc., etc. Jimmy crack corn. What's all that got to do with the price of a discounted white Corvette? Go to a gun store- how do you know that "new" gun hasn't been back to the OEM for repairs because the dealer found fault? (and you'll never know) Go to a furniture store... they'll never tell you if the showroom leather recliner had to be cleaned for transportation damage (grease, soda pop, mustard, anything)- it's all sold as new despite a thousand butts (and kids) testing/rocking the chair. Go to the grocery store and buy a jar of grape jam. Who's to say the lid at its' seal hasn't been wiped down with some dirty old rag because another jar broke and ants swarmed it for days until it was detected- buy a can of soup... who can say absolutely that the employees in the back haven't stood on the cans climbing inventory to get to something else that was stacked higher? Still sold as new, and for most ya'll, you opened it at home without a thought as that lid top that falls into your soup has been walked on by shoes that have been who knows where... "new".
Yeah, it's a $60-100,000 car. Flagship and all, "I'M BUYING A CORVETTE AND I EXPECT MORE". Um, I don't think so. It's a commodity; sold for profit by strangers to strangers. Laws have been created to define minimal sales conduct; whether the potential buyer likes the idea of undeclared "refurbished" goods or not, it's legally ethical to repair damaged products (up to a point) and sell them as new. And when he missed it all and thought he was getting a deal that even Carfax didn't reveal, it was all good.
Ah, entitlement... as a former professional painter with a completely different insight, that what it seems like; and the "complaint"/responses were a lot of fun to read. Flame suit on.
09-14-2018, 10:35 AM
#166
Racer
Thread Starter
California law (biggest state) is 3% of total value or anything in excess of $500.00. That's just a little bit different from Idaho's 6%. Arizona is also 3% so much less. I'm not interested in wasting time looking at the other 48 states but you probably already know since it's such a great curtain to hide behind so please enlighten if you can.
09-14-2018, 10:49 AM
#167
Racer
Thread Starter
One of the reasons I shared this story is to possibly help other buyers. I should start a "sticky poll" called... "How many new Corvette buyers will now pull a Carfax and take extra steps to find out if there has been body damage repair done to their new car". I'd bet there would be a few takers.
The following 2 users liked this post by montanaman:
Corvette_Outlaw (09-16-2018),
JDSKY (09-14-2018)
09-14-2018, 10:55 AM
#168
What's pathetic is that they are legally allowed to hide damage repairs to a brand new vehicle - just goes to show how politicians usually side with big business over the best interests of the consumer.
09-14-2018, 11:08 AM
#169
California law (biggest state) is 3% of total value or anything in excess of $500.00. That's just a little bit different from Idaho's 6%. Arizona is also 3% so much less. I'm not interested in wasting time looking at the other 48 states but you probably already know since it's such a great curtain to hide behind so please enlighten if you can.
You really need to get over yourself. I know how difficult it is to accept the fact that an idiot sales-force and a Bimbo salesperson (your words not mine) screwed you to the wall as smart as you are. After you created a scene in the showroom microscopically examining the car and trying to negotiate the price, they delivered you a two year old car that had been run over by a snow plow (also your words)!
It seems to me you now have two choices. One, you can learn to love what you got and forget about something that means nothing. Two, you can spend that money you claimed you had to sue the dealer before you learned there was actually a law about this situation. I am sure you can find an Idaho attorney who will take your cash. But, one would be the sane choice!
09-14-2018, 11:23 AM
#170
Race Director
Different states, different laws. But, the only one that counts is the one in Montana for your case.
You really need to get over yourself. I know how difficult it is to accept the fact that an idiot sales-force and a Bimbo salesperson (your words not mine) screwed you to the wall as smart as you are. After you created a scene in the showroom microscopically examining the car and trying to negotiate the price, they delivered you a two year old car that had been run over by a snow plow (also your words)!
It seems to me you now have two choices. One, you can learn to love what you got and forget about something that means nothing. Two, you can spend that money you claimed you had to sue the dealer before you learned there was actually a law about this situation. I am sure you can find an Idaho attorney who will take your cash. But, one would be the sane choice!
You really need to get over yourself. I know how difficult it is to accept the fact that an idiot sales-force and a Bimbo salesperson (your words not mine) screwed you to the wall as smart as you are. After you created a scene in the showroom microscopically examining the car and trying to negotiate the price, they delivered you a two year old car that had been run over by a snow plow (also your words)!
It seems to me you now have two choices. One, you can learn to love what you got and forget about something that means nothing. Two, you can spend that money you claimed you had to sue the dealer before you learned there was actually a law about this situation. I am sure you can find an Idaho attorney who will take your cash. But, one would be the sane choice!
09-14-2018, 11:53 AM
#171
Drifting
Wow thanks for such a thorough dissertation on the way the consumer world works. Comparing a can of soup to a 70,000 car really makes a lot of sense. There are items sold everyday that are sold as "seconds" or imperfect and you know that going in. Not disclosing significant damage on a new car is bullshit. Legal or not. And based on your beliefs you would be fine if you bought a $100,000 new car with 6k in undisclosed damage? I guess that makes you the smarter, better man.
And yes, years ago I ground Doten Pontiac/Honda by 20% for the orange peel on a fender and door with my claim that they had been repainted. I benefited by inflating a 3% repaired "second" into a 20% discount. "3% damages" was the limit in my state and undisclosed;(unknown by the sales staff, actually) until they took the time to research my claim.
Sooo... yeah, So by percentages, I guess I am fine with buying a "second" on a straight line (state maximum) percentage basis. And I've done it understanding that I had one bite at the apple. You should read my "thorough dissertation" more thoroughly for content.
Last edited by dork; 09-14-2018 at 11:55 AM.
The following users liked this post:
speedlink (09-17-2018)
09-14-2018, 12:10 PM
#172
To be fair, I think most dealers would do this. If you don't like the situation, I think the problem is with law makers who allow dealerships to legally operate like this. The answer is to make sure you are voting for politicians who support consumer protections over big business.
09-14-2018, 12:11 PM
#173
As other experts (and my attorney) have said I don't have much if any case here because they are using the 6% exclusion to get them out of a sticky situation. Actually having the damage repair invoices probably worked against me and pushed them to that spot. If nothing else they got their cage rattled with a legal notice. That said the internet is an incredibly effective way to spread information good or bad. Social media and car forums are both effective ways to let other potential consumers know who and what to avoid. If I can cost them even one sale I'll settle for a moral victory.
One of the reasons I shared this story is to possibly help other buyers. I should start a "sticky poll" called... "How many new Corvette buyers will now pull a Carfax and take extra steps to find out if there has been body damage repair done to their new car". I'd bet there would be a few takers.
One of the reasons I shared this story is to possibly help other buyers. I should start a "sticky poll" called... "How many new Corvette buyers will now pull a Carfax and take extra steps to find out if there has been body damage repair done to their new car". I'd bet there would be a few takers.
09-14-2018, 12:29 PM
#174
Safety Car
I'm gonna be as unpopular as a turd in a swimmin' pool...
I read about half the initial post by the OP with sympathy; then I read the rest of the thread (and the rest of his post) for its' (humorous) entertainment (to me).
It's obvious that a lotta folks don't know how dealerships are structured, with various writers posting the procedures they'd either take or expect in a "soured" dealer transaction. Several things come to mind, flooding my thoughts with an 'overlap' of "deniable" actions.
The OP "detailed" the car on the showroom floor looking for flaws and found one one the bumper which he leveraged for a $20,000 discount. (I didn't read the entire thread, but I got that far.) In his post revealing the discount he negotiated, (paraphrasing) he claimed it would have been a great discount had the car been pristine/"brand new". Somehow, this discount is no longer enviable because the flaws he couldn't find were revealed solely by documentation from the dealer(!!). HE couldn't find it, and an inspection by a professional painter didn't find any flaws in the repairs.
Yadda . . .
I read about half the initial post by the OP with sympathy; then I read the rest of the thread (and the rest of his post) for its' (humorous) entertainment (to me).
It's obvious that a lotta folks don't know how dealerships are structured, with various writers posting the procedures they'd either take or expect in a "soured" dealer transaction. Several things come to mind, flooding my thoughts with an 'overlap' of "deniable" actions.
The OP "detailed" the car on the showroom floor looking for flaws and found one one the bumper which he leveraged for a $20,000 discount. (I didn't read the entire thread, but I got that far.) In his post revealing the discount he negotiated, (paraphrasing) he claimed it would have been a great discount had the car been pristine/"brand new". Somehow, this discount is no longer enviable because the flaws he couldn't find were revealed solely by documentation from the dealer(!!). HE couldn't find it, and an inspection by a professional painter didn't find any flaws in the repairs.
Yadda . . .
09-14-2018, 12:46 PM
#175
Race Director
To be fair, I think most dealers would do this. If you don't like the situation, I think the problem is with law makers who allow dealerships to legally operate like this. The answer is to make sure you are voting for politicians who support consumer protections over big business.
Think about the repercussions of the dealer following the letter of the law instead of respecting the ethical facet of this transaction.
I for one will never buy anything from these people. Now look how many others have read this thread.
How has the dealer helped themselves ?
It seems like they screwed themselves at least a little, while screwing someone else.
I see this as stupid business.
09-14-2018, 01:19 PM
#176
Melting Slicks
Definitely a stupid business practice protected by the law.
Like it or not I think this thread has been a very useful one and if nothing else has opened some eyes a bit more including my own. It has also been a target for some mostly those where **** like this has enabled them to put food on their table.
My wife won't step foot on a auto dealers lot anymore. For her, and even for me lately, its just barely better than getting surgery or having a tooth pulled. Going in you know your'e gonna get hurt, you just have no idea how much or exactly how bad its gonna be....
Like it or not I think this thread has been a very useful one and if nothing else has opened some eyes a bit more including my own. It has also been a target for some mostly those where **** like this has enabled them to put food on their table.
My wife won't step foot on a auto dealers lot anymore. For her, and even for me lately, its just barely better than getting surgery or having a tooth pulled. Going in you know your'e gonna get hurt, you just have no idea how much or exactly how bad its gonna be....
09-14-2018, 01:20 PM
#177
You don't need laws to make you do what's right. You can make the right decisions all by yourself.
Think about the repercussions of the dealer following the letter of the law instead of respecting the ethical facet of this transaction.
I for one will never buy anything from these people. Now look how many others have read this thread.
How has the dealer helped themselves ?
It seems like they screwed themselves at least a little, while screwing someone else.
I see this as stupid business.
Think about the repercussions of the dealer following the letter of the law instead of respecting the ethical facet of this transaction.
I for one will never buy anything from these people. Now look how many others have read this thread.
How has the dealer helped themselves ?
It seems like they screwed themselves at least a little, while screwing someone else.
I see this as stupid business.
09-14-2018, 01:49 PM
#178
Race Director
A good salesman (any salesman really) would have incorporated the story of the snow damage into the story of the discount.
This could have been a good deal for both sides.
But, shorted sighted relics from the past, sometimes don't see what's right in front of them.
Last edited by PatternDayTrader; 09-14-2018 at 01:50 PM.
09-14-2018, 03:22 PM
#179
On another C7 forum thread, Pattern Day Trader advised that the Carfax was totally worthless,, and to ignore ever pulling a Carfax report on any car you intend to buy. That's the kind buyer every dealer wants.
09-14-2018, 03:25 PM
#180