Gearhead Jim

JerryU

^^
What is neat about the current Mobil 1 $12 rebate/5 quart Jug is you can keep the original purchase receipts. It shows what was purchased. Walmart had the AC PF-64 filter as well. I scan and send a PDF or jpg file. Can take pic with your phone if desired and just attach to their Internet form. The oil receipts also show the date and although no proof it was changed with all of them I keep in an envelop with my Owner's Manual it does show a consistent pattern.

Although I have been successful getting GM to pay for a clutch pressure plate and more recently a hole in an AC condenser on my C6 they initially said "could be" caused by a rock, why take a chance. For the condenser, I paid $800 and after showing with pics the hole was from the inside, they reimbursed the full amount!

raylo

But... many of us don't drive in winter and when I do I start and finish from my insulated garage so 5W low end is just fine. The tires are far more of limiting factor than the 5W. This Valvoline is a great alternative for most of us and available locally at Advance Auto and Walmart.


Re: Valvoline 5W-40 Dexos 2

Cjunkie

Frosty

"You seem to be saying “5W-40 work ok”.
I agree.
You also seem to be saying “GM and their lawyers won’t care”.
I disagree.
They have a well established history of denying warranty claims on cars with any power train computer tunes and don’t give a hoot if the tune was unrelated to the failure. They could get just as picky with the oil if they want.

The chances of of having an expensive engine problem and GM denying coverage due to the oil are small but not zero.
Using one of the specified oils is easy."

I totally disagree. You are conflating two totally different issues. Tunes make significant changes to the firmware that govern engine operating parameters. That is an obvious example of where the warranty could be impacted as this is considered a modification.

With regards to most likely the creation of the Magnusom Moss Warranty act it has become common knowledge that a warranty claim will not be denied as long as one complies with the requirements specifically written in the owners manual. Unless otherwise specifically precluded in writing, using 5W-40 oil that meets GM specifications cannot be grounds for denying a warranty claim. In addition if something like a specific engine oil is required to keep the manufacturer warranty in effect, it should be provided free of charge to the consumer. You cannot force a consumer to spend more money to keep the warranty in effect. Thus requiring the Mobil 1 brand to be used would not be a requirement to keep the warranty in effect unless specifically stated in the owners manual and provided to the consumer free from charge. It is recommended, but that is as far as GM can go.

Cjunkie

The HACK

Story time.

BMW used to specify that ONLY Castrol TWS 10W-60 can be used in their S designate engines in the Ms since 2000 time frame*. So dutifully I paid $15-17 a quart at least once a year for the liquid gold to be filled in the engine's crank in my little Z4 M Coupe. Actually, BMW doesn't even say "recommended." They say "REQUIRED" in their dealer communications and in the owner's manual too. Reason being, the S54 and on up engines (S62, S64, S65, S85...etc) during the early 2000 to early 2010, all the naturally aspirated BMW M engines have exceedingly TIGHT tolerances in the bearing. So tight that at higher operating temperatures the thinner oil that used to be "okay" for BMW M engines (on the S50/S52 E36 M3s in the 90s, for example), like a xW-30 or xW-40, gets too thin at the stratospheric RPMs and piston velocities that these engines operate in that it gets squeezed out of the bearings and BOOM. Engine bearing failure. For a point of reference, early S54s equipped on E46 M3s in 2001-2003, as well as S54 equipped Z3 M Coupes, were grinding themselves during the warranty period enough that BMW basically laid down the law and say that anyone putting anything other than the Castrol TWS 10W-60 in these engines, and the engine blows? We're not covering it.

So Castrol was reaping the reward of partnering with BMW for the scarcity and the specific application made the TWS 10W-60 like liquid gold. At one point dealerships charged $25-30 per bottle, causing a 5.5 liter oil change to cost well over $200 with oil ALONE. For those of us outside of the service contract period, it's a tough pill to swallow. Especially when you tack on dealer service fees and up-charges it can cost as much as $500 for a simple oil change on a BMW M car in the mid 2000s.

Eventually BMW soured on the relationship with Castrol and went to Shell for their lubrication relationship in the mid 201x. All of a sudden, now, ANY 10W-60 oil will do for those same engines. In fact, BMW even loosened the weight requirement to where some 15W-50 weight oil are acceptable, as long as it meets BMW LL-01 (think DEXOS 1) standard. I've since switched to Lubro Moly 10W-60, which IS BMW LL-01 approved AND cost me $60 for a 5qt bottle and 2x 1qt bottles.

As it FURTHER turns out, the problem with the early S54 engines were primarily due to improperly engineered lubricant passage leading to oil starvation of the bearings at high engine speeds. Lubrication had little to do with why they were blowing up (well, lack of lubrication was the "why") but it was a good excuse for BMW to deny warranty to anyone not using the Castrol TWS 10W-60.

So what does this have to do with GM and Corvette's oil?

The owner's manual did not specify "REQUIRE." Nor does the owner's manual say you can only use Mobil 1 branded DEXOS 2 ESP oil. The owner's manual only recommends Mobil 1. And the owner's manual specifies a SAE viscosity grade for each engine (LT1, LT4, LT5 etc), but all language related to it says "recommends" or "recommended." To my untrained, non-legal eye, it means anything that meets GM's specifications (like, oh, say, ACDelco DEXOS1 synthetic BLEND, as specified in the owner's manual) for DEXOS certification, 0W or 5W for winter operation, all the way up to 15W for warmer climates, and 30 weight for street use, but 40 weight for track and competitive use for LT1 and LT4 and 50 weight for LT5 is acceptable. While GM "recommends" Mobil 1, they actually use ACDelco fill at the dealership AND from the factory up until 2019 production.

So while the 0W-40 DEXOS 2 Mobil 1 ESP is the preferred fill from 2019 on, and it's backwards compatible for older C7s, it is NOT a mandatory fill. The only stipulation is that the 0W-40 and the 15W-50 is mandatory for TRACK use as Chevy/GM uses the word "MUST" in the owner's manual for each respective engine. The 0W-40 is backwards compatible for 2019s and before for track use and street use. This means any 40 weight DEXOS certified oil is acceptable for track use (since the xW- is the winter weight) and for warm climates, 5W-40 is acceptable for street use and track use provided that it's DEXOS certified.

As for GM denying warranty if it's not Mobil 1 0W-40 ESP DEXOS 2 fill, I fail to see how that can be enforced. Heck before 2019 no Corvette, be it base Stingray, Z51, Grand Sport, or Z06 came filled with the 0W-40 ESP.

Gearhead Jim

Everyone gets to make their own choices.

In our 2017 and the 2019 Owner Manual, they don't "recommend" oil weights, they simply say "use" what they tell you. They say, depending on situation and year: 0W-40, 5W-30, 15W-50 (and 0W-30 for our 2017 below -20'F). They do not list any 5W-40.
The listed oil viscosities been tested and approved by GM for our engine, work well, and are easy for me to get.
I have no interest in using something that others think will be ok or think GM will accept if you have problems. Probably, everything would be ok. But I prefer to bet on the sure thing.

Patman

Shake your head all you want, but you're providing inaccurate information, so I corrected you on it. The European Car Formula 0w40 does not provide more protection over the ESP version, and if GM thought it was ok to use in the Corvette it would be factory fill over the ESP Formula. Or maybe you think you know better than GM now?

Frosty

Doesn't a 5W-40 oil have a broader temperature applicability range than a 5W30? IMHO, a higher upper viscosity weight of 40W is going to be generally more applicable for use in the hot summer weather of Florida than a 30W oil will. If the factory fill is 5W-30, then what could possibly be considered detrimental with using a 5W-40 for daily driving? Please tell me. It is intended to be an honest question.

Gearhead Jim

My answer is that sometimes GM is honest and even generous in their warranty interpretations, sometimes they are trickier than a bunch of Philadelphia lawyers. Hard to be sure which way they will go.
Since 5W-40 is not an authorized viscosity, they could hang their hat on that if they want to be dicks.
Fighting them in court could cost more than a new Corvette.

If the car is out of powertrain warranty due to age/miles/mods, then I would have no qualms about a Dexos2 ESP 5W-40 in your location. It might even be better in your application than any of the authorized oils.
If I had to bet one way or the other, I'd bet on GM not giving you a hard time over warranty. But as mentioned, I prefer to bet on the sure thing.

Enjoy your warm weather!