Lowering IAT's = FREE Horsepower
01-18-2017, 12:24 PM
#61
I have a TRIC on my C7 Z06 and it does leave many openings to the filter. This system is not a true Ram-Air system and Jim will be the first to point that out. Having said that i did notice a reduction in IAT1 while cruising once I installed the unit. I have also driven thru many heavy downpours (South Florida) and have seen little to no water upon removal of filter once I got home. I understand that Halltech needs to protect itself from all possible scenarios hence the disclaimer but imo if you use common sense you will be fine.
Last edited by rflow306; 01-18-2017 at 12:31 PM.
02-01-2017, 12:42 PM
#62
So I was posting another thread and was encouraged to write a review on how I attacked IAT's. We know GM runs the new LT1's hot. I typically was seeing 203-210 degrees water temps and easily climb to 215-220 in some good hot traffic. I live in Minnesota, so anyone South of here should see even better results. My car now runs 180-185 degrees F all day long. And even on those 90 + degree summer days I never seem to lose power. Now if someone can teach me how to log actual IAT's with my Diablo Intune I would be glad to do that. But will be next Spring
My motivation for this came from a another thread (I will try to find it) who did some testing and had data from IAT logging and times at the track. Heat soak is for real, and if you want to keep your HP all day long, this will help the cause. So here you go:
1. Coated headers. If you go with headers, spend the money and get them coated. My LG Super Pro's cost $245 locally with a guy who uses Cerma Krome. They look great and keeps temps down:
2. I wrapped the entire bottom and sides of my AFE cold air intake with Lava Shield. This stuff sticks on and I believe they said is good up to 1,000 F. Installed you can barely notice the it.
3. Wrapped lower radiator hose with an aluminum hose shield from Summit.
4. Removed plenum cover and blanket. This holds quite a bit of heat on top of the motor. You can screw back in the four bolts for the plenum cover and still use your coil covers.
5. Installed 170 T-stat from Summit. Be sure to read the threads about trimming the bottom edge of the spring so it seats properly and doesn't tear the gasket. I have mine on for 5,000 miles and it has been flawless.
6. Remove weatherstrip on cowling by back edge of the hood.
7. Heat socks for the spark plug wires.
My motivation for this came from a another thread (I will try to find it) who did some testing and had data from IAT logging and times at the track. Heat soak is for real, and if you want to keep your HP all day long, this will help the cause. So here you go:
1. Coated headers. If you go with headers, spend the money and get them coated. My LG Super Pro's cost $245 locally with a guy who uses Cerma Krome. They look great and keeps temps down:
2. I wrapped the entire bottom and sides of my AFE cold air intake with Lava Shield. This stuff sticks on and I believe they said is good up to 1,000 F. Installed you can barely notice the it.
3. Wrapped lower radiator hose with an aluminum hose shield from Summit.
4. Removed plenum cover and blanket. This holds quite a bit of heat on top of the motor. You can screw back in the four bolts for the plenum cover and still use your coil covers.
5. Installed 170 T-stat from Summit. Be sure to read the threads about trimming the bottom edge of the spring so it seats properly and doesn't tear the gasket. I have mine on for 5,000 miles and it has been flawless.
6. Remove weatherstrip on cowling by back edge of the hood.
7. Heat socks for the spark plug wires.
02-02-2017, 08:21 AM
#64
06-19-2017, 12:50 PM
#66
Reviving this thread. Although our opinions differ, there is good discussion here. I just pulled the 5 plastic covers off the top of the engine to see if it makes any difference in temperatures at the track. Also thought about removing the scoop from the radiator to the grille. I know it's for down force but at track speeds below 120, does it really matter? Or does force more air through the radiator by low pressure spots above the hood?
Anyone ever experiment with this?
Anyone ever experiment with this?
06-19-2017, 01:12 PM
#67
Melting Slicks
I have tried a number of things and have more ideas to try. Man does it get hot under the hood when you are stopped or at low speeds.
Right now, I've insulated the filter box and put insulated sleeves on the coolant hoses. It helps keep the filter airbox from getting cooked for sure. But want to effectively insulate the complete air intake to the throttle body.
Removal of the duct between the radiator and hood I've been told helps. I haven't log any data on this yet.
Anything that vents under hood air to the outside will help. .
At the drag strip, if you can keep you hood open to keep the air intake plumbing from cooking that is the simplest thing you could do. You can remove the rubber strip at the rear edge of the hood, too. Beyond that, it takes work.
When the fans are running, you can feel the hot air escaping between the hood and front fenders. So you know it gets very hot in the engine compartment in the summer especially when its over 90°.
Right now, I've insulated the filter box and put insulated sleeves on the coolant hoses. It helps keep the filter airbox from getting cooked for sure. But want to effectively insulate the complete air intake to the throttle body.
Removal of the duct between the radiator and hood I've been told helps. I haven't log any data on this yet.
Anything that vents under hood air to the outside will help. .
At the drag strip, if you can keep you hood open to keep the air intake plumbing from cooking that is the simplest thing you could do. You can remove the rubber strip at the rear edge of the hood, too. Beyond that, it takes work.
When the fans are running, you can feel the hot air escaping between the hood and front fenders. So you know it gets very hot in the engine compartment in the summer especially when its over 90°.
Last edited by RussM05; 06-19-2017 at 01:15 PM.
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bringe (06-26-2017)
06-20-2017, 09:28 AM
#68
I have to ask what's the point of diminishing returns on this? Yeah you could have enusre that no heat as absorbed Into the intake air via the intake by using insolation and gold film, but is it really needed?
Also if the plastic intake get a little warm how much is it really going to heat the air under WOT? The air is spending hardly any time in the intake to heat up and the intake is plastic so hardly the most efficient marterial at traffering heat.
Pickup could be improved but at what cost? A super long intake track full of lots of complex curves? That's going to impact airflow in its own right.
What worth noting is what some of the motorsport / high end cars manufactures do. For the exhaust they don't cost them but they do create air flow that is ducted and exhausted so as not to heat other areas up. Look at the Aston Martin V12 cars with the chimneys either side of the engine venting out the hood. Race cars tend to have ducts to exhaust the hot radiator air straight out the hood. Not sure what impact that would have when sat stationary for a Long time though. Maybe that could leeds to higher under hood temps (no airflow)...
Also if the plastic intake get a little warm how much is it really going to heat the air under WOT? The air is spending hardly any time in the intake to heat up and the intake is plastic so hardly the most efficient marterial at traffering heat.
Pickup could be improved but at what cost? A super long intake track full of lots of complex curves? That's going to impact airflow in its own right.
What worth noting is what some of the motorsport / high end cars manufactures do. For the exhaust they don't cost them but they do create air flow that is ducted and exhausted so as not to heat other areas up. Look at the Aston Martin V12 cars with the chimneys either side of the engine venting out the hood. Race cars tend to have ducts to exhaust the hot radiator air straight out the hood. Not sure what impact that would have when sat stationary for a Long time though. Maybe that could leeds to higher under hood temps (no airflow)...
06-20-2017, 11:24 AM
#69
Melting Slicks
I have to ask what's the point of diminishing returns on this? Yeah you could have enusre that no heat as absorbed Into the intake air via the intake by using insolation and gold film, but is it really needed?
Also if the plastic intake get a little warm how much is it really going to heat the air under WOT? The air is spending hardly any time in the intake to heat up and the intake is plastic so hardly the most efficient marterial at traffering heat.
Pickup could be improved but at what cost? A super long intake track full of lots of complex curves? That's going to impact airflow in its own right.
What worth noting is what some of the motorsport / high end cars manufactures do. For the exhaust they don't cost them but they do create air flow that is ducted and exhausted so as not to heat other areas up. Look at the Aston Martin V12 cars with the chimneys either side of the engine venting out the hood. Race cars tend to have ducts to exhaust the hot radiator air straight out the hood. Not sure what impact that would have when sat stationary for a Long time though. Maybe that could leeds to higher under hood temps (no airflow)...
Also if the plastic intake get a little warm how much is it really going to heat the air under WOT? The air is spending hardly any time in the intake to heat up and the intake is plastic so hardly the most efficient marterial at traffering heat.
Pickup could be improved but at what cost? A super long intake track full of lots of complex curves? That's going to impact airflow in its own right.
What worth noting is what some of the motorsport / high end cars manufactures do. For the exhaust they don't cost them but they do create air flow that is ducted and exhausted so as not to heat other areas up. Look at the Aston Martin V12 cars with the chimneys either side of the engine venting out the hood. Race cars tend to have ducts to exhaust the hot radiator air straight out the hood. Not sure what impact that would have when sat stationary for a Long time though. Maybe that could leeds to higher under hood temps (no airflow)...
The question of "heat soak" of the MAF sensor has been brought up in other threads on this topic. That could partially explain the high IAT readings but has yet to be proven if the sensor itself is getting hot and falsely reporting higher IAT than actual. The MAF sensor location is located right above the coolant hose and relatively close to the engine. A better location would have been on the other side of the intake tube.
I've logged LTFT % error and haven't seen it go way negative when the high IAT is happening. That tells me whatever is happening with the MAF sensor heat soak is being corrected by one of the other PCM tables.
Last edited by RussM05; 06-20-2017 at 11:25 AM.
06-20-2017, 01:47 PM
#71
At 95 degree ambient, 20 minute track session going 9/10ths: highest IAT seen was 141 when I redline 3rd a couple times in a row, averaged 127 with coolant temp max 257, average 247, oil ~280, transmission at ~275. Z51+procharger 7 psi, only mod. So the intercooler seems to be doing ok. I don't think an intake will make a single difference in the engine bay temperatures. The problem as I see it, is not IAT but coolant and of course oil temp.
Like chuntington101 said, diminishing returns by spending all this money on wraps for intake/etc for a stock car. I am Removing insulating plastic to get more air to the engine block. I bought 1 roll of heat wrap and that's for the exhaust pipes around the transmission ($10) and the extra will be used to wrap my coolant hoses where it touches the power steering motor (because that overheats too). Sample pictures from when I installed the supercharger:
Attachment 48358129
As you can see here, the coolant hose does not affect the vast amount of air being pulled in from the intake. This picture was being I pulled the cone filter to the left another 3" so that the base is just to the left of the coolant hose.
Attachment 48358130
Last edited by BrunoTheMellow; 06-20-2017 at 02:02 PM.
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spinkick (10-18-2017)
06-22-2017, 05:58 AM
#73
In an ideal situation then you could want the engine, supercharger or turbos pulling cold air from a nice high pressure location (not 2 inch off the road surface as this is often a hot location). But you can't always have that.
Likewise you would want most of your radiator exhausted air going out the hood into a nice low pressure location to maximise airflow through the rad.
You would still want some airflow through the engine bay to reduce hotspots but not too much.
I recently read an article about a U.K. Team that were racing a GTR. Everyone knows GTRs struggle with heat on track. But the aero guys actually reduced the openin s for cooling and worked more on directing the air to where it was needed rather than overall airflow. Interesting stuff! Also you have the remember it's easier to push air around the car than through it!
I guess you have to keep in mind that everything is a compromise.
Likewise you would want most of your radiator exhausted air going out the hood into a nice low pressure location to maximise airflow through the rad.
You would still want some airflow through the engine bay to reduce hotspots but not too much.
I recently read an article about a U.K. Team that were racing a GTR. Everyone knows GTRs struggle with heat on track. But the aero guys actually reduced the openin s for cooling and worked more on directing the air to where it was needed rather than overall airflow. Interesting stuff! Also you have the remember it's easier to push air around the car than through it!
I guess you have to keep in mind that everything is a compromise.
06-22-2017, 12:18 PM
#74
The Procharger kit is awesome! I wish I had solid temperature data from before but I only really started tracking the car hard after I had the kit. Anything below 85-90 F ambient and I don't even think about oil, coolant, or intake temps at the track. Above that ambient temperature, if I am shifting right at 6500 rpm the transmission and coolant will start getting close to warning at like 16-18 minutes in. My home track is setup for 60-115 mph so 3rd 90% of the time. Usually I'll shift at 5500 or 6000 for a lap or two at that point and the temperatures go down enough to last the entire 20 minute session. I am thinking about z06 transmission cooler and scoops or just the cooler and maybe Dewitt's radiator after that. But then again, I'm OK with slowing down a 2/12 laps to keep the car happy. Plenty of power anyways.
Iat averages 125 at that ambient temp, maxes 140 at redline on 3rd.
here is a video from this month:
and one form 1 year ago that you can hear the supercharger on:
Last edited by BrunoTheMellow; 06-22-2017 at 05:20 PM.
06-26-2017, 01:36 PM
#76
06-26-2017, 09:23 PM
#78
probably looks and to keep from getting burned if you put your hand on it. Just like basically every car now, plastic everywhere under the hood.
06-26-2017, 11:12 PM
#79
Le Mans Master
Ceramic coating headers won't do much but heat wrapping them definitely will.