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C7 Grand Sport @ track for the 1st time - very fast

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Old 08-13-2017, 04:36 PM   #21
village idiot
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I had similar thoughts going from my Z51 (nonmag ride) to my GS. 2" of rubber all around makes a big difference.

One thing though- "a few seconds" is an eternity and pro drivers can get to ~1 second of their best lap time within a few laps on a track they've never driven before with a car they've driven before. If the gap between the Ferrari and GS is still a few seconds, its a big margin.
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Old 08-13-2017, 05:01 PM   #22
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One thing though- "a few seconds" is an eternity and pro drivers can get to ~1 second of their best lap time within a few laps on a track they've never driven before with a car they've driven before. If the gap between the Ferrari and GS is still a few seconds, its a big margin.
Do you really think pro drivers can get the hang of a car in a few laps? If It's so easy and quick to get the hang of a car, why do professional racing teams spend months testing their cars? By your logic, they would be fine driving the car for the first time on race day.

Magazines spend a whole day, sometimes even 2 at a track when they test cars and run hot laps in them. Reality is that it takes more than a few laps to get used to a car. But hey you gotta make your point when sh*tting on someone's parade right?

Last edited by four0nefive; 08-13-2017 at 05:25 PM.
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Old 08-13-2017, 05:02 PM   #23
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You may want to try Pacific Raceway in Kent. It might be a little faster track.
He's been to Pacific before. Also with the condition it's in, there's no point in running there.
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Old 08-13-2017, 07:17 PM   #24
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Do you really think pro drivers can get the hang of a car in a few laps? If It's so easy and quick to get the hang of a car, why do professional racing teams spend months testing their cars? By your logic, they would be fine driving the car for the first time on race day.

Magazines spend a whole day, sometimes even 2 at a track when they test cars and run hot laps in them. Reality is that it takes more than a few laps to get used to a car. But hey you gotta make your point when sh*tting on someone's parade right?
For a pro driver, one second is a big deal. One second a lap is the difference between first place last place in a competitive series.
Pro race teams spend months tuning because they're tuning. There a million variables they're tweaking. It's not so they're driver gets used to a single setting for months.

And it's not "my logic." One of my best friends is literally a former pro driver that's won a few national series. That was his response when I asked him a few months ago.

I'm not knocking the car. Heck, I have one.

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Old 08-14-2017, 01:41 AM   #25
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For a pro driver, one second is a big deal. One second a lap is the difference between first place last place in a competitive series.
Pro race teams spend months tuning because they're tuning. There a million variables they're tweaking. It's not so they're driver gets used to a single setting for months.

And it's not "my logic." One of my best friends is literally a former pro driver that's won a few national series. That was his response when I asked him a few months ago.

I'm not knocking the car. Heck, I have one.
I think my friend who used to be a pro driver would probably agree with you for the most part about 1 second being a huge difference in a race. I've heard him say the exact same thing about first place and last place. By his own account, he wasn't pushing my car as hard as his own and by his estimation, driving them back to back, he thought the GS was as fast around that track as his Speciale. A 458 Speciale is still much quicker in a straight line but the massive Cup2 on the GS do give it some advantage in the corners. And they have almost identical brakes. He still loves his Ferrari and thinks my Chevy is a piece of crap... just a piece of crap that's pretty much as fast as his Ferrari.

It's all good. 😉
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Old 08-14-2017, 01:46 AM   #26
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You may want to try Pacific Raceway in Kent. It might be a little faster track.
I did make it there once this summer and had a blast.

Both tracks were plenty fast and I enjoyed the Track Night in America events. I'd also like to find a group or club were I could get more time with some experience drivers I could follow, talk to about different corners and elements of the track and generally learn from. There were some folks like that at TNiA. Just want to find some more.
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Old 08-14-2017, 07:47 PM   #27
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For a pro driver, one second is a big deal. One second a lap is the difference between first place last place in a competitive series.
Pro race teams spend months tuning because they're tuning. There a million variables they're tweaking. It's not so they're driver gets used to a single setting for months.

And it's not "my logic." One of my best friends is literally a former pro driver that's won a few national series. That was his response when I asked him a few months ago.

I'm not knocking the car. Heck, I have one.
I 100% agree with the fact that 1 second can be a big difference, the only thing I was arguing was that it takes more than 3 laps to get used to a car
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Old 08-15-2017, 04:55 PM   #28
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I 100% agree with the fact that 1 second can be a big difference, the only thing I was arguing was that it takes more than 3 laps to get used to a car
I never said 3. I said a few- I think th exact number he said was about 6, but I don't recall exactly.

If anyone knows where to find it, a good way to figure it out would be to look at the first season of an f1 race, like COTA. What was their first few naptime's and what were they at the end of practice.
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Old 08-15-2017, 07:42 PM   #29
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For a pro driver, one second is a big deal. One second a lap is the difference between first place last place in a competitive series.
Pro race teams spend months tuning because they're tuning. There a million variables they're tweaking. It's not so they're driver gets used to a single setting for months.

And it's not "my logic." One of my best friends is literally a former pro driver that's won a few national series. That was his response when I asked him a few months ago.

I'm not knocking the car. Heck, I have one.
A couple of other things to consider...

I'm not a pro driver and run with the nannies turned on. (Sport 1 to be specific.) Stability and traction control turned on. That keeps me from killing the car or myself but it also slows the car down a bit. When my pro driver buddy drove he kept them turned on (so I could compare more directly my PDR data to his - he was 1.2 seconds faster) so he was being slowed down by that a bit - maybe a few 10th of a second maybe more. He drives his 458 with all the nannies turned off... and drives it like he stole it.

Also, my car is a manual. The 458 is an auto/dual-clutch. If you were comparing an automatic GS it would be maybe as much as 2 seconds faster than a manual on a track of this length. (That's a wild *** guess based on articles that compare the manual C7s to the automatics.)

I'm taking the car to Buttonwillow in September (for my pro driver buddies birthday event) and he'll probably drive it with all the nannies turned off so maybe I'll have some more data to add to this conversation.

I was just thinking about this and he was two seconds faster in his Speciale last time. I bet with the nannies off he'd be pretty close to that time... with a manual vs a dual clutch.

Just throwing it out there. The GS is a fast car on a track... at any price.

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Old 08-15-2017, 08:37 PM   #30
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I never said 3. I said a few- I think th exact number he said was about 6, but I don't recall exactly.

If anyone knows where to find it, a good way to figure it out would be to look at the first season of an f1 race, like COTA. What was their first few naptime's and what were they at the end of practice.
I thought you said 3 at first, I dont remember either. 6 laps sounds more reasonable to me, although me personally, I wouldn't push a car to it's limit after a few laps (then again I'm not a pro driver either).

I still think to truly get used to a completely new car would take a while for 90% of people including pros (and by this I mean comfortable to push the car to its absolute limits, not just a hot lap or two) especially if they've never driven a car like it before (ex- someone who may be used to driving only Porsches and may not be experienced with Corvettes at all).
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Old 08-16-2017, 01:45 AM   #31
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A couple of other things to consider...

I'm not a pro driver and run with the nannies turned on. (Sport 1 to be specific.) Stability and traction control turned on. That keeps me from killing the car or myself but it also slows the car down a bit. When my pro driver buddy drove he kept them turned on (so I could compare more directly my PDR data to his - he was 1.2 seconds faster) so he was being slowed down by that a bit - maybe a few 10th of a second maybe more. He drives his 458 with all the nannies turned off... and drives it like he stole it.

Also, my car is a manual. The 458 is an auto/dual-clutch. If you were comparing an automatic GS it would be maybe as much as 2 seconds faster than a manual on a track of this length. (That's a wild *** guess based on articles that compare the manual C7s to the automatics.)

I'm taking the car to Buttonwillow in September (for my pro driver buddies birthday event) and he'll probably drive it with all the nannies turned off so maybe I'll have some more data to add to this conversation.

I was just thinking about this and he was two seconds faster in his Speciale last time. I bet with the nannies off he'd be pretty close to that time... with a manual vs a dual clutch.

Just throwing it out there. The GS is a fast car on a track... at any price.
did you mean 0.2? Because it's definitely not 2 seconds and probably closer to 0.2.


And nannies on is a lot of time. I'm not sure how much, but a lot. For example, on later parts of exit, pro drivers will use the momentum of the car turn, not the front wheels. This keeps the wheels straight so you're not fighting them when accelerating. It makes a big difference. Can't do that with nannies, especially in sport mode 1. I'm far from a pro and sport mode 1 was very intrusive. They are always a little loose making adjustments through the turn. Can't do that with sport 1 on either.

So yeah, not only do pro drivers get on the gas way before us, they also have the steering wheel straightened out way before us. I've tried to do that but 90% of the time I end up spinning so I just gave up

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I thought you said 3 at first, I dont remember either. 6 laps sounds more reasonable to me, although me personally, I wouldn't push a car to it's limit after a few laps (then again I'm not a pro driver either).

I still think to truly get used to a completely new car would take a while for 90% of people including pros (and by this I mean comfortable to push the car to its absolute limits, not just a hot lap or two) especially if they've never driven a car like it before (ex- someone who may be used to driving only Porsches and may not be experienced with Corvettes at all).
My buddy hopped in my Miata, that he's never been in before, on a track he hasn't driven in 5-6 years, and was scary fast. HE did the same in my buddy's CTS-V and overheated the diff in 2 laps. You'd be shocked how quick they get a feel for it and how fast they learn. The tires, chassis and suspension whisper to us- they have a face to face conversation with pro divers

Last edited by village idiot; 08-16-2017 at 01:54 AM.
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Old 08-18-2017, 01:18 AM   #32
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Wow! That's a seriously used tire. How hot was it? I think I'm going back to Buttonwillow in September for a friends birthday event. Always like Buttonwillow.
68 degrees, it was in Dec.

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Old Yesterday, 01:46 PM   #33
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Been to The Ridge twice now. Great fun. I need to figure out the best club or events to attend. I've gone to the Track Night in America events which are fun but I'd like to find a more experience group to drive with.

https://youtu.be/ysOWuWm4Cq8

Check out Motorsportreg.com - They list most track events and the links to registration for them. Consider joining PCA (Porsche Club of America) they do not require you to be driving a Porsche for their track days. Our local PCA events are full of Vettes and other marques.
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