Which oil filter: UPF64R vs PF64 (discontinued) vs PF64F
04-07-2019, 09:10 AM
#41
Moderator/Tech Contributor
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Location: Jacksonville Florida BWO Dayton, Cincinnati, Bloomsbury NJ, Cincinnati
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2015 C7 of the Year Finalist
Here's my thoughts on this:
Scenario: Sunny, warm day, nice breeze off the ocean and I start the car.
Car says: Hey **** head, I'm at 5%, change my oil.
Me: Goes to home PC, clicks on service department bookmark and sets appointment for oil and filter change.
Me: Drives to dealer and lets them do it and has it documented in system what has been done.
Me: Drives car until it calls me **** head again.
Me: No worries.
Elmer
Scenario: Sunny, warm day, nice breeze off the ocean and I start the car.
Car says: Hey **** head, I'm at 5%, change my oil.
Me: Goes to home PC, clicks on service department bookmark and sets appointment for oil and filter change.
Me: Drives to dealer and lets them do it and has it documented in system what has been done.
Me: Drives car until it calls me **** head again.
Me: No worries.
Elmer
04-07-2019, 09:33 AM
#42
My version of it 
Scenario: Sunny, warm day, nice breeze off the ocean and I start the car.
Car says: Hey **** head, I'm at 5%, change my oil.
Me: Goes to home PC, clicks on service department bookmark and sets appointment for oil and filter change.
Me: Drives to dealer and lets them do it and has it documented in system what has been done.
Me: Drives the car aggressively
Car says: Hey **** head, the check engine light is on
Me: Goes to home PC, clicks on service department bookmark and sets appointment to fix.
Me: Drives to dealer and lets trouble shoot and discover that they over filled my dry sump system.
Me: Drives home and checks oil level and finds that now it only has 4 quarts of oil in it.
Me: Tops it off correctly
Me: Drives car until it calls me **** head again.
Me: Changes it myself the next time
lakemg
Scenario: Sunny, warm day, nice breeze off the ocean and I start the car.
Car says: Hey **** head, I'm at 5%, change my oil.
Me: Goes to home PC, clicks on service department bookmark and sets appointment for oil and filter change.
Me: Drives to dealer and lets them do it and has it documented in system what has been done.
Me: Drives the car aggressively
Car says: Hey **** head, the check engine light is on
Me: Goes to home PC, clicks on service department bookmark and sets appointment to fix.
Me: Drives to dealer and lets trouble shoot and discover that they over filled my dry sump system.
Me: Drives home and checks oil level and finds that now it only has 4 quarts of oil in it.
Me: Tops it off correctly
Me: Drives car until it calls me **** head again.
Me: Changes it myself the next time
lakemg
Last edited by lakemg; 05-15-2019 at 12:30 PM.
04-07-2019, 10:05 AM
#43
You are so right. Hilarious 😂 And I’m just amazed at the number of people out there that still think Fram filters are junk. Still living in the seventies. Probably the same people that think 3,000 miles is the limit on oil changes.
04-07-2019, 02:53 PM
#44
Le Mans Master
I just got two M1-113A filters at Walmart today for under $5/each after Mobil's current mail in rebate. I used my last old M1-113 yesterday so figured I might as well stock up while their oil was on sale with a rebate available.
04-07-2019, 06:47 PM
#45
I have a very long memory. I will not buy from a manufacturer that sold me junk in the past. I will use anything but a Fram filter as long as I live.
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fnbrowning (03-19-2022)
04-08-2019, 07:53 AM
#46
Race Director
05-07-2019, 01:52 PM
#49
Racer
Just found an ebay listing for the new XG 12060 filters that satisfies GM's 22 psi rating.
Go to ebay and search for XG12060 and they are: $49.95 for a 6 pack of filters delivered.
I picked up 3 cases from this ebay seller.
Go to ebay and search for XG12060 and they are: $49.95 for a 6 pack of filters delivered.
I picked up 3 cases from this ebay seller.
Last edited by GM-4-LIFE; 05-07-2019 at 01:53 PM.
05-07-2019, 02:46 PM
#50
Last week I got 5 of the 12640445's at my local market. Figure that should last long enough. Also have 3 of the new ones just in case someone finds evidence that it is a better filter than the old one.
Last edited by ShadowGray19; 05-07-2019 at 02:48 PM.
05-12-2019, 06:09 AM
#52
Le Mans Master
The problem with having the bypass pressure set too high is that when you drive it hard it might not bypass the filter enough and the oil flow could be restricted. On the flip side, if the pressure is set too low then it bypasses the media too often, which can be a big problem when the engine is cold and the oil is thicker. That's why I would feel very uneasy about using a filter that doesn't use a 22psi bypass setting.
First of all, the 22psi setting means the differential pressure across the oil filter, not the actual oil pressure of the engine. Second, the oil filter doesn’t need to be full of “stuff” in order to bypass. A brand new empty oil filter will go into bypass with cold thick oil. And it will go into bypass more often if you have a filter with a low bypass setting.
I've always struggled with understanding the oil bypass filter ratings. AIUI, and goes with your 2nd post, the rating is for the delta p through the filter itself. Do you know of any listings anywhere that show what a normal delta p would be across a filter? I thought I remembered a BITOG thread where under normal conditions it was less than 5 psi, unless you were in extreme cold conditions or some kind of filter failure mode.
If that's the case (and I'm trying to learn if it is), then why would the change from 22 psi to something higher be a real world problem?
TIA, and have a good one,
Mike
05-12-2019, 06:53 AM
#53
Race Director
Trying to keep this from being a <xname> oil filter is good, <yname> oil filter is bad....
I've always struggled with understanding the oil bypass filter ratings. AIUI, and goes with your 2nd post, the rating is for the delta p through the filter itself. Do you know of any listings anywhere that show what a normal delta p would be across a filter? I thought I remembered a BITOG thread where under normal conditions it was less than 5 psi, unless you were in extreme cold conditions or some kind of filter failure mode.
If that's the case (and I'm trying to learn if it is), then why would the change from 22 psi to something higher be a real world problem?
TIA, and have a good one,
Mike
I've always struggled with understanding the oil bypass filter ratings. AIUI, and goes with your 2nd post, the rating is for the delta p through the filter itself. Do you know of any listings anywhere that show what a normal delta p would be across a filter? I thought I remembered a BITOG thread where under normal conditions it was less than 5 psi, unless you were in extreme cold conditions or some kind of filter failure mode.
If that's the case (and I'm trying to learn if it is), then why would the change from 22 psi to something higher be a real world problem?
TIA, and have a good one,
Mike
My thoughts are this way, even if the lower or higher bypass setting than 22 doesn't result in problems, I'd rather err on the side of caution and run the right spec.
Last edited by Patman; 05-12-2019 at 06:57 AM.
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VetteDrmr (05-12-2019)
05-12-2019, 08:05 AM
#54
Le Mans Master
Going to a higher bypass setting is worse than going to a lower one, IMO, because you run the risk of tearing the filtering media if it's not up to the task.
My thoughts are this way, even if the lower or higher bypass setting than 22 doesn't result in problems, I'd rather err on the side of caution and run the right spec.
My thoughts are this way, even if the lower or higher bypass setting than 22 doesn't result in problems, I'd rather err on the side of caution and run the right spec.
And I totally agree with using the right part for the job. I just think we do a lot more hand wringing than we need to. Like you, I've used oil analysis on my cars for years (Blackstone) and have never had any problems identified that would be associated with any kind of oil filter failure (using both Wix and ACDelco). Air filter failures, yes, they've spotted that immediately.
Have a good one,
Mike
05-13-2019, 12:37 AM
#56
Race Director
Member Since: Mar 2001
Location: Bonneville Salt Flats, 223mph Aug. '04
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As of mid-May PF64s have still been available at some Walmarts. I finally thought to look at ours when I was there for something else and bought them out. 
05-13-2019, 07:39 AM
#58
Race Director
I was in Niagara Falls NY on Saturday and stopped at the Walmart on Military road and they still had three PF64s left of the 12640445 variety.
05-14-2019, 02:25 PM
#59
Instructor
Even in 2013 GM built the amazing 427 convertible with the awesome LS7 that had junk no lead rod bearings so they could sell the car in Europe and poorly machined valve seats in the heads which they refused to acknowledge and address adequately
Then in 2015 and later they put the 8 speed automatic in the Corvette...
Still I own a Corvette...
05-14-2019, 03:49 PM
#60
Team Owner
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Location: cookeville tennessee
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ttt
WIX WL10290 has Enhanced Cellulose Media ?????
WIX WL10290XP has Synthetic Media ????
Not sure which one is same as NAPA Gold
Copied/Pasted from WIX web site
WIX Product Specifications
Part Number:WL10290XP
UPC Number:765809348523
Style:Spin-On Lube Filter
Service:Lube
Type:Full Flow
Media:Synthetic
Height:3.45(88)*
Outer Diameter Top:2.921(74)*
Outer Diameter Bottom:Closed:
Thread Size:22X1.5 MM
By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI:22
Anti-Drain Back Valve:Yes