Tadge Comments on Nurburgring and VIR
01-08-2015, 08:09 AM
#21
Melting Slicks
01-08-2015, 08:17 AM
#22
Tech Contributor
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"Ask Tadge" Producer
01-08-2015, 08:17 AM
#23
Safety Car
I think this two second Cup2 stuff is mixing up info provided by Michelin saying the 997 GT3 was 1.8 seconds quicker on Cup2, which have specific construction for the GT3. Just because a GT3 1.8 quicker doesn't mean the Corvette is.
http://www.michelinman.com/tire-sele...2/tire-details
http://www.michelinman.com/tire-sele...2/tire-details
Michelin built the cups for vette as well, and the gt3, they are not the same size tires hence each is built for their specific application.
01-08-2015, 08:20 AM
#24
Melting Slicks
you do realise the gt3 rs 4.0 did the ring in 7:24 which 5 sec slower than the zr1 (both car using the old cups version). So if the gt3 can gain 1.8 with new tires on a 2 mile course i would suspect the zr1 and new z06 to be able to match that.
Michelin built the cups for vette as well, and the gt3, they are not the same size tires hence each is built for their specific application.
Michelin built the cups for vette as well, and the gt3, they are not the same size tires hence each is built for their specific application.
01-08-2015, 08:34 AM
#25
Safety Car
False, Barber Motorsports park only was resurfaced with Diamond cutting and picked up about 2 seconds.
Have you driven both surfaces?
GTLM Pole
2013 - 1:45.9
2014 - 1:43.7
and in case you want to argue the cars got over 2 seconds faster
Unchanged tracks from 2013 to 2014.
Road America
2013 - 2:03.7
2014 - 2:03.4
Sebring
2013 - 1:58.8
2014 - 1:58.9
Laguna
2013 - 1:22.7
2014 - 1:22.3
Road Atlanta
2013 - 1:18.8
2014 - 1:18.3
So as you can see, the cars were just barely faster in 2014 than 2013. And you don't see a delta anywhere near 2.2 seconds anywhere but VIR. Even if you subtract the higher gaps that's 1.8 seconds. Given that these cars rely less on mechanical grip than street cars will, it makes sense that their gap would be a tad lower.
Not only that, but I speak from experience. This is not conjecture. I have lap records with two organizations at the track
Last edited by heavychevy; 01-08-2015 at 08:41 AM.
01-08-2015, 08:50 AM
#26
Safety Car
01-08-2015, 08:59 AM
#27
Safety Car
Michelin based it on Jerez Circuit, which is 2.7 miles. For the 1.8 seconds. So presumably it should be more at the 4.2 mile VIR Grand. Just using basic math on Jerez being 64% as long as VIR Grand, that would be 2.6 seconds relatively.
Last edited by heavychevy; 01-08-2015 at 09:02 AM.
01-08-2015, 09:13 AM
#28
Melting Slicks
The gain was on a Porsche GT3, saying it's same for the Z06 is pure speculation.
01-08-2015, 09:15 AM
#30
Melting Slicks
And for anyone that thinks a VIR repaving and widening is going to be good for two whole seconds, you're sadly mistaken. And living in some sort of imaginary world. Two seconds, even on that track, is an eternity. It may make a difference in fractions of a second, but not whole seconds. Further, using the wider parts of the corners significantly upsets the car; just watch as Mero crosses the old gators to make use of the wider track in a couple of those corners. The car heaves quite dramatically.
Originally Posted by racerns
You need to take a look at the NASA records also. I know that the GTS2, GTS3, GTS4, SU, Spec Iron, V2, Spec Z, PTD, PTF, Spec Miata, TT1, TT2, TT3, TTD, TTE classes lap records all improved by over 2 sec after the track update. There were another 8 classes that the record lap time improved by over 1 sec.
Last edited by racerns; 01-08-2015 at 11:00 AM.
01-08-2015, 09:27 AM
#32
Safety Car
01-08-2015, 09:29 AM
#33
Le Mans Master
Nice to hear Tadge say that the new Z06 WILL be faster at the Ring than the ZR1! 
01-08-2015, 09:32 AM
#34
Le Mans Master
Nice video and comments, but why does everyone of the sound tracks of talks GM folks give sound like they are in a echo chamber, drives me nuts to listen to speeches sounding like this, oh and can't understand what is being said catch a few words every now and then.
z51vett
Doug
z51vett
Doug
01-08-2015, 10:04 AM
#35
Melting Slicks
I am not so sure I agree with everything you state. Repaving the track makes a huge difference. Tires make a huge difference.
While I agree that the car's handling has improved with better aero, the question still remains how much faster all things equal.
All of this speculation does not help the car. Posting the times at VIR when the track has been repaved and not posting the other track times just seems all suspect.
I am not debating on the technology advances of the car, interor, etc. I just think they should do like the previous generation and let everyone know how much faster it was, with results immediately. Then, even when it got in the end users hands, it was beating everything it came up against. This has not happened with the release of the C7 Z06.
While I agree that the car's handling has improved with better aero, the question still remains how much faster all things equal.
All of this speculation does not help the car. Posting the times at VIR when the track has been repaved and not posting the other track times just seems all suspect.
I am not debating on the technology advances of the car, interor, etc. I just think they should do like the previous generation and let everyone know how much faster it was, with results immediately. Then, even when it got in the end users hands, it was beating everything it came up against. This has not happened with the release of the C7 Z06.
This was the media event that I hinted was going to happen. The journalists and audience members were told some other interesting thing about the car as it compares to the previous gen. But apparently no one has seen fit to print it or share it yet. Ah well.
And for anyone that thinks a VIR repaving and widening is going to be good for two whole seconds, you're sadly mistaken. And living in some sort of imaginary world. Two seconds, even on that track, is an eternity. It may make a difference in fractions of a second, but not whole seconds. Further, using the wider parts of the corners significantly upsets the car; just watch as Mero crosses the old gators to make use of the wider track in a couple of those corners. The car heaves quite dramatically.
And for anyone that thinks a VIR repaving and widening is going to be good for two whole seconds, you're sadly mistaken. And living in some sort of imaginary world. Two seconds, even on that track, is an eternity. It may make a difference in fractions of a second, but not whole seconds. Further, using the wider parts of the corners significantly upsets the car; just watch as Mero crosses the old gators to make use of the wider track in a couple of those corners. The car heaves quite dramatically.
Last edited by JG853; 01-08-2015 at 10:07 AM.
01-08-2015, 10:11 AM
#36
Safety Car
I figured it out: the ZR1 is Tadge Nemesis, but he can't get his Z06 to quite beat it…so he removes the important tid bits of information and make the "data" fit his agenda (cue in Jean Girard voice) "well eelllo Tadge, I'm the Zed ARRR un, I yam your Nemesis Tadge"
01-08-2015, 10:17 AM
#37
Safety Car
I figured it out: Dave Hill is Tadge Nemesis, but he can't get his Z06 to quite beat the zr1…so he removes the important tid bits of information and make the "data" fit his agenda (cue in Jean Girard voice) "well eelllo Tadge, I'm the Zed ARRR un, I yam your Nemesis Tadge"
01-08-2015, 10:20 AM
#38
Instructor
This was the media event that I hinted was going to happen. The journalists and audience members were told some other interesting thing about the car as it compares to the previous gen. But apparently no one has seen fit to print it or share it yet. Ah well.
And for anyone that thinks a VIR repaving and widening is going to be good for two whole seconds, you're sadly mistaken. And living in some sort of imaginary world. Two seconds, even on that track, is an eternity. It may make a difference in fractions of a second, but not whole seconds. Further, using the wider parts of the corners significantly upsets the car; just watch as Mero crosses the old gators to make use of the wider track in a couple of those corners. The car heaves quite dramatically.
And for anyone that thinks a VIR repaving and widening is going to be good for two whole seconds, you're sadly mistaken. And living in some sort of imaginary world. Two seconds, even on that track, is an eternity. It may make a difference in fractions of a second, but not whole seconds. Further, using the wider parts of the corners significantly upsets the car; just watch as Mero crosses the old gators to make use of the wider track in a couple of those corners. The car heaves quite dramatically.
01-08-2015, 10:20 AM
#39
Melting Slicks
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Nice video and comments, but why does everyone of the sound tracks of talks GM folks give sound like they are in a echo chamber, drives me nuts to listen to speeches sounding like this, oh and can't understand what is being said catch a few words every now and then.
z51vett
Doug
z51vett
Doug
and for a non-native English speaker/listener like me - I'm Dutch - this is even more of a nuisance ..
01-08-2015, 10:31 AM
#40
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The amount of assumtions being made in this thread are insane to me. everthing is a round number as well.
this is good for exacly two seconds, this is good for 2 seconds, bla bla.
plain and simply I think the new z06 seems to be faster than as delivered from every data point that you can see but other than running them same day same drive there is no point in trying to make up numbers.
I don't think comparing that old zr1 time to this new z06 time should be considere apples vs apples. different day not the same year.
on the flip side thinking that the zr1 can be some how made to be the faster car out this data is grasping at straws. I can also guaranty that a zr1 "can" be modified to be faster than this car with tire chanes, suspension upgrades etc but that is a floating argument as well as this car will repsond to mods as well.
The one thing I can say 100% is you can't say the z06 does not go around a track well at that time. granted it may not roll race as well as people want but that is a fast time.
this is good for exacly two seconds, this is good for 2 seconds, bla bla.
plain and simply I think the new z06 seems to be faster than as delivered from every data point that you can see but other than running them same day same drive there is no point in trying to make up numbers.
I don't think comparing that old zr1 time to this new z06 time should be considere apples vs apples. different day not the same year.
on the flip side thinking that the zr1 can be some how made to be the faster car out this data is grasping at straws. I can also guaranty that a zr1 "can" be modified to be faster than this car with tire chanes, suspension upgrades etc but that is a floating argument as well as this car will repsond to mods as well.
The one thing I can say 100% is you can't say the z06 does not go around a track well at that time. granted it may not roll race as well as people want but that is a fast time.
