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Using extreme terms; "engineering disaster", is an instant turn off and lacks rationality and credibility. It smacks of, please don't trump my ZR1.
I was wrong to characterize it as an engineering disaster. Fresh on my mind was not just the powertrain cooling issue but the overheat issue that SBC_and_a_stick has been writing about for the electric power steering unit, where he made an ad-hoc fix with some spacers to permit some ventilation. I am sure this will not change your mind, nor mine as I was already taking arrows from shills for supposedly being a P-car owner.
But tipping the scale for me is in fact, the electric power steering unit issue, and the well documented reports of overheating. When there are problems like that then fundamental questions arise about the reliability and testing. An unreliable car is not a place you want the Corvette to be, and there are too many quality control issues for this to be acceptable.
I have issues about my ZR1 and GM as well, so the notion that we should just shut up and allow the shills to craft false narratives about how wonderful GM cars are, doesn't work for me.
And I would add that the C7 Z06 dang well ought to be faster at the Ring than the ZR1. From the YouTube video I saw of in-car side by videos of C7-Z06 and ZR1 at VIR, it certainly looked like the ZR1 driver had his hands full, sawing on the wheel, while the Z06 appeared much smoother. But until you get the ring test, you don't even have a number. I also don't really think there would be much difference between similarly prepped and driven ZR1s and C7 Z06s, shod with the same tires, the Z06 maybe a little quicker around the turns, the ZR1 a little faster down the straights, but a Ring test doesn't go down that way, the new tires go only with the C7, and because of diminishing returns a lot more effort that spanned months and some wrecked vehicles went into the C7 effort, versus when they put a set of cup tires on the ZR1 and Mero goes out for a weekend and smashes the record. Otherwise, these two cars are not that fundamentally different, same wheelbase, track, tire sizes, CG, power all very close, some new calibrations for the C7 and a little bit lighter weight for the ZR1. My point for GM remains, the ZR1 is OLD. Don't benchmark that, go after Nissan and Porsche. To benchmark themselves is what they always do, to act like they've re-made the brand and overhype it in the words of Jeremy Clarkson, is why I say it's the same old GM.
And I would add that the C7 Z06 dang well ought to be faster at the Ring than the ZR1. From the YouTube video I saw of in-car side by videos of C7-Z06 and ZR1 at VIR, it certainly looked like the ZR1 driver had his hands full, sawing on the wheel, while the Z06 appeared much smoother. But until you get the ring test, you don't even have a number. I also don't really think there would be much difference between similarly prepped and driven ZR1s and C7 Z06s, shod with the same tires, the Z06 maybe a little quicker around the turns, the ZR1 a little faster down the straights, but a Ring test doesn't go down that way, the new tires go only with the C7, and because of diminishing returns a lot more effort that spanned months and some wrecked vehicles went into the C7 effort, versus when they put a set of cup tires on the ZR1 and Mero goes out for a weekend and smashes the record. Otherwise, these two cars are not that fundamentally different, same wheelbase, track, tire sizes, CG, power all very close, some new calibrations for the C7 and a little bit lighter weight for the ZR1. My point for GM remains, the ZR1 is OLD. Don't benchmark that, go after Nissan and Porsche. To benchmark themselves is what they always do, to act like they've re-made the brand and overhype it in the words of Jeremy Clarkson, is why I say it's the same old GM.
I would say you are grossly underestimating the difference in the two chassis. My C6 Z is no where in the ball park as stiff as my C7 Z (and I have penske shocks and Coil overs on the C6 Z). While I agree on alot of your points. I think most of the gain in quickness will be from the stability the chassis gives over the c6...it's night and day! While the ZR1 is lighter...the C7 Z makes enough additional power across the rpm band to compensate. Blue line, 100% stock C7 Z06 A8, brown line 2012 ZR1 with an exhaust.
I would say you are grossly underestimating the difference in the two chassis. My C6 Z is no where in the ball park as stiff as my C7 Z (and I have penske shocks and Coil overs on the C6 Z). While I agree on alot of your points. I think most of the gain in quickness will be from the stability the chassis gives over the c6...it's night and day! While the ZR1 is lighter...the C7 Z makes enough additional power across the rpm band to compensate. Blue line, 100% stock C7 Z06 A8, brown line 2012 ZR1 with an exhaust.
And your responses scream "I will not tolerate any ill words towards my car".
Lock lock lock lock. This thread is pointless.
Pretty assumptive as I haven't bought one...yet.
I want the issues remedied as well hence my waiting. This car is massive bang for the buck and that intrigues me, however I want it right.
Originally Posted by Reciprocal
I was wrong to characterize it as an engineering disaster. Fresh on my mind was not just the powertrain cooling issue but the overheat issue that SBC_and_a_stick has been writing about for the electric power steering unit, where he made an ad-hoc fix with some spacers to permit some ventilation. I am sure this will not change your mind, nor mine as I was already taking arrows from shills for supposedly being a P-car owner.
But tipping the scale for me is in fact, the electric power steering unit issue, and the well documented reports of overheating. When there are problems like that then fundamental questions arise about the reliability and testing. An unreliable car is not a place you want the Corvette to be, and there are too many quality control issues for this to be acceptable.
I have issues about my ZR1 and GM as well, so the notion that we should just shut up and allow the shills to craft false narratives about how wonderful GM cars are, doesn't work for me.
Understandable. I want the issues remedied as well hence my waiting. This car is massive bang for the buck and that intrigues me, however I want it right.
And I would add that the C7 Z06 dang well ought to be faster at the Ring than the ZR1. From the YouTube video I saw of in-car side by videos of C7-Z06 and ZR1 at VIR, it certainly looked like the ZR1 driver had his hands full, sawing on the wheel, while the Z06 appeared much smoother. But until you get the ring test, you don't even have a number. I also don't really think there would be much difference between similarly prepped and driven ZR1s and C7 Z06s, shod with the same tires, the Z06 maybe a little quicker around the turns, the ZR1 a little faster down the straights, but a Ring test doesn't go down that way, the new tires go only with the C7, and because of diminishing returns a lot more effort that spanned months and some wrecked vehicles went into the C7 effort, versus when they put a set of cup tires on the ZR1 and Mero goes out for a weekend and smashes the record. Otherwise, these two cars are not that fundamentally different, same wheelbase, track, tire sizes, CG, power all very close, some new calibrations for the C7 and a little bit lighter weight for the ZR1. My point for GM remains, the ZR1 is OLD. Don't benchmark that, go after Nissan and Porsche. To benchmark themselves is what they always do, to act like they've re-made the brand and overhype it in the words of Jeremy Clarkson, is why I say it's the same old GM.
Originally Posted by Tripleblk6spd
I would say you are grossly underestimating the difference in the two chassis. My C6 Z is no where in the ball park as stiff as my C7 Z (and I have penske shocks and Coil overs on the C6 Z). While I agree on alot of your points. I think most of the gain in quickness will be from the stability the chassis gives over the c6...it's night and day! While the ZR1 is lighter...the C7 Z makes enough additional power across the rpm band to compensate. Blue line, 100% stock C7 Z06 A8, brown line 2012 ZR1 with an exhaust.
I fully agree the C7 chassis is highly respectable.
I'm not understanding this whole "ban" thing, because as I understand it, the Z06 ran the course before the ban was put into place. So there should be no problem releasing it.
The Autoweek article mentions that the Lamborghini was able to record their number because it was done a day before the ban was instantiated. So I assume Chevrolet should be able to do the same.
And I would add that the C7 Z06 dang well ought to be faster at the Ring than the ZR1. From the YouTube video I saw of in-car side by videos of C7-Z06 and ZR1 at VIR, it certainly looked like the ZR1 driver had his hands full, sawing on the wheel, while the Z06 appeared much smoother. But until you get the ring test, you don't even have a number. I also don't really think there would be much difference between similarly prepped and driven ZR1s and C7 Z06s, shod with the same tires, the Z06 maybe a little quicker around the turns, the ZR1 a little faster down the straights, but a Ring test doesn't go down that way, the new tires go only with the C7, and because of diminishing returns a lot more effort that spanned months and some wrecked vehicles went into the C7 effort, versus when they put a set of cup tires on the ZR1 and Mero goes out for a weekend and smashes the record. Otherwise, these two cars are not that fundamentally different, same wheelbase, track, tire sizes, CG, power all very close, some new calibrations for the C7 and a little bit lighter weight for the ZR1. My point for GM remains, the ZR1 is OLD. Don't benchmark that, go after Nissan and Porsche. To benchmark themselves is what they always do, to act like they've re-made the brand and overhype it in the words of Jeremy Clarkson, is why I say it's the same old GM.
That could also partially be a product of the track surface. VIR is far more grippy now than it used to be, hence the 2-3 seconds faster lap times most people get there. Certain sections of VIR were like ice, particularly turn 1 where the slickness sent many a car off track due ot the slick surface fooling ABS and triggering ice mode, or plain just sliding off.
That being said, the C7Z platform still seems more composed and confidence inspiring than the C6 IMO. The power application seems smoother and the aero is undoubtedly much better.
So.... 1.5 months, 32 pages and well over 3000 posts later... and all we have is "we were more than satisfied with the results."
At this point, I'm not even sure I care about the time... but would like to know what the hold up is. We are all assuming it has something to do with this 'Ring ban...but has GM ever come out and said "We can't release the results because of the ban?"
EDIT: Hearing via an automotive magazine with "an inside source" is speculative and means little.
Last edited by Xanthophyll; 07-08-2015 at 06:38 PM.
So.... 1.5 months, 32 pages and well over 3000 posts later... and all we have is "we were more than satisfied with the results."
At this point, I'm not even sure I care about the time... but would like to know what the hold up is. We are all assuming it has something to do with this 'Ring ban...but has GM ever come out and said "We can't release the results because of the ban?"
EDIT: Hearing via an automotive magazine with "an inside source" is speculative and means little.
Looks like we will have a new President before they put out the lap time
...and if it was a great time it would help sales I bet. So that leads us to believe it wasn't so great.
This exactly......the C7 Stingray has ran the ring a while back and no time was released for it, yet they released the impressive Z/28 time (in the rain). What does that tell you......? GM isn't going to release lackluster times for the interwebs to bash. Can't blame them...
This exactly......the C7 Stingray has ran the ring a while back and no time was released for it, yet they released the impressive Z/28 time (in the rain). What does that tell you......? GM isn't going to release lackluster times for the interwebs to bash. Can't blame them...
I expect its good, but not earth shattering like some want it to be.
07-02-2015, 09:01 AM
Looks like we will have a new President before they put out the lap time 
