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If anything were to happen to engine, you can't take the car to Chevy since you don't have GM Warranty. Sure it's unlikely your engine will blow with the Edelbrock canned tune and blower, but you never know.
Also, why is that people were complaining about the Z06 being supercharged and how it's bad for the track, but now suddenly everyone's saying a GS with a blower is good??
The GS is an awesome car in it's own right I'm sure it'll perform well, but in the end, it isn't a Z06.
Even if Edelbrock or other companies said they would pay for repairs. Its not like you can pull into any chevy dealership and expect them (or want them) to be able to work on a engine with aftermarket parts and a tune.
The Z06 gets 650HP stock, with a 5 year/60,000 mile powertrain warranty that can be extended.
All these aftermarket companies are offering is less power, less of a warranty, and more of a hassle is something breaks.
The core problem here is that many of these car enthusiasts mistakenly believed that forced induction horsepower is as good as naturally aspirated horsepower, when it's not even close. When you roll race 2x that forced induction car and get your butt handed to you by a naturally aspirated car with 150 less horsepower maybe they will finally understand. At the road race track it's not even close.
It's like thinking boob implants are just as good as natural *****. Way off.
I was addressing the "bad to the bone" comment when I said put a 2.3L blower on the GS, and you would also have superior gearing with the GS for performance.
Seems everyone wants to jump on me about the "warranty".
I'll be glad to address the 'warranty".
There is approximately a $15,000 delta between the GS and the Z06. If the warranty is of concern(and I suspect it is for most of us, including myself), then adding $20,000 to the GS by having Callaway install their three element 2.3L supercharger would put you $5,000 over the cost of the Z06 and you would have the full warranty(part of the $20,000 would be for the optional full GM coverage on the Callaway package)'
The Callaway LT1 has 624 HP and 610 lb-ft of torque vs the Z06's 650 HP and 650 lb-ft of torque.
Now for the GS's gearing. If a M7, in first gear, the torque at the pinion would be 1488.5 lb-ft for the Z06 and 1811.7 lb-ft for the GS.
The greater torque at the rear wheels with the GS would mean quicker acceleration in a drag race or coming out of a corner on a road course.
In the real world, the improved cooling that the Callaway supercharger offers is a tremendous benefit.
As for the comments about the GS having less value if modded, I suspect a Callaway GS will have a higher long term value over the Z06.
You and I don't agree often, but I agree, the Callaway GS would probably be > a C7Z.
In the hands of an average enthusiast, the Callaway GS would probably be just as quick at the road course as the ZO6.
It comes with it's own warranty, won't overheat at the drop of a hat, and has desirability that no ZO6 will ever have in terms of being collectible and resale.
Just look at C6Zs now.. you can get them in the mid 30s sometimes, and their value is still plummeting.
Callaway C6s on the other hand still go usually in the mid 40s to 50s.
Callaway C4s? easily the most valuable C4s, aside from those 50 mile ZR-1s floating around.
I love the C7Z's performance envelope...but right now in the Corvette lineup, I don't think it's the best buy. A GS with the Callaway package probably is. Certainly is, if you plan on keeping the car over the long term. (As you can ALWAYS get parts for your Callaway. If you have a Callaway VIN, you can pretty much build a Callaway Corvette from the ground up from their website. Even the C4 Callaways. GM on the other hand... 5 years after the last year the Corvette in question is made, will stop carrying parts. 10 years after... you're either buying aftermarket parts, or your SOL)
For someone turning over a car in 5 years anyway for a newer model, that last one might not be a big deal. But for someone that hangs onto a car, or is buying one used, the Callaway is much better. Being able to buy parts for it, is a pretty big deal, especially if it's gonna spend any significant portion of it's life on a track.
This is a great debate. Strong opinions all 'round. Good. Clearly there will be no consensus, and why should there be? For those with the Z, it was a purchase made for a high performance car out of the box, so to speak, at a very reasonable price considering it can outgun many exotics.
Now, those without will justify a GS or Stingray because they don't need the power or prefer a different look. There's a certainly a cost factor, and some are torn between having the "top dog" at a discount or go with a higher trim, more customized "lesser" model.
Finally, we have the moders, it's almost an institution, a right of ownership, to begin tinkering with your car as soon as it gets back from the dealer. The good news is, there is the choice. I don't see why anyone would try to put down someone else's choice, clearly there are advantages and disadvantages.
I suppose we could add the C6 fans who may or may not approve of the new kid.
I can't help but wonder how many people who claim they'll drop in another engine in the GS to make it a wanna-be C7Z will actually do this. How many will get their brand new car home, then get rid of it again to have the engine installed, how many will realize that they're fixing to part with $15,000-$20,000 real dollars. All in the name of having a modded GS.
I don't see it.
I'm not sure if I posted this before, however I was faced with the mod bug wanting an A and A supercharger slapped on my 2015 Z51. At the end of the day, with huge discounts on the 2016 C7Z, knowing I would have a complete drivetrain warranty, $4,000 off for conquest rebate and GM card miles, it was cheaper and smarter to trade the Z51 for a C7Z.
I'm not a mechanic and if something went wrong with the modded Z51 that was a part of the drivetrain, I would have had to taken the car to the shop that modded it, then probably get put in the back of the line to get repairs that I may have had to pay for out of pocket.
Now if something is wrong, I just take it to the local Chevrolet place and have trained Corvette specialist handle it.
I can't help but wonder how many people who claim they'll drop in another engine in the GS to make it a wanna-be C7Z will actually do this. How many will get their brand new car home, then get rid of it again to have the engine installed, how many will realize that they're fixing to part with $15,000-$20,000 real dollars. All in the name of having a modded GS.
I don't see it.
I'm not sure if I posted this before, however I was faced with the mod bug wanting an A and A supercharger slapped on my 2015 Z51. At the end of the day, with huge discounts on the 2016 C7Z, knowing I would have a complete drivetrain warranty, $4,000 off for conquest rebate and GM card miles, it was cheaper and smarter to trade the Z51 for a C7Z.
I'm not a mechanic and if something went wrong with the modded Z51 that was a part of the drivetrain, I would have had to taken the car to the shop that modded it, then probably get put in the back of the line to get repairs that I may have had to pay for out of pocket.
Now if something is wrong, I just take it to the local Chevrolet place and have trained Corvette specialist handle it.
Take this from someone who has been really into the modding a car thing. I had a highly modded 2010 camaro LS3 years ago. My thoughts before and after modding my car are completely different.
Unless you have lots time, money , and other cars to spare. Having a real modded street car CAN be stressful.
People really underestimate how much convenience the OEM warranty give you. I am not a mechanic at all, i pay for everything. I literally sleep better at night knowing my if my car breaks down anywhere chevy will take care of my problems.
The core problem here is that many of these car enthusiasts mistakenly believed that forced induction horsepower is as good as naturally aspirated horsepower, when it's not even close. When you roll race 2x that forced induction car and get your butt handed to you by a naturally aspirated car with 150 less horsepower maybe they will finally understand. At the road race track it's not even close.
It's like thinking boob implants are just as good as natural *****. Way off.
I think that such a clueless statement and wrong statement. I get NA power is cool BUT If the cars are the same weight
same model.
You will not beat a SUPERCHARGED engine with another engine with 150 LESS HP.
You and I don't agree often, but I agree, the Callaway GS would probably be > a C7Z.
In the hands of an average enthusiast, the Callaway GS would probably be just as quick at the road course as the ZO6.
It comes with it's own warranty, won't overheat at the drop of a hat, and has desirability that no ZO6 will ever have in terms of being collectible and resale.
Just look at C6Zs now.. you can get them in the mid 30s sometimes, and their value is still plummeting.
Callaway C6s on the other hand still go usually in the mid 40s to 50s.
Callaway C4s? easily the most valuable C4s, aside from those 50 mile ZR-1s floating around.
I love the C7Z's performance envelope...but right now in the Corvette lineup, I don't think it's the best buy. A GS with the Callaway package probably is. Certainly is, if you plan on keeping the car over the long term. (As you can ALWAYS get parts for your Callaway. If you have a Callaway VIN, you can pretty much build a Callaway Corvette from the ground up from their website. Even the C4 Callaways. GM on the other hand... 5 years after the last year the Corvette in question is made, will stop carrying parts. 10 years after... you're either buying aftermarket parts, or your SOL)
For someone turning over a car in 5 years anyway for a newer model, that last one might not be a big deal. But for someone that hangs onto a car, or is buying one used, the Callaway is much better. Being able to buy parts for it, is a pretty big deal, especially if it's gonna spend any significant portion of it's life on a track.
People think it is the supercharger system with the heating issue on the Z06.
When the Callaway uses the SAME engine cooling system does it not?
So how does changing the supercharger fix the problem of not enough cooling capacity?
Then the manual has much less issue. Then the bench racing is a total laugh.
I think the Z06 walks the Callaway GS JOES gearing with the bench racing is a laugh.
We Know the Callaway C7 is slower than the Z06 as well so why would the heavier GS be quicker?
People think it is the supercharger system with the heating issue on the Z06.
When the Callaway uses the SAME engine cooling system does it not?
So how does changing the supercharger fix the problem of not enough cooling capacity?
Then the manual has much less issue. Then the bench racing is a total laugh.
I think the Z06 walks the Callaway GS JOES gearing with the bench racing is a laugh.
We Know the Callaway C7 is slower than the Z06 as well so why would the heavier GS be quicker?
For one the SC itself better cooled Callaway's SC is much better at keeping itself cool than the Eaton on the C7Z, for another thermal conduction would be much lower since it's not an overspun 1.7 L
PD blowers literally beat the **** out of the air to build boost. That's why their efficiency is so horrific, even after 50 years of development. But if you're going to have a PD blower, you want a bigger blower. The bigger the blower the less you have to spin it in order to generate the same power. (and is also why on lower boost they can also generate MORE power at times, than smaller blowers, because the air charge, as well as the actual heat of metal to metal contact is lower)
A more efficient blower will also result in lower ENGINE temps, as well, since the cooling system isn't working as hard as it would be with a less efficient system, due to a combination of thermal radiation, and thermal conduction. That's not factoring in any IAT delta as well.
Callaway, IIRC also upgrades the cooling system of the car. So no, not the same cooling. Callaway builds complete packages.
In the 1/4 stock to stock, sure a C7Z will be faster. But otherwise?
Same Aero on the GS. C7 Callaway doesn't have C7Z aero like the C7 GS Callaway would have. Road course to Road course, there would be very little difference if any delta at all, in the car's performance. Callaway's blower being much more thermally efficient, means over the long haul it will probably lap better times the longer it's driven, coupled with a better cooling system.
The 1.7 is also much closer to being maxed out than the 2.3 is that Callaway has designed. So as far as Post Warranty ownership (or if you give no **** about warranty) the 2.3 has a lot more power potential in it than the 1.7 has. That's physics. Arguing otherwise is like saying that a bigger engine, doesn't have more potential in it than a smaller one.
If you're going to go PD blower at all, the Callaway GS is the better car. Especially when you consider long time service life of the vehicle. 30 years from now, you'll be able to completely rebuild your Callaway C7s.
30 years from now, you'll be buying aftermarket imitations, NOS, or be SOL with C7Z parts. And that can make life a pain down the line, for long term ownership.
(Hell GM will quit making parts for it 5 years after the last year rolls off the line at Bowling Green entirely. Because that's when the warranty is out. Been there done that with multiple cars now)
I don't have a horse in this race, fyi. The C7Z is an amazing ride. But apples to apples, I'd rather take a GS and Callaway it. There's too much good that comes along with it, vs just another C7Z. Collector value, Resale, proven amazing customer service (far better than any Stealership I've ever gone to for a GM product), parts availability power potential... all of it points at the C7CGS over the C7Z.
Also imo, the Callaway C7s look cooler, with the hood cutout so that you can actually see the blower. Which is a subjective thing, sure but it's still a selling point all the same.
But Personally, if it were me I'd just get a GS Hot Cam it, throw on some long tube headers, haltech the intake, tune it, and call it a day. Cars with this kind of power level, and handling ability (hell any Corvette 4th gen and up really) any more than that and you need a Driver Mod to get the better times around a road course out of.
But of the "factory type" options, the Callaway is definitely a worthy consideration. More so than the C7Z imo.
I cant decide, its only about 10k more for a 1lz z06 2016 vs a 2017grand sport (if I get the 2lt).
The z06 is way faster than I can ever use but the price difference isnt that much.
Only thing I can think about in the z06 is I can smoke anything on the road short of modded vipers, 1000hp supras and gtr's, etc
The grand sport will barely keep up with a freakin tesla. Thats my only complaint. No hp increase means my coworkers tesla will beat me til I get over about 80mph. Who cares if its 109,000 it's a 4500lb sedan!! If I get the gs its for superior track use and more balanced setup.
It's up to you how much of the 650bhp you want to use...
If anything were to happen to engine, you can't take the car to Chevy since you don't have GM Warranty. Sure it's unlikely your engine will blow with the Edelbrock canned tune and blower, but you never know.
Also, why is that people were complaining about the Z06 being supercharged and how it's bad for the track, but now suddenly everyone's saying a GS with a blower is good??
The GS is an awesome car in it's own right I'm sure it'll perform well, but in the end, it isn't a Z06.
I agree! The whole point of the Grand Sport is high performance handling/tracking (especially with the Z07 package) using an NA engine. If you're looking for more power either build the LT1 or replace it with a more powerful NA engine.
I think that such a clueless statement and wrong statement. I get NA power is cool BUT If the cars are the same weight
same model.
You will not beat a SUPERCHARGED engine with another engine with 150 LESS HP.
If it's the same car the NA powered car would weigh less, in this case a little over a hundred pounds less. Now "depending on the track configuration" you could see a different outcome.
If it's the same car the NA powered car would weigh less, in this case a little over a hundred pounds less. Now "depending on the track configuration" you could see a different outcome.
Not really? At all!
The NA would also likely have less power. So what is the point?
What car has 650/650 NA to compare?
Not really? At all! Did not read
The NA would also likely have less power. So what is the point?
What car has 650/650 NA to compare?
You apparently did not read my complete comment. At certain tracks you cannot use all 650 HP. The placement of the extra 100 lbs would work against the heavier car on a tight track.
His one up attitude reminds me of a guy on the Charger forums. I could say I was at Pebble Beach and scored a 61, and this guy would say something like he was at Augusta golfing with Mickelson, Palmer, and Trevino.........out drove them on every hole and got a 60. Not only that, but he was hitting in the wind on most every hole. Some guys can't help themselves, they know more, have been more places, have a definite type A attitude, they are never wrong, etc.
Yep, the Forum rats bounce around, don't they. Now, I almost thought you were old, but it should have been Arnie, Lee and Gary Player....Mickelson was still breast feeding when the other 3 ruled the golf world! I guess Joe gave up with all the Forum heretics blowing up his "GS forced air modifications are better than a stock Z06" comments. You know what they say, opinions are like a certain body part...everybody has one. Have a nice evening!
I think that such a clueless statement and wrong statement. I get NA power is cool BUT If the cars are the same weight
same model.
You will not beat a SUPERCHARGED engine with another engine with 150 LESS HP.
Bro, on a summer night pull up next to a 600 crank hp NA vette and run against it. It will run even or beat a C7 Z06 the first run, on the 2nd run you'll lose by car lengths. By your 3rd run that NA car will take you by 10 lengths.
Once you add roadracing, shorter gearing, lighter weight it gets worse for the supercharged car.
The reality is that stock, the C7Z is an awesome GT car, not a track car.
Not really? At all!
The NA would also likely have less power. So what is the point?
What car has 650/650 NA to compare?
My C5 makes 600/560 to the tire NA, and has a 200 shot if that's not enough. I could definitely see the attraction of getting a GS and putting a similar motor in it, especially with the Z07 package.
I can also see the attraction of having the Z06 with the warranty. It's nice to have options so you can pick what's right for you.
Bro, on a summer night pull up next to a 600 crank hp NA vette and run against it. It will run even or beat a C7 Z06 the first run, on the 2nd run you'll lose by car lengths. By your 3rd run that NA car will take you by 10 lengths.
Once you add roadracing, shorter gearing, lighter weight it gets worse for the supercharged car.
The reality is that stock, the C7Z is an awesome GT car, not a track car.
Brosavelt you must be 14 or 16 and dreaming on cluelessly!
Which track are you at?
The C7Z06 doesn't lose ground on the second run . I have both cars.
570 NA and 700 Supercharged. Kids thinking the NA doesn't get hot or pull timing HAHA
06-12-2016, 05:24 AM
If anything were to happen to engine, you can't take the car to Chevy since you don't have GM Warranty. Sure it's unlikely your engine will blow with the Edelbrock canned tune and blower, but you never know.
