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You hit the nail on the head with your comment. The percentage should be 98%.
There are two sides to this whole "ring time" thing. The following is the truth even if people don't want to admit it.
1. GM did call this C7 Z06 "the most track capable Corvette ever" That is a pretty bold claim. They also upon release of the car mentioned numerous times the extensive time spent on the Nurburgring and even had a picture of the ring behind the Z06 when they debuted the car. They even have a Nurburgring edition. If you cannot see the mistake and irony here by never actually releasing an official lap time than you are a delusional fanboy.
2. On the flip side you are absolutely correct that probably 98% of Z06 owners will never take their car to the Nurburgring and the lap time means nothing to them. Also I'd say it's fair to state that 99.9% of Z06 owners if they DID drive their own car on the Ring would NEVER be able to match the best set lap anyway so who gives a ****.
The last part of this though is marketing. If you think a good ring time wouldn't have sold more cars I disagree. People LOVE bragging rights. I can all but guarantee there will be PLENTY of Dodge Demon owners who never take their car to the track. They will however wax it and take it to every cars and coffee and tell every single person that they can get to listen, that it runs a 9.6 quarter mile. GUARANTEEEEED
ps- I am not really addressing ovr60 just both sides of the argument.
There are two sides to this whole "ring time" thing. The following is the truth even if people don't want to admit it.
1. GM did call this C7 Z06 "the most track capable Corvette ever" That is a pretty bold claim. They also upon release of the car mentioned numerous times the extensive time spent on the Nurburgring and even had a picture of the ring behind the Z06 when they debuted the car. They even have a Nurburgring edition. If you cannot see the mistake and irony here by never actually releasing an official lap time than you are a delusional fanboy.
2. On the flip side you are absolutely correct that probably 98% of Z06 owners will never take their car to the Nurburgring and the lap time means nothing to them. Also I'd say it's fair to state that 99.9% of Z06 owners if they DID drive their own car on the Ring would NEVER be able to match the best set lap anyway so who gives a ****.
The last part of this though is marketing. If you think a good ring time wouldn't have sold more cars I disagree. People LOVE bragging rights. I can all but guarantee there will be PLENTY of Dodge Demon owners who never take their car to the track. They will however wax it and take it to every cars and coffee and tell every single person that they can get to listen, that it runs a 9.6 quarter mile. GUARANTEEEEED
I can guaranteeeeeeeeee that a bunch of the 98 percenters, who claim that the Ring time doesn't mean ****, would reverse their comments if Mero had run a 7 flat time instead of wrecking the yellow Z06 at the Ring.
If Mero had run a 7 flat time, a huge bunch of those 98 percenters would be braggingggggg like hell on this forum about how great a time the C7 Z06 laid down at the Ring. They sure as hell wouldn't be apologizing about the time or about GM or Tadge.
I can guaranteeeeeeeeee that a bunch of the 98 percenters, who claim that the Ring time doesn't mean ****, would reverse their comments if Mero had run a 7 flat time instead of wrecking the yellow Z06 at the Ring.
If Mero had run a 7 flat time, a huge bunch of those 98 percenters would be braggingggggg like hell on this forum about how great a time the C7 Z06 laid down at the Ring. They sure as hell wouldn't be apologizing about the time or about GM or Tadge.
I don't doubt that. I am sure some that claim they don't care are just defending their 80-100K purchase. Not uncommon for people to become defensive in a situation like that. I also think the same people that claim they don't care would be bragging and excited if the car did post some insane lap time. Human nature. I still think everything i said is true.
The the C7 Z most likey could not match the ZR1's time, so they did not and will not publish it. What was learned on the Z06 will be applied to the new ZR1.
Though a very little bit disappointing after all of Tadge's Nuburgring hoopla, this does not stop me from enjoying my car and knowing that it is one fast SOB.
The truth is that the C7 Z could not match the ZR1's time, so they did not and will not publish it. What was learned on the Z06 will be applied to the new ZR1.
Though a very little bit disappointing after all of Tadge's Nuburgring hoopla, this does not stop me from enjoying my car and knowing that it is one fast SOB.
That cannot be said with certainty either because the C7Z DID best the C6 ZR1 lap times on plenty of other well known tracks including Laguna Seca and Willow Springs.
The question was and probably still is can the C7Z complete a lap that lasts as long as the Nurburgring lap without suffering from serious heatsoak and thus hurting it's times. Judging by the lack of no official lap times on the ring, I would guess the answer is probably not.
Judging by the lack of no official lap times on the ring, I would guess the answer is probably not.
Were I a betting man, I'd bet a lot of money against your guess.
And I'd win a lot more.
Absent of information to the contrary, people will make up their own minds and invent "facts" to fill in knowledge gaps. Which is very evident in this and every other N'Ring thread that breaks out on CF. It's almost comical.
No one participating in this thread knows the exact lap time the Z06 pulled at the 'Ring a year or so ago. I've received enough info from sources that I know for a fact the car beat the ZR1's time handily. But it doesn't matter, because I'm not in a position to release that data.
Neither is anyone on the Corvette team. I've tried to explain it to folks multiple times, but every time I do, I get told I don't know what I'm talking about. Simply put: the announcement, video, and data all belong the GM corporate. It's out of team Corvette's hands completely. For reasons only GM seems to know.
Don't think for a moment that the entire engineering team likes this. They all wanted to make the announcement, with video, and enjoy the resulting "good press" as it were. In fact, I was going to work with team Corvette and announce the time here on Corvette Forum an hour before anyone in the press knew about it.
But the parent company squashed it at the last minute, and that's that. It's done and over with and we're probably not ever going to find out the (very impressive) number. I can't say why because I don't know exactly why. I just know that the team is as frustrated as a few folks here are (I'm not counting the trolls; they can go play in traffic for all I care).
Now to the naysayers (aka: trolls) - Step carefully here, lest you want to make yourselves look even more foolish than you already do. Feel free to doubt me, but before you publicly call me out, please also count the number of times I've posted incorrect information centered around the Corvette.
Were I a betting man, I'd bet a lot of money against your guess.
And I'd win a lot more.
Absent of information to the contrary, people will make up their own minds and invent "facts" to fill in knowledge gaps. Which is very evident in this and every other N'Ring thread that breaks out on CF. It's almost comical.
No one participating in this thread knows the exact lap time the Z06 pulled at the 'Ring a year or so ago. I've received enough info from sources that I know for a fact the car beat the ZR1's time handily. But it doesn't matter, because I'm not in a position to release that data.
Neither is anyone on the Corvette team. I've tried to explain it to folks multiple times, but every time I do, I get told I don't know what I'm talking about. Simply put: the announcement, video, and data all belong the GM corporate. It's out of team Corvette's hands completely. For reasons only GM seems to know.
Don't think for a moment that the entire engineering team likes this. They all wanted to make the announcement, with video, and enjoy the resulting "good press" as it were. In fact, I was going to work with team Corvette and announce the time here on Corvette Forum an hour before anyone in the press knew about it.
But the parent company squashed it at the last minute, and that's that. It's done and over with and we're probably not ever going to find out the (very impressive) number. I can't say why because I don't know exactly why. I just know that the team is as frustrated as a few folks here are (I'm not counting the trolls; they can go play in traffic for all I care).
Now to the naysayers (aka: trolls) - Step carefully here, lest you want to make yourselves look even more foolish than you already do. Feel free to doubt me, but before you publicly call me out, please also count the number of times I've posted incorrect information centered around the Corvette.
JVP I hope you were not specifically meaning me. Obviously you are quite respected here and have a wealth of knowledge. You have even helped me out before on this forum and I appreciate that. If what you say is true, then that is great and I would be happy to know that. I am a fan of the car regardless of the lap time.
However I am sure you being a reasonable guy can still understand by not releasing the time where all the doubt and negativity come from.
I've never seen you mention what you just did because the Ring thing is not a big deal to me and I don't frequent every thread in regard to the topic.
Also do you have any idea why the parent company would stop the info from being released? What possible reason would anyone related to Corvette have to do such a thing?
I was only calling out your concern regarding the "overheating". The trolls I referenced all know who I'm talking to and about.
Also do you have any idea why the parent company would stop the info from being released?
Nope. As I said in my previous post that you quoted: I don't know why it's being buried. But it is. And it's out of all of our hands' collectively. There's no gnashing of teeth and pounding on keyboards that will likely change GM's mind on that. It's their data, and they'll release it if and when they want to. No sooner.
Say as the man says it exists, and it was good. But, simply as a matter of fact that car has a deficient SC, and can in certain circumstances need a 100 octane tune. Add the power steering and radiator tweaks.
How legitament, and valid, would that time be anyway? The car has been too inconsistent; it's not robust enough!
Last edited by johnglenntwo; 05-16-2017 at 09:19 PM.
Were I a betting man, I'd bet a lot of money against your guess.
And I'd win a lot more.
Absent of information to the contrary, people will make up their own minds and invent "facts" to fill in knowledge gaps. Which is very evident in this and every other N'Ring thread that breaks out on CF. It's almost comical.
No one participating in this thread knows the exact lap time the Z06 pulled at the 'Ring a year or so ago. I've received enough info from sources that I know for a fact the car beat the ZR1's time handily. But it doesn't matter, because I'm not in a position to release that data.
Neither is anyone on the Corvette team. I've tried to explain it to folks multiple times, but every time I do, I get told I don't know what I'm talking about. Simply put: the announcement, video, and data all belong the GM corporate. It's out of team Corvette's hands completely. For reasons only GM seems to know.
Don't think for a moment that the entire engineering team likes this. They all wanted to make the announcement, with video, and enjoy the resulting "good press" as it were. In fact, I was going to work with team Corvette and announce the time here on Corvette Forum an hour before anyone in the press knew about it.
But the parent company squashed it at the last minute, and that's that. It's done and over with and we're probably not ever going to find out the (very impressive) number. I can't say why because I don't know exactly why. I just know that the team is as frustrated as a few folks here are (I'm not counting the trolls; they can go play in traffic for all I care).
Now to the naysayers (aka: trolls) - Step carefully here, lest you want to make yourselves look even more foolish than you already do. Feel free to doubt me, but before you publicly call me out, please also count the number of times I've posted incorrect information centered around the Corvette.
Lots and lots of words, inferences of influence and power, and even a veiled threat to not doubt your post. What a read! And after all that you have exactly 0% more factual info about the Ring time than anyone else here.
Man, give some people a taste of power and watch them lose it. I really love the "I'm not in a position to release that data" but then you do exactly that by saying that it beat the ZR1s 7:19 time? If I was your contact person on team Corvette that alone would get you cut off for good.
What happened to your last excuse.. sorry insider info - that GM needed to pay $26K to release the time. Can we count that towards one of the times you have been incorrect about Corvette info? Or are you sticking with that ridiculous scenario?
What's comical is you still defending this debacle for almost two years now. How many manufacturers have released Ring times since the first C7 Z06 crash on the Ring in Oct. 2014? Porsche, Lamborghini, Honda even the Camaro has released a timed run. We're about to enter year 5 of C7 Production with ZERO ring times for any of the 3 models.
Oh no!?! I guessI called you out. Please have mercy on me. Is the Tadge Police going to come arrest me? Are they coming "soon" - will I have time to "do the math" for my attorney fees?
You can call me a Troll all you like but at least I'm not a clown.
Were I a betting man, I'd bet a lot of money against your guess.
And I'd win a lot more.
Absent of information to the contrary, people will make up their own minds and invent "facts" to fill in knowledge gaps. Which is very evident in this and every other N'Ring thread that breaks out on CF. It's almost comical.
No one participating in this thread knows the exact lap time the Z06 pulled at the 'Ring a year or so ago. I've received enough info from sources that I know for a fact the car beat the ZR1's time handily. But it doesn't matter, because I'm not in a position to release that data.
Neither is anyone on the Corvette team. I've tried to explain it to folks multiple times, but every time I do, I get told I don't know what I'm talking about. Simply put: the announcement, video, and data all belong the GM corporate. It's out of team Corvette's hands completely. For reasons only GM seems to know.
Don't think for a moment that the entire engineering team likes this. They all wanted to make the announcement, with video, and enjoy the resulting "good press" as it were. In fact, I was going to work with team Corvette and announce the time here on Corvette Forum an hour before anyone in the press knew about it.
But the parent company squashed it at the last minute, and that's that. It's done and over with and we're probably not ever going to find out the (very impressive) number. I can't say why because I don't know exactly why. I just know that the team is as frustrated as a few folks here are (I'm not counting the trolls; they can go play in traffic for all I care).
Now to the naysayers (aka: trolls) - Step carefully here, lest you want to make yourselves look even more foolish than you already do. Feel free to doubt me, but before you publicly call me out, please also count the number of times I've posted incorrect information centered around the Corvette.
Please. Spare us the condescending attitude JVP. You have no more official info than any other poster here. And basic logic makes it clear that the Z06, with a mere 12hp more (2%) and a sh*tload more drag due to aero than the ZR1, not to mention more severe heat management issues, is simply NOT going to "beat the ZR1 handily" on a 7-minute road course which requires very high speeds and power. A 2-3 minute lap, sure. But not at the ring. Sorry, but basic physics dictates otherwise.
That cannot be said with certainty either because the C7Z DID best the C6 ZR1 lap times on plenty of other well known tracks including Laguna Seca and Willow Springs.
The question was and probably still is can the C7Z complete a lap that lasts as long as the Nurburgring lap without suffering from serious heatsoak and thus hurting it's times. Judging by the lack of no official lap times on the ring, I would guess the answer is probably not.
Agree and did not mean to infer certainty. The tracks you refer to are much shorter and tighter, which would advantage the Z and its tremendous mid-speed downforce. But the Z06 does not have enough additional power over the ZR1 to overcome the chassis' substantial additional drag from aero, and this hurts it on a hgh speed track vs th ZR. Over 100 mph, the ZR1 will pull demonstably on a Z06 due to the latter's drag.
I don't think you understand physics as they pertain to vehicular engineering quite the way you think you do. I'm also positive that, regarding the topic at hand, you haven't clue one what you're talking about. You're making up "facts" to suit your narrative, which is pathetic and comical at the same time.
If GM publishes a time, will you be the first one to apologize to them? I know the answer, but why don't you tell everyone else.
And as far as condescending, I'll continue to do so towards the know-nothings on this forum. Count yourself among them. Whether you want to accept the evidence that's been presented to you or not isn't really my problem. It's been staring you right in the face for almost two years.
Originally Posted by Tadge
Last week, we were finally able to confirm the performance of the car on a continuous lap of the Nurburgring. We are putting together the press release and will have the lap time and video out shortly. I can tell you we were more than satisfied with the results.
So you're calling the man a liar? That takes either a set of brass ***** the size of softballs, or intense ignorance.
I don't think you understand physics as they pertain to vehicular engineering quite the way you think you do. I'm also positive that, regarding the topic at hand, you haven't clue one what you're talking about. You're making up "facts" to suit your narrative, which is pathetic and comical at the same time.
If GM publishes a time, will you be the first one to apologize to them? I know the answer, but why don't you tell everyone else.
And as far as condescending, I'll continue to do so towards the know-nothings on this forum. Count yourself among them. Whether you want to accept the evidence that's been presented to you or not isn't really my problem. It's been staring you right in the face for almost two years.
So you're calling the man a liar? That takes either a set of brass ***** the size of softballs, or intense ignorance.
GM by definition is!
Lying by omission
Also known as a continuing misrepresentation, lying by omission occurs when an important fact is left out in order to foster a misconception. Lying by omission includes failures to correct pre-existing misconceptions. For example, when the seller of a car declares it has been serviced regularly but does not tell that a fault was reported at the last service, the seller lies by omission. It can be compared to dissimulation.
An omission is when a person tells most of the truth, but leaves out a few key facts that therefore completely change the story.
05-16-2017, 10:09 AM
If you cannot see the mistake and irony here by never actually releasing an official lap time than you are a delusional fanboy. 
