Track preparation - What's realistic?
07-08-2017, 09:18 PM
#1
Track preparation - What's realistic?
Greetings. I pulled the trigger on a Watkins Glen 1LZ M7. Will be built later this month. The car will be mainly for track duty (advanced level) and light street driving. I read the manual for track prep and it seems a bit over the top.
Question for those who track their cars. Do you really go through all of these steps? What's realistic?
I understand that you need to
- Change the oil to 15W50, overfill, and change it back to 5W30 after every track event. Is this really necessary?
- Change the rear axle fluid every 24 hours of racing? That's roughly every 6 events.
- The brake burnish procedure requires braking at least 75 times! Seems like the whole procedure take more than 1 hour of highway driving...
- Front brake cooling kit needs to be installed (and but back to normal after track use)?
- Wheel blockers need to be installed and de-installed after each event?
- Brake fluid needs to be changed every month?
Looks like you need a few hours of serious mechanic work (beyond the normal inspection/brake bleeding) before any track event.
I tracked a 911 before. Bedding the brakes (pagid yellows) was braking hard around 10 times on the highway. High perf brake fluid was changed every 6 months. Never had any fade. The track oil stayed in the car for a year and did not need to overfill/remove, etc.
What's practical? What do you guys do?
Thanks a lot!
FM
Question for those who track their cars. Do you really go through all of these steps? What's realistic?
I understand that you need to
- Change the oil to 15W50, overfill, and change it back to 5W30 after every track event. Is this really necessary?
- Change the rear axle fluid every 24 hours of racing? That's roughly every 6 events.
- The brake burnish procedure requires braking at least 75 times! Seems like the whole procedure take more than 1 hour of highway driving...
- Front brake cooling kit needs to be installed (and but back to normal after track use)?
- Wheel blockers need to be installed and de-installed after each event?
- Brake fluid needs to be changed every month?
Looks like you need a few hours of serious mechanic work (beyond the normal inspection/brake bleeding) before any track event.
I tracked a 911 before. Bedding the brakes (pagid yellows) was braking hard around 10 times on the highway. High perf brake fluid was changed every 6 months. Never had any fade. The track oil stayed in the car for a year and did not need to overfill/remove, etc.
What's practical? What do you guys do?
Thanks a lot!
FM
07-08-2017, 09:53 PM
#2
Tech Contributor
Member Since: Oct 1999
Location: Charlotte, NC (formerly Endicott, NY)
Posts: 40,089
Received 8,928 Likes
on
5,333 Posts
Greetings. I pulled the trigger on a Watkins Glen 1LZ M7. Will be built later this month. The car will be mainly for track duty (advanced level) and light street driving. I read the manual for track prep and it seems a bit over the top.
Question for those who track their cars. Do you really go through all of these steps? What's realistic?
I understand that you need to
- Change the oil to 15W50, overfill, and change it back to 5W30 after every track event. Is this really necessary?
This is covered in the Ask Tadge Questions. It is one he chose to answer and the beauty of his answer is in what he didn't say. The reason they want us to change back is because there is a higher probability of cat converter failure within the 8 Yr/80K Mile Emissions Warranty. There fuel economy is also reduced when running that oil which would also affect their fuel mileage certification. That is why the oil isn't recommended for street driving.
- Change the rear axle fluid every 24 hours of racing? That's roughly every 6 events.
It is changed after the first event and after every 24 hours. This wasn't a recommended service until the 2010s hit the streets. I suspect it is due to lessons learned in the prior 13 years. The diff is a ZF diff by the way.
- The brake burnish procedure requires braking at least 75 times! Seems like the whole procedure take more than 1 hour of highway driving...
That is the ceramic brake package and it probably applies to all cars that use those brakes including Porsches, Ferrari's and Lambos.
- Front brake cooling kit needs to be installed (and but back to normal after track use)?
I leave mine on. There is a small risk that something could be picked up from the street and thrown into the rotor.
- Wheel blockers need to be installed and de-installed after each event?
I would probably take them off if I had them on the car.
- Brake fluid needs to be changed every month?
That is standard for any car being tracked. If the fluid is over a month old it should be changed.
Looks like you need a few hours of serious mechanic work (beyond the normal inspection/brake bleeding) before any track event.
I tracked a 911 before. Bedding the brakes (pagid yellows) was braking hard around 10 times on the highway. High perf brake fluid was changed every 6 months. Never had any fade. The track oil stayed in the car for a year and did not need to overfill/remove, etc.
What's practical? What do you guys do?
Thanks a lot!
FM
Question for those who track their cars. Do you really go through all of these steps? What's realistic?
I understand that you need to
- Change the oil to 15W50, overfill, and change it back to 5W30 after every track event. Is this really necessary?
This is covered in the Ask Tadge Questions. It is one he chose to answer and the beauty of his answer is in what he didn't say. The reason they want us to change back is because there is a higher probability of cat converter failure within the 8 Yr/80K Mile Emissions Warranty. There fuel economy is also reduced when running that oil which would also affect their fuel mileage certification. That is why the oil isn't recommended for street driving.
- Change the rear axle fluid every 24 hours of racing? That's roughly every 6 events.
It is changed after the first event and after every 24 hours. This wasn't a recommended service until the 2010s hit the streets. I suspect it is due to lessons learned in the prior 13 years. The diff is a ZF diff by the way.
- The brake burnish procedure requires braking at least 75 times! Seems like the whole procedure take more than 1 hour of highway driving...
That is the ceramic brake package and it probably applies to all cars that use those brakes including Porsches, Ferrari's and Lambos.
- Front brake cooling kit needs to be installed (and but back to normal after track use)?
I leave mine on. There is a small risk that something could be picked up from the street and thrown into the rotor.
- Wheel blockers need to be installed and de-installed after each event?
I would probably take them off if I had them on the car.
- Brake fluid needs to be changed every month?
That is standard for any car being tracked. If the fluid is over a month old it should be changed.
Looks like you need a few hours of serious mechanic work (beyond the normal inspection/brake bleeding) before any track event.
I tracked a 911 before. Bedding the brakes (pagid yellows) was braking hard around 10 times on the highway. High perf brake fluid was changed every 6 months. Never had any fade. The track oil stayed in the car for a year and did not need to overfill/remove, etc.
What's practical? What do you guys do?
Thanks a lot!
FM
Bill
Last edited by Bill Dearborn; 07-08-2017 at 09:54 PM.
The following users liked this post:
C306 (07-09-2017)
07-08-2017, 10:33 PM
#4
Melting Slicks
The list seems daunting but I pick my battles.
I now swap to 15-50 when 'track season' starts, leave it in, and go back to 5-30 when it's over. I live in FL so I never see cold weather with the heavier weight oil in.
Rear end fluid swaps are 30 minute jobs with a Motive fluid transfer pump and a nice 3/8 angling ratchet. Did a couple changes early on in ownership at 1000 miles and after my first event. Now I'm doing the 24 track hour schedule. If you're not a big guy, you can even do it with the wheels on the ground. I sometimes save this for a different work session if I'm losing interest in car chores since I don't need to raise the car to swap the fluid.
I installed the wheel blockers for my iron brakes. They stay on all the time and I have no issues.
My rotors last about five track days. I've found a roloc disc and an angle grinder work fine for removing pad deposits and then I swap my street pads back in. Doesn't take more than 30 minutes to touch up the rotor surfaces when changing pads.
Using Castrol SRF I've never boiled my fluid. I do a full bleed at the start of track season and then a quick bleed before each event during the season. With the Motive bleeder, it's 10 minutes to quick bleed when the wheels are off.
I've finally got myself a second set of wheels and now run MPSSs on the street and the Cup tires for track.
So with this routine my first event of the season would take about 2 hours of car prep. Each subsequent event is about 1 hour of prep. Going back to street trim takes about an hour but I'm a fanatic about cleaning rubber marks off the car and that's probably another hour of post-event cleaning, waxing, detailing.
It's all pretty second nature now so I just throw on some tunes and find a free couple hours in the afternoon.
I now swap to 15-50 when 'track season' starts, leave it in, and go back to 5-30 when it's over. I live in FL so I never see cold weather with the heavier weight oil in.
Rear end fluid swaps are 30 minute jobs with a Motive fluid transfer pump and a nice 3/8 angling ratchet. Did a couple changes early on in ownership at 1000 miles and after my first event. Now I'm doing the 24 track hour schedule. If you're not a big guy, you can even do it with the wheels on the ground. I sometimes save this for a different work session if I'm losing interest in car chores since I don't need to raise the car to swap the fluid.
I installed the wheel blockers for my iron brakes. They stay on all the time and I have no issues.
My rotors last about five track days. I've found a roloc disc and an angle grinder work fine for removing pad deposits and then I swap my street pads back in. Doesn't take more than 30 minutes to touch up the rotor surfaces when changing pads.
Using Castrol SRF I've never boiled my fluid. I do a full bleed at the start of track season and then a quick bleed before each event during the season. With the Motive bleeder, it's 10 minutes to quick bleed when the wheels are off.
I've finally got myself a second set of wheels and now run MPSSs on the street and the Cup tires for track.
So with this routine my first event of the season would take about 2 hours of car prep. Each subsequent event is about 1 hour of prep. Going back to street trim takes about an hour but I'm a fanatic about cleaning rubber marks off the car and that's probably another hour of post-event cleaning, waxing, detailing.
It's all pretty second nature now so I just throw on some tunes and find a free couple hours in the afternoon.
Last edited by spearfish25; 07-08-2017 at 10:37 PM.
The following users liked this post:
C306 (07-09-2017)
07-08-2017, 10:35 PM
#5
Definitely do a quality track alignment including rear caster. If you're going to track the car hard do yourself a favor and pull the CCBs and replace them with the AP Racing kit. My new 2017 C7Z has 240 miles on it and I just finished swapping the CCBs for the AP Racing kit. Ran this setup extensively on my 2015 C7Z and works better than stock and has far lower consumable costs.
For your other questions, here's what I do:
- Run 5W30 in the Winter when you're not tracking. If you're going to track in very cold weather (below 40F) then consider running 5W50 until it warms up - for me this is usually an early Spring thing. Then run 15W50 the rest of the year and change every 15-20 track hours.
- Swap the brake fluid out with Castrol SRF. Change it in the Spring and occassionally bleed a little off the calipers just to make sure there's no air.
- You don't run the wheel blockers with CCBs or the AP Racing setup, just the factory iron setup. I run the cooling scoops year round.
- Brake burnishing is pretty standard and yes the CCBs need a bit more heat to really work well. Check out the video at Essex Parts for good general guidance on bedding pads for iron setups. I do mine on the track in the first few laps of a session.
Other than that, I'd definitely recommend the DSC Sport suspension controller and the Tractive DDA shocks if you want to go to the next level. Get a set of 18" rims so you can run slicks or scrubs.
For your other questions, here's what I do:
- Run 5W30 in the Winter when you're not tracking. If you're going to track in very cold weather (below 40F) then consider running 5W50 until it warms up - for me this is usually an early Spring thing. Then run 15W50 the rest of the year and change every 15-20 track hours.
- Swap the brake fluid out with Castrol SRF. Change it in the Spring and occassionally bleed a little off the calipers just to make sure there's no air.
- You don't run the wheel blockers with CCBs or the AP Racing setup, just the factory iron setup. I run the cooling scoops year round.
- Brake burnishing is pretty standard and yes the CCBs need a bit more heat to really work well. Check out the video at Essex Parts for good general guidance on bedding pads for iron setups. I do mine on the track in the first few laps of a session.
Other than that, I'd definitely recommend the DSC Sport suspension controller and the Tractive DDA shocks if you want to go to the next level. Get a set of 18" rims so you can run slicks or scrubs.
The following users liked this post:
C306 (07-09-2017)
07-08-2017, 10:44 PM
#6
Thanks a lot, Bill!
Track cornering alignment will need to be performed for sure. But hopefully, I can still drive on the street (carefully) with the track alignment, right?
On the brakes, I read the procedure for the "Z06 without ceramic brakes". p168/169 of the manual online talks about these 3x 25 steps. Seems a bit strange. Would that apply as well if I change the pads to Pagids (if I can find them)
Brake fluid change requirement for PCA, BMWCCA driver's education is only every 6 months. Would high perf (Motul, ATE, etc.) be more hygroscopic in a C7? Any reason it behaves differently?
Thanks again!
FM
Track cornering alignment will need to be performed for sure. But hopefully, I can still drive on the street (carefully) with the track alignment, right?
On the brakes, I read the procedure for the "Z06 without ceramic brakes". p168/169 of the manual online talks about these 3x 25 steps. Seems a bit strange. Would that apply as well if I change the pads to Pagids (if I can find them)
Brake fluid change requirement for PCA, BMWCCA driver's education is only every 6 months. Would high perf (Motul, ATE, etc.) be more hygroscopic in a C7? Any reason it behaves differently?
Thanks again!
FM
07-08-2017, 10:55 PM
#7
Thanks, Alex and Poor-sha.
Just to clarify, I did not order CCB. Just regular brakes since it was for track. 1-2 hours of pre track work including wheel change seems more reasonable and in line with my experience with the 911.
A second set wheels (18s) is definitively on the books. Do you have recommendations, at a reasonable price?.
Thanks a lot!
Just to clarify, I did not order CCB. Just regular brakes since it was for track. 1-2 hours of pre track work including wheel change seems more reasonable and in line with my experience with the 911.
A second set wheels (18s) is definitively on the books. Do you have recommendations, at a reasonable price?.
Thanks a lot!
07-09-2017, 12:20 AM
#8
Bill and Sean covered it all.
As for track wheels, Forgeline is the way to go. 18x10 front and 18x12 rear. Some will tell you to go with 8x11 and 8x13 but I don't recommend it as wider wheels might interfere with control arms when you lift the car and make it difficult to mount wheels. Order them for Z07 so they would have extra clearance. Order through xplosive performance (forum Vendor) as they offer pretty good discount.
As for track wheels, Forgeline is the way to go. 18x10 front and 18x12 rear. Some will tell you to go with 8x11 and 8x13 but I don't recommend it as wider wheels might interfere with control arms when you lift the car and make it difficult to mount wheels. Order them for Z07 so they would have extra clearance. Order through xplosive performance (forum Vendor) as they offer pretty good discount.
The following users liked this post:
C306 (07-09-2017)
07-09-2017, 08:42 AM
#9
I'd go 18x11F and 18x12 rear as the control arm issue is in the rear. A lot of us run 305 or 315 front tires so I think 10" rim would be too narrow but haven't verified.
Other common options are Finspeed and CCW.
Other common options are Finspeed and CCW.
07-09-2017, 09:14 AM
#10
Melting Slicks
As already stated:
Brakes (stock calipers/rotors)
- DTC 60/70 pads
- Castrol SRF fluid
- '17 ducting
Rear Diff
- Mobil 1 Delvac
Oil
- Synthetic 0w50
Transmission (manual)
- AFT4 synthetic
DSC
- Controller
- Track/street alignment
GM
- Auxiliary cooler
- Stage 3 aero
Just because
- red seat belts
- ZL1 add-ons tow hooks
- Jake sticker
- Callaway SC757 upgrade
Brakes (stock calipers/rotors)
- DTC 60/70 pads
- Castrol SRF fluid
- '17 ducting
Rear Diff
- Mobil 1 Delvac
Oil
- Synthetic 0w50
Transmission (manual)
- AFT4 synthetic
DSC
- Controller
- Track/street alignment
GM
- Auxiliary cooler
- Stage 3 aero
Just because
- red seat belts
- ZL1 add-ons tow hooks
- Jake sticker
- Callaway SC757 upgrade
07-09-2017, 04:07 PM
#11
Racer
07-09-2017, 05:28 PM
#12
I run 285 front and 315 rear. I like this combination. No rubbing at all and car is very planted. Only mod is DSC controller and track prep according to the manual.
07-09-2017, 05:29 PM
#13
Nitto Nt-01
07-09-2017, 06:54 PM
#14
What wheel size are you using?
Thx!
FM
07-09-2017, 07:07 PM
#15
07-09-2017, 08:27 PM
#16
Tech Contributor
Member Since: Oct 1999
Location: Charlotte, NC (formerly Endicott, NY)
Posts: 40,089
Received 8,928 Likes
on
5,333 Posts
Thanks a lot, Bill!
Track cornering alignment will need to be performed for sure. But hopefully, I can still drive on the street (carefully) with the track alignment, right?
You can but if you have toe out it will cause greater wear of the inside edge of the tires.
On the brakes, I read the procedure for the "Z06 without ceramic brakes". p168/169 of the manual online talks about these 3x 25 steps. Seems a bit strange. Would that apply as well if I change the pads to Pagids (if I can find them)
Burnishing the brake pads is a good idea on any car. Usually car companies burnish the pads on any car they give to the press for testing.
Brake fluid change requirement for PCA, BMWCCA driver's education is only every 6 months. Would high perf (Motul, ATE, etc.) be more hygroscopic in a C7? Any reason it behaves differently?
The ones I go to have a 30 day limit and one of the groups I have run with checks the fluid for moisture content.
Thanks again!
FM
Track cornering alignment will need to be performed for sure. But hopefully, I can still drive on the street (carefully) with the track alignment, right?
You can but if you have toe out it will cause greater wear of the inside edge of the tires.
On the brakes, I read the procedure for the "Z06 without ceramic brakes". p168/169 of the manual online talks about these 3x 25 steps. Seems a bit strange. Would that apply as well if I change the pads to Pagids (if I can find them)
Burnishing the brake pads is a good idea on any car. Usually car companies burnish the pads on any car they give to the press for testing.
Brake fluid change requirement for PCA, BMWCCA driver's education is only every 6 months. Would high perf (Motul, ATE, etc.) be more hygroscopic in a C7? Any reason it behaves differently?
The ones I go to have a 30 day limit and one of the groups I have run with checks the fluid for moisture content.
Thanks again!
FM
07-09-2017, 08:48 PM
#17
On the Pirelli slicks I'm either running a 305/660-18 or 305/645-18 front. Pirelli specs the 305/645-18 on a 10.5-11.5 rim but the 305/660-18 at 10.0-11.0 inch rim.
07-09-2017, 09:41 PM
#18
Melting Slicks
Member Since: Feb 2009
Location: Dallas Georgia
Posts: 2,787
Received 594 Likes
on
408 Posts
2020 Corvette of the Year Finalist (track prepared)
C3 of Year Winner (track prepared) 2019
I run a 315 front when I need to run a 200TW for certain events as well. BFG Rivals come in 315/335 sizes, which work perfect on my 18x11, 18x13 Forgelines.
The following users liked this post:
TCorzett (07-09-2017)
07-09-2017, 11:41 PM
#19
Racer
Autocross only, or also for track duty? How do they hold-up (for what they are) to longer/warmer sessions? Compared to the Z07 Sport Cups?
07-10-2017, 08:28 AM
#20
Melting Slicks
Member Since: Feb 2009
Location: Dallas Georgia
Posts: 2,787
Received 594 Likes
on
408 Posts
2020 Corvette of the Year Finalist (track prepared)
C3 of Year Winner (track prepared) 2019
Both. I would not buy the tire as a "track only" tire unless you are running in a series or class that requires a 200TW tires. I need more camber and am killing the outer edge of my tire with 2 degrees front and 1.6 rear but plan to correct that before my next big event. I'm thinking 2.5-3 degrees front and around 2 in the rear should help. As far as a street tire on the track, the BFG Rival S is pretty phenomenal. I was running at Autobahn Country Club the beginning of July with a group and was putting down laps as fast as a C6Z on Pirelli slicks (in fact, I was faster by the end of the weekend), and a Porsche 944 track car on R7s. The 944 was not running as wide of a tire but the C6 was, and had extensive aero to boot. They do get slick after a while, but so too do the Cup 2s. If you are going for fast lap, that is usually lap 2 and they gradually fall off after that. That being said, I've run 20 minute sessions on Rivals and maintained pace to a pretty close margin. What I find is that my personal driving style has me push harder and harder as the laps tick off. If I could go out there and just throw down on the first full lap, it would probably be much faster but I tend to build up speed. As the tires fall off, my driving improves which maintains a relatively flat pace if that makes sense.
Last edited by fleming23; 07-10-2017 at 08:29 AM.
The following users liked this post:
TCorzett (07-10-2017)