Finally trackng my '15 A8 Z07 without overheating
11-13-2017, 03:33 PM
#1
Racer
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Finally trackng my '15 A8 Z07 without overheating
I have been involved with the overheating problem on the A8 Z06 since the beginning of 2015. There were so many explanations, denials, promises etc. that it took a while to evolve, and finally the aftermarket came out with workable solutions.
I chose LG Motorsports basic super cool kit w/o the LG radiator. There are others out there like G-speed and TIKIT but LG was available in its simplest form late last year and they had good results from what I could tell. I bought it so I could install it and get the car set up over the winter. I liked the looks too, so it was no problem ordering the kit with the bumper already cut out with the grills and facia installed. I stored my original bumper in the box that the new one came in. All I had to do was paint the new one, or you could get creative and do a wrap.
I also finally got all the air out of the SC circuit when the bumper was off. It took the Gspeed SC switch and drybreak fitting and pulling off the reservoir with all the hoses left on and agitating it and also rotating it so the air was moved out of the return line and then released through the beaker on the fill port. ( for this install the HX’s had to be bled numerous times as well.( I hope someone comes up with a reservoir with a bleed valve on top that works)
I also used Mad Dog 24’s (forum name) novel approach to oil cooling and purchased his oil cooler fin kit and installed a cold air duct to blow air on the modified oil cooler. This was a much bigger job than I expected, if you do it, I would suggest you buy a new original oil cooler and have Mad Dogs guys install the fins, then just bolt on the finned cooler. Then you can always go back to original with your original cooler. I wanted to stay away from remote oil coolers at this point, It was a warranty issue for me, which may or may not be a valid concern. I also installed DEI’s Cat shields which I bought when they first came out
I am Not saying all of the above is the answer for everyone, but I am now able to run in temperatures up to 92 degrees ambient, no limp mode, full 20 to 30 min sessions with max ECT’s of 224 and EOT’s of 265. Before this, I could not run in ambient temps above very low 80’s. Constant limp modes made me leave the track early for the last two years. Last year I didn’t even bother with the track until September because our summer was so hot.
I don’t have PDR, or data to show, so this is the best I can do to pass on this information. I can only speak about this set up as it is related to how I drive and the conditions. This could all change at 92+ degrees ambient ( I was not able to test this year above 92 degrees)
I manually shift the A8 between 5500 and 6000 rpm. To give you a rough idea of how I drive the car on track My times at HPR were consistently in the 2:05 to 2:07 at 92 degrees ambient when there was no traffic. A friend of mine in his M7 runs it faster in the 2:01 range, but he has been driving while I was overheating. I believe 1:55 is considered fast 9/10th driving on that track for a C7, so obviously I am putting less stress on the car than faster drivers which has an impact on the heat management issue. However, Limp mode is clear when it happens, and it doesn’t happen anymore under the above circumstances. Had the car performed like this when new, I would never had a problem with the whole issue. All of my mods are listed below which are a starting point working with the concept of HX’s mounted on the chins and no HX in front of condenser and main radiator. That was my main objective.
My total track package is listed below.
LG super Cool kit…… still have stock radiator
Purge air from intercooler circuit so no air showing in intercooler reservoir. Super PITA, but I got it down and the engine does not derate under the above conditions)
MadDog24 (corvette forum name) fin kit for stock oil cooler
3” cold air duct to oil cooler (Mad Dog mod)
Cat wraps from DEI
Removed hood seal at rear. ( I still have to test this with and without the seal)
All normal track prep including 100% water with wetter in both engine and SC coolant
Hope this helps anyone looking to help or solve the A8 problem for track days. The car is fast, fun and now I can actually take it out most days to practice. If you look at the economics, My car is worth tops $60K. My options were to take the hit and buy a new M-7 or even a used M-7. I did a lot of the work myself, so all in it was closer to 6K for me. If LG had better instructions and a video showing a step by step install, I would have done the whole thing myself, it looks daunting but its not especially if you get the bumper cover from them already prepared and a video would be great and necessary. It was a gamble, but it paid off and I can improve heat management if needed as I progress in driving skills and as Ambients increase. Set up with the right tires and track alignment (including .8 positive rear caster) What a blast on the track. Hope this helps anyone wanting to track with the 2015-2017 A8 cars. I also use the car for road trips, with no issues, I just run Conti’s for the street.
I chose LG Motorsports basic super cool kit w/o the LG radiator. There are others out there like G-speed and TIKIT but LG was available in its simplest form late last year and they had good results from what I could tell. I bought it so I could install it and get the car set up over the winter. I liked the looks too, so it was no problem ordering the kit with the bumper already cut out with the grills and facia installed. I stored my original bumper in the box that the new one came in. All I had to do was paint the new one, or you could get creative and do a wrap.
I also finally got all the air out of the SC circuit when the bumper was off. It took the Gspeed SC switch and drybreak fitting and pulling off the reservoir with all the hoses left on and agitating it and also rotating it so the air was moved out of the return line and then released through the beaker on the fill port. ( for this install the HX’s had to be bled numerous times as well.( I hope someone comes up with a reservoir with a bleed valve on top that works)
I also used Mad Dog 24’s (forum name) novel approach to oil cooling and purchased his oil cooler fin kit and installed a cold air duct to blow air on the modified oil cooler. This was a much bigger job than I expected, if you do it, I would suggest you buy a new original oil cooler and have Mad Dogs guys install the fins, then just bolt on the finned cooler. Then you can always go back to original with your original cooler. I wanted to stay away from remote oil coolers at this point, It was a warranty issue for me, which may or may not be a valid concern. I also installed DEI’s Cat shields which I bought when they first came out
I am Not saying all of the above is the answer for everyone, but I am now able to run in temperatures up to 92 degrees ambient, no limp mode, full 20 to 30 min sessions with max ECT’s of 224 and EOT’s of 265. Before this, I could not run in ambient temps above very low 80’s. Constant limp modes made me leave the track early for the last two years. Last year I didn’t even bother with the track until September because our summer was so hot.
I don’t have PDR, or data to show, so this is the best I can do to pass on this information. I can only speak about this set up as it is related to how I drive and the conditions. This could all change at 92+ degrees ambient ( I was not able to test this year above 92 degrees)
I manually shift the A8 between 5500 and 6000 rpm. To give you a rough idea of how I drive the car on track My times at HPR were consistently in the 2:05 to 2:07 at 92 degrees ambient when there was no traffic. A friend of mine in his M7 runs it faster in the 2:01 range, but he has been driving while I was overheating. I believe 1:55 is considered fast 9/10th driving on that track for a C7, so obviously I am putting less stress on the car than faster drivers which has an impact on the heat management issue. However, Limp mode is clear when it happens, and it doesn’t happen anymore under the above circumstances. Had the car performed like this when new, I would never had a problem with the whole issue. All of my mods are listed below which are a starting point working with the concept of HX’s mounted on the chins and no HX in front of condenser and main radiator. That was my main objective.
My total track package is listed below.
LG super Cool kit…… still have stock radiator
Purge air from intercooler circuit so no air showing in intercooler reservoir. Super PITA, but I got it down and the engine does not derate under the above conditions)
MadDog24 (corvette forum name) fin kit for stock oil cooler
3” cold air duct to oil cooler (Mad Dog mod)
Cat wraps from DEI
Removed hood seal at rear. ( I still have to test this with and without the seal)
All normal track prep including 100% water with wetter in both engine and SC coolant
Hope this helps anyone looking to help or solve the A8 problem for track days. The car is fast, fun and now I can actually take it out most days to practice. If you look at the economics, My car is worth tops $60K. My options were to take the hit and buy a new M-7 or even a used M-7. I did a lot of the work myself, so all in it was closer to 6K for me. If LG had better instructions and a video showing a step by step install, I would have done the whole thing myself, it looks daunting but its not especially if you get the bumper cover from them already prepared and a video would be great and necessary. It was a gamble, but it paid off and I can improve heat management if needed as I progress in driving skills and as Ambients increase. Set up with the right tires and track alignment (including .8 positive rear caster) What a blast on the track. Hope this helps anyone wanting to track with the 2015-2017 A8 cars. I also use the car for road trips, with no issues, I just run Conti’s for the street.
The following 10 users liked this post by rsilver:
360Lemans (11-14-2017),
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and 5 others liked this post.
11-13-2017, 08:41 PM
#3
Good stuff.
11-14-2017, 11:29 AM
#7
Drifting
Congratulations Robert - we'll have to go to HPR sometime.
11-14-2017, 01:34 PM
#8
Racer
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Location: central mountians colorado
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[QUOTE=Hotrod-Realtor;1595965256]Excellent info. What kind of dollar amount are we talking about to fix the overheating with your setup?[/QUOTE
Hotrod, the LG basic super cool kit is $3895 . Add $150+- for shipping depending on where you are. Paint for the bumper was $500. I paid $300+- for the fin kit, not sure what Mad Dog is charging now. It a real custom low volume kit. Cat wraps about $50. Ducting with fittings $75. Thats about all the parts for this stage but if your going to bleed the SC system yourself, you probably need the G speed dry brake for fill port and their SC Switch so you don't have to run the car. About 125+-. It saves a LOT of time. I have heard install costs in the $1500-$2000 for the basic install. That would not include the radiator, additional trans cooler, oil cooler etc. I talked to a california shop who had done the full package from LG on a car, and it was about $4K for the install ,but they said it was the first one they did and it took a long time.just the time it took me to get the air out of the SC circuit was excessive until I did it a few times. So about $5K for parts and depending on how much work you do, its your time or paying someone else. $ 5K for parts and $2K for install and your aroung $7K. If you do it yourself or get someone to remove the bumper and mount the HX's and the plumbing, add about $1K for that part and the rest you can do yourself.. So, $5K to 6K depending on how much you do yourself. Its not hard to remove everything and take back to stock when you sell the car. The only problem I could see is repair or replacing the wheel wells if you wanted it totally back to stock.
Hotrod, the LG basic super cool kit is $3895 . Add $150+- for shipping depending on where you are. Paint for the bumper was $500. I paid $300+- for the fin kit, not sure what Mad Dog is charging now. It a real custom low volume kit. Cat wraps about $50. Ducting with fittings $75. Thats about all the parts for this stage but if your going to bleed the SC system yourself, you probably need the G speed dry brake for fill port and their SC Switch so you don't have to run the car. About 125+-. It saves a LOT of time. I have heard install costs in the $1500-$2000 for the basic install. That would not include the radiator, additional trans cooler, oil cooler etc. I talked to a california shop who had done the full package from LG on a car, and it was about $4K for the install ,but they said it was the first one they did and it took a long time.just the time it took me to get the air out of the SC circuit was excessive until I did it a few times. So about $5K for parts and depending on how much work you do, its your time or paying someone else. $ 5K for parts and $2K for install and your aroung $7K. If you do it yourself or get someone to remove the bumper and mount the HX's and the plumbing, add about $1K for that part and the rest you can do yourself.. So, $5K to 6K depending on how much you do yourself. Its not hard to remove everything and take back to stock when you sell the car. The only problem I could see is repair or replacing the wheel wells if you wanted it totally back to stock.
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Hotrod-Realtor (11-14-2017)
11-14-2017, 05:16 PM
#10
Hi Res picture of front of car available?
RSilver,
Great info and the completed car looks good. Would you mind posting or linking a high resolution picture of the installed bumper cover with the extra cutouts for the additional radiators? Would like to see what it looks like, close up.
TIA,
Bill
Great info and the completed car looks good. Would you mind posting or linking a high resolution picture of the installed bumper cover with the extra cutouts for the additional radiators? Would like to see what it looks like, close up.
TIA,
Bill
11-14-2017, 09:13 PM
#11
Racer
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Last edited by rsilver; 11-14-2017 at 09:17 PM.
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Kaged (11-15-2017)