carlrpark

DSC controller($1290) vs GM's MR software upgrade($350)?

Price vs quality?

Can anyone say it's like apples and oranges for ride characteristics and getting what you pay for?

I want to bite but need to know if it's really worth the extra $940 having versatility and control of the DSC? The DSC has been out for a while now and everyone says you have to get it? Is the DSC better to have if you track it all of the time? You would think you would set it up once and then forget for city drivers only(GM) but with different tracks different setups(DSC)?

irun4cops

i hope dsc answers as they are smarter than i on the topic.

In the meantime, what they told me over the phone was that the way GM sets up the stiffness is very crude in comparison to the way they adjust the stiffness in their programming.

0-100, 100 being the stiffest... they said that with GM, touring is like 40-60, and sport is like 50-80 and track is like 70-90.

They said the way they do it is a different approach, where in any given mode, they still use the full range of 0-100, but its just "WHEN" or "how often" does the magnetic shock enduce each of those values of stiffness per say, moment to moment.

So, their controller still has you up in the 70-100 range most often while you are in track mode, but there are also still potentially "moments" that the calculations might cause a single or several magnetic shocks to go into the mush lower softer values of 50 or 30.

Same principle in touring, except the inverse would apply. And they said the way GM programs theirs is inferior. Keep in mind, GM is programmed to the stock alignment, not the DSC alignment. The doc alignment alone is apparently much improved over gm's. So to go with gm's tune, and then get DSC alignment, you are going backwards probably.

The nice thing with the DSC is they told me that they have a couple different "tunes" available for it, there is a plush tune, that makes the car ride soft, and a regular tune, that has the car a bit more aggressive than GM at all times.

The other thing is, these tunes, are free. And you can update your controller at anytime.

So i would imagine that IF gm had some huge breakthrough in how to tune the suspension, then they could easily copy that and give it to you. But from the sounds of it... GM is copying DSC, and still behind in doing so, even with this new release, as I asked about it specifically a month ago when i spoke to DSC.

Last bit ill throw is my own observation, that IF gm ever figures out the proper alignment, and then comes out with ANOTHER tune... you will be paying for that when the time comes as well. So in the long haul, you might not be paying that much more for the DSC, and in the meantime, your increasing your cars performance a lot.

Jim Barker

When it is so harsh that it cracks wheels there needs to be a softer program and under warrantee!!!!!!

irun4cops

did that occur to your car with the dsc or gm programming?

If dsc, then that is why they have the plush tune out recently I'm sure.

Cubicinches

Two questions. First, what's the verdict from people who had the GM update performed? I think I've only seen one person comment on it. If it noticeably improves Touring and Sport ride quality, then I'll get it. But I worry that people end up THINKING they notice an improvement simply because they expect it (i.e. placebo effect).

Second, can anyone explain what the following note from the original post means?

"2016 Z06 with Z07 Customer to specify if they wish to include Track Mode Change or No Track Mode Change with new Calibration for this Trim FE7 NOW."

Why wouldn't a customer want the Track Mode Change if it's free? The only reason I can think is that some GM may realize some customer want to keep the original set up from track use.

irun4cops

i think you've got it. its a liability issue, GM probably does not want a person to say they got the upgrade to deal with speed bumps, and then all the sudden that person's family is suing GM because it changed his track settings and he didnt want those changed he said, and he ran into a wall during a track day and had a heart attack...

that sort of thing probably.

irun4cops

i don't think you have to worry about that... what I'm saying is...

the thing updates an absurd amount of times per second....

And GM's programming doesnt let the fluid flow through the shock as quickly as dsc's does at any given moment, and again, visa versa.

Realistically speaking, the DSC makes your car ride more firm overall, unless you get the plush setting.... but even in plush tune, they said their sport and track modes are still firmer than GM's they just switched the eco and touring modes because people were complaining it was TOO stiff.

They told me that in track mode, GM left the final 10% of stiffness off limits. DSC is utilizing this final 10% in both of their tunes.

Jim Barker

GM warranted the Concours Cadillac in '94 to anyone that complained of the harsh ride Group Ref #433001A New shocks/struts and recalibrate RSS module Aug 1994

Jim Barker

On the forum there are several members reporting they are having trouble getting there cracked wheels warranted after finding Flats without punctures

irun4cops

yeah, ever since the aftermarket warranty companies started selling 3rd party protection for wheel and tires, it seems to have given the manufacturers an "out" from having to cover them under warranty.

Always buy that protection on a vette. God knows I've put my policy to work on my most recent one.

irun4cops

i want to say it was 900 bucks, and its saved me over 4000 already... in 5500 miles

Im 3000 bucks ahead

there was a railroad rail in the middle of the highway one night. And i don't drive slow. That was fun.

carlrpark

Ouch!! Lucky it didn't tear up more of your car

irun4cops

it was 2 or 3 ft long... I could have straddled it hindsight. That was my plan at first. I thought it was tire rubber at first, laying flat.

as I got up closer I realized I had no clue what it was and I took a hard right at around 100pmh, and I barely... barely... caught the end of it. It cracked outer lip on both z06 wheels and indented both tires pss2. 2 more inches to the right and id have missed it.

tones_Z

Do you notice a big difference in the drive modes?
Good thing you had documentation. Dealerships would bend you over the barrel.

NicD

I've driven two customer cars now with the latest DSC updates on their boxes and it compares nicely to the latest GM update. If you are a serious track rat who really thinks they have what it takes to make adjustments that will give them a positive result then get the DSC. Keep in mind you really need to understand what you are doing there or you can just make it worse and without having full instrumentation and a full understanding of what does what then good luck to you. IMO the GM update is well worth it for the LARGE majority of the people looking at suspension upgrades because it does make a hell of a difference in both performance and comfort. I love to play and adjust things WAY more than the average person but I did the GM update and don't feel like I'm missing out on anything by not having the DSC box. Honestly the latest GM Z06 update reminds me of how the 17+ ZL1 feels and it seems like a direct result of just better testing, tuning, etc that GM has had available over the years for this system.

franknbeans

What sheet is every one talking about? I can print out the beginning of this thread but not sure how far that would go. Is there a direct link?

rikhek

Apples and oranges comparison. The GM update just recalibrates the limited input GM tables of their system. The DSC controller transforms the mag ride into an "active" system constantly adjusting the shocks based upon a multitude of operational, real time parameters.

The adjustability of the DSC is nice for those who want to try different settings/parameters. I'm not good enough to better what is provided by the professionals at DSC who have invested countless hours tweaking their system to gain the most from the chassis.

I've never adjusted the out of the box settings and have no plans to do so.

Thomasmoto

I think I'll give the new GM version a try and will post back with my results.

stoessjc

Anyone know the chances of buying this at one dealership and getting it installed at a different one? Reason I ask is I got a 50% off coupon from Costco when I bought my 2017 from Criswell. Since I live in SoCal, I will not be taking car to Maryland for service. Probably not likely I can do this, but thought I would ask the forum. I also have a 15% off Costco coupon that I can use locally.

rikhek

DSC posted the following in a different thread answering this question:

The GM algorithm seems to revolve around the theoretical shock temp its critical as the fluid viscosity is the constant. The model seems to be based on frequency of the tire based in ground hook. Calculating shock temp is critical. there is no closed loop control its all based on theory. In the street and track environment its near impossible to predict temp as conditions change not ambient temp but conditions heat from the road brake temps ect... DSC controls current based on shock response this means we are not locked into temp calculation so we can control the damper the same in all the heat ranges. Plus DSC is not locked into ground hook but combines ground hook and sky hook. DSC is fully active and allows the end used to have complete control for the ultimate in touring and track.
This total programmability also means the end user can select other shocks as well such as the Tractive that offer a traditional shim stack for the ultimate yet in touring and race conditions.
There are many other features available to DSC as well such as full Velocity, G Force, Accel, Brake, Shock calibration, speed and PTM maps as well as a Launch mode for Drag Racers. You can select the launch setting and calibrate the 60 foot the dampers then blend into the other tables all of this is completely tunable or download maps or use the base tables that come in the DSCsport controller. Lots of power imagination is the only real limit