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Stage 5 engine package:
-Katech K Force 1 camshaft package
-Katech CNC ported heads
-Halltech air intake system (this car features the carbon fiber version
-Magnuson Heartbeat 2.3L supercharger
-Katech billet supercharger snout for 103mm throttle body on Magnuson 2.3L
-Katech billet water adapters for TIKT cooling system
-Katech 103mm throttle body
-Katech Xtreme-DI fuel system
-Katech surge tank low side fuel system with Flex-Fuel
-Katech LT4 +30% injectors
Exhaust:
-American Racing 2" headers
-Corsa Sport mufflers
Cooling:
-TIKT Kuhlsystem dual heat exchanger system
-Dewitts radiator
-Katech carbon fiber radiator exit duct
-Katech custom dual trans coolers behind TIKT heat exchangers
-TIKT oil-to-air cooler (part of Kuhlsystem/splitter package)
-Katech oil-to-water cooler
-Katech billet A8 transmission pan with cooling fins
Body/Aero:
-TIKT carbon fiber splitter with race undertray and integrated oil cooler
-Katech carbon fiber Stage 3 splitter end plates
-Katech carbon fiber splitter wickers
-Katech carbon fiber side skirts
-Katech carbon fiber spoiler
-TIKT carbon fiber wing
-Katech carbon fiber diffuser with strakes
-Finishing Touch Auto Spa platinum ceramic coating package
-Finishing Touch Auto Spa clear film on lower fenders, rockers, side skirts, rear quarters, and rear fascia behind wheels
-ZL1 Add-Ons front tow hook, powdercoated yellow
-Custom painted fender and fascia emblems
Interior:
-TIKT harness bar
-Schroth 6pt cam lock harnesses
-Fire suppression system
-Custom mounting tabs to secure roof in trunk (with TIKT harness bar)
Suspension/Wheels/Tires:
-DSC Sport suspension control module
-DSC Sport RT shocks
-ARP wheel studs
-Katech KT1 wheels by Forgeline 19x10 & 20x12
-OEM MPSC2 285/30R19 & 335/25R20
Will your A8 cooling upgrades keep it cool for a 30 min track session (stock or modified engine)?
Have you had any experience with the A8 in the ZR1? If so, any changes in the delay between
the paddle pull and the actual shift?
Thank you
Will your A8 cooling upgrades keep it cool for a 30 min track session (stock or modified engine)?
Have you had any experience with the A8 in the ZR1? If so, any changes in the delay between
the paddle pull and the actual shift?
Thank you
This car has yet to go on track, but with the amount of heat exchangers we added to it I have no doubt it will stay cool for the duration of the fuel tank.
I watched your videos about the new HP secondary fuel pump ran from the serpentine belt. Great idea.
I have 2 initial questions concerns however... first is the amount the DI injectors can actually flow. Second is the in tank pump.
I believe the in tank pump being replaced with a larger pump, will take these cars pretty high up in fueling ability. For instance, crawford racing, using the stock in tank pump, is able to get pretty high numbers. As most of us are aware by now, the 2019 z06 and zr1 have a larger in tank pump, that flows over 20% more fuel.
I feel with your secondary HP pump, you are still going to encounter these other 2 bottlenecks that need to be addressed... the in tank pump... and the injectors.
That being said, if a person swaps out the in tank pump and the injectors for the ones that flow more, I believe they are going to be able to get to the number you are at on the dyno sheet you have displayed, and that will be without having to purchase a second HP pump.
I do believe there will be a place for the 2nd HP pump, and I realize you have to start somewhere and test at lower numbers first, but i believe this 2nd HP pump will be better highlighted once you get to power above 1100HP.
The higher volume DI injectors, able to flow 2000HP worth of fuel, is what I am interested in learning more about, because without those, it does not matter how many pumps one attaches to the system.
The negative tradeoff, is that when the car is idling or cruising at 40mph down the road, not struggling, a set of 8 DI injector capable of flowing 2000hp worth of fuel, will most likely not behave as DI injectors at low power levels.
What I'm saying is, there has to be enough fuel pressure behind the holes in the injector, to cause the fuel to vaporize properly as it passes through the holes. To have a higher flow injector, you are either going to need larger holes (wont vaporize as well or at all anymore) or you are going to need larger quantity of holes in the tip of the injector. Even with larger quantity of holes, there will be more ability for fuel to flow through the injector, and each hole will experience less flow and less pressure than it was when it was in the stock format with less holes, and thus, vaporization still wont occur properly.
The point to all of this is... one either loses DI injection down low, or they lose it up top. And when I say they lose it up top, I am saying, they will still have DI injectors properly sized for down low power (stock injectors) and they will then simply run port injection through non-di regular fuel injectors at each port. (current port injection setups)
One spot or another, high or low, a person loses DI... and it behaves as a regular injector.
All of that being said, again, $4000+ is a lot to fork out for a pump, when the low side in tank pump is already known to be the first weak link in our current fuel systems, as the stock HP z06 high side pump, can starve the stock in tank pumps on the 15-18's, and the stock injectors, are still the 2nd bottle neck of the system.
Putting DI injectors at every port, for a total of 16 DI injectors, and having the second pumps flow only occur at X amount of boost, would be the only way to really have DI from top to bottom in all power levels.
I watched your videos about the new HP secondary fuel pump ran from the serpentine belt. Great idea.
I have 2 initial questions concerns however... first is the amount the DI injectors can actually flow. Second is the in tank pump.
I believe the in tank pump being replaced with a larger pump, will take these cars pretty high up in fueling ability. For instance, crawford racing, using the stock in tank pump, is able to get pretty high numbers. As most of us are aware by now, the 2019 z06 and zr1 have a larger in tank pump, that flows over 20% more fuel.
I feel with your secondary HP pump, you are still going to encounter these other 2 bottlenecks that need to be addressed... the in tank pump... and the injectors.
Correct. A low side fuel system that can supply the DI pump is necessary as well as our +30% LT4 injectors.
Originally Posted by Mikec7z
That being said, if a person swaps out the in tank pump and the injectors for the ones that flow more, I believe they are going to be able to get to the number you are at on the dyno sheet you have displayed, and that will be without having to purchase a second HP pump.
I do believe there will be a place for the 2nd HP pump, and I realize you have to start somewhere and test at lower numbers first, but i believe this 2nd HP pump will be better highlighted once you get to power above 1100HP.
Incorrect. On E85 you will hit the limit of the DI pump before that.
Originally Posted by Mikec7z
The higher volume DI injectors, able to flow 2000HP worth of fuel, is what I am interested in learning more about, because without those, it does not matter how many pumps one attaches to the system.
The negative tradeoff, is that when the car is idling or cruising at 40mph down the road, not struggling, a set of 8 DI injector capable of flowing 2000hp worth of fuel, will most likely not behave as DI injectors at low power levels.
What I'm saying is, there has to be enough fuel pressure behind the holes in the injector, to cause the fuel to vaporize properly as it passes through the holes. To have a higher flow injector, you are either going to need larger holes (wont vaporize as well or at all anymore) or you are going to need larger quantity of holes in the tip of the injector. Even with larger quantity of holes, there will be more ability for fuel to flow through the injector, and each hole will experience less flow and less pressure than it was when it was in the stock format with less holes, and thus, vaporization still wont occur properly.
Pressure drop would occur if you have a DI pump that can't keep up with the flow demand of the injector. Our DI pump has enough flow to support 2000hp and operates up to 3600psi.
Originally Posted by Mikec7z
The point to all of this is... one either loses DI injection down low, or they lose it up top. And when I say they lose it up top, I am saying, they will still have DI injectors properly sized for down low power (stock injectors) and they will then simply run port injection through non-di regular fuel injectors at each port. (current port injection setups)
One spot or another, high or low, a person loses DI... and it behaves as a regular injector.
This is simply incorrect.
Originally Posted by Mikec7z
All of that being said, again, $4000+ is a lot to fork out for a pump, when the low side in tank pump is already known to be the first weak link in our current fuel systems, as the stock HP z06 high side pump, can starve the stock in tank pumps on the 15-18's, and the stock injectors, are still the 2nd bottle neck of the system.
Putting DI injectors at every port, for a total of 16 DI injectors, and having the second pumps flow only occur at X amount of boost, would be the only way to really have DI from top to bottom in all power levels.
Incorrect. On E85 you will hit the limit of the DI pump before that.
Here i was speaking about the realization that crawford racing had that if you fork the low pressure line, and feed port injection injectors off the stock in tank fuel pumps feed pressure alone, they have gotten to numbers close to the ones on your dyno already, using the 18-15 years stock in tank pump. With the 19+ years in tank pump, there is more to be had as it flows over 20% more. So i dont think I am incorrect. I think you need to do your homework on what others have achieved when they avoided the bottleneck of the DI injectors.
As far as the rest of the point, i guess we agree to disagree. Yes, your pumps can flow the flow, correct, but what i was getting at is, you will be putting too much fuel into the chamber if you still vaporize the fuel... and to get to the point where you arent putting too much fuel in, will reduce the flow and thus pressure, to where the vaporization wont occur, since the openings in the DI injectors are static in size.... made to flow a lot instead of vaporize as they flow a little (stock configuration)
Overall, you are a great vendor and have done a ton for the community, and this is a great product.
As i originally stated, once you get up above 1100 and 1400 hp, your pumps purpose is going to shine. I look forward to seeing your higher flow DI injectors soon. Good work as usual.
Here i was speaking about the realization that crawford racing had that if you fork the low pressure line, and feed port injection injectors off the stock in tank fuel pumps feed pressure alone, they have gotten to numbers close to the ones on your dyno already, using the 18-15 years stock in tank pump. With the 19+ years in tank pump, there is more to be had as it flows over 20% more. So i dont think I am incorrect. I think you need to do your homework on what others have achieved when they avoided the bottleneck of the DI injectors.
I wasn't talking about port injection at all. I was correcting your statement that the stock DI pump can support the 965hp on E85 we achieved.
I wasn't talking about port injection at all. I was correcting your statement that the stock DI pump can support the 965hp on E85 we achieved.
Agreed, i wasn't saying one had to do port injection, instead, what i am doing is taking a logical stab at the idea that... once one puts on less restrictive injectors they would be able to get to 800 wheel with ease... the DI injectors are the current known bottleneck, even the ones that flow "30% more". To get to 2000HP as your thread claims, the proposed injector is going to have to flow over 150% more than stock, a very large leap. Thus my interest in those injectors, and saying if one pairs these proposed injectors to the stock fuel pumps in our cars, the low side fuel pump has already been proven it can flow over 800hp to the wheels without the DI injector restriction, which is what the port injection has already proven (crawford racing). I then pointed out that the high side stock DI pump can outflow that low side pump. This is all while the real limit to the stock DI pump is not yet known as the stock DI injecotrs are the bottleneck,
if i was a betting man, i would say that an injector capable of flowing anywhere close to 2000HP worth of fuel, let alone 1500, will allow the stock fuel system to reach 800 wheel HP with ease.
Time will tell if i am right or not. I look forward to these injectors
Agreed, i wasn't saying one had to do port injection, instead, what i am doing is taking a logical stab at the idea that... once one puts on less restrictive injectors they would be able to get to 800 wheel with ease... the DI injectors are the current known bottleneck, even the ones that flow "30% more". To get to 2000HP as your thread claims, the proposed injector is going to have to flow about 150% more than stock, a very large leap. Thus my interest in those injectors, and saying if one pairs those injectors to the stock fuel pumps in our cars, the low side fuel pump has already been proven it can flow over 800hp to the wheels without the DI injector restriction, which is what the port injection proved. While the real limit to the stock DI pump is not yet known as the stock DI injecotrs are the bottleneck,
if i was a betting man, i would say that an injector capable of flowing anywhere close to 2000HP worth of fuel, let alone 1500, will allow the stock fuel system to reach 800 wheel HP with ease.
Time will tell if i am right or not. I look forward to these injectors
We do know the limit of the stock DI pump. My car is starting to see some pressure drop at 760rwhp on E85 with a stock LT4 pump and 38% fuel lobe. It has +30% injectors.
Here is my logic. We know the low side can supply over 800 rear wheel hp via port injection.
We know the high side can starve the low side.
The puzzle you may not be fully addressing is "why can the low side supply 800 wheel without the high side pump, and why does your car run out of fuel at 760 with the high side pump part of the equation?"
The answer is, the injectors. While the injectors flow 30% more, they are still very restrictive in comparison to an injector that flows 150% more. There is an inherit back pressure that the pump encounters, that each stroke of the pump, when it is pumping at full capacity, it still has to deal with via stock opening di Injectors.
When I say that the injectors that will flow 2000HP worth of fuel will have less than half the restriction, it is simple math and logic.
Thus, again... if i was a betting man.. once those 150% more flow injectors are fitted to the stock fuel system, you will see an increase in fuel entering the chamber as it takes less work for the stock pump to pump the fuel through the orifices. Simple math. And if you disagree, lets pick a dollar amount 820 is only 60 more hp than 760, where you say you are currently running out, and thus, I will be happy to take that bet
06-27-2018, 02:39 PM
Katech Stage 5/E85 package on a 2016 C7.R edition
