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Stock cats

 
Old 11-11-2018, 10:42 AM
  #61  
solotronics
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Originally Posted by Pacembellum View Post
Havenít had a chance to get it to a dealer I trust for inspection but I suspect it may be from Boostane doing something. I run a little bit each tank only 10oz per 18 gallons to get 93 octane from my 91 pump gas. I also run the Borla X Pipe and wrapped it with the DEI titanium wrap, it really cut down on console and transmission tunnel temps.

edit I have stock cats on my z06
there are plenty of posts on the forum showing boostane and other similar octane adders leaving lots of deposits in the exhaust, I bet if you pull one of your post cat O2 sensors you would see an orange film left on it
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Old 11-11-2018, 11:57 AM
  #62  
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Originally Posted by RoxyCarter
good question. Hess and I are still trying to figure it out ourselves.

There is more to him than meets the eye. The best way to put it, he plays possum.

and then once you are convinced he is normal and lame... he does something you can't even tell your friends about because they will think you are lying.
Are you talking about Mikec7z?
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Old 11-11-2018, 12:34 PM
  #63  
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Originally Posted by 3 Z06ZR1 View Post
Be even more careful of other members touting Cat delete pipes as good as headers. When anyone who has added and run headers many times knows. Then it makes no sense that headers with cats only do a few hp less than catless headers. So how could a cat delete pipe add much? Then no dyno results?
There are dyno results. What power increase did you get from headers alone, no tune, nothing else?

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Old 11-11-2018, 12:44 PM
  #64  
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Originally Posted by Poor-sha View Post
Who's Mike?

Pretty sure "Mike" is irun4cops. The restaurant they are at is on Palm Beach Island.
The video 'irun4cops' posted a while back going heavy triple digit speeds was on I-95 in the Palm Beach area.
http://vid277.photobucket.com/albums...psruhbjj1f.mp4
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Old 11-11-2018, 01:32 PM
  #65  
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Originally Posted by fatsport View Post
Pretty sure "Mike" is irun4cops. The restaurant they are at is on Palm Beach Island.
The video 'irun4cops' posted a while back going heavy triple digit speeds was on I-95 in the Palm Beach area.
http://vid277.photobucket.com/albums...psruhbjj1f.mp4
LOL, I don't think I'd do that. All it takes is one of those slower cars switching into your lane for one reason or another, and you're done,
Most drivers in the US have zero skill or experience at anticipating cars coming up from behind at 150 plus mph. Regular Autbahn users are much better at that.
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Old 11-11-2018, 02:35 PM
  #66  
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well this has been a very interesting thread, ANYONE saying one or the other is best without pro's and cons of both systems. plus proper realistic dyno pulls is just being ignorant! how about what might be best for each situation? 1/4 runs with a dedicated big drag tire, how about a track car like poorsha? seems like a street/track car to me. I don't know him or his car{bad *** car} always 2 sides of a story lol. any reputable tuners that is or has replied on this should have FACTS to back up there statements and not leave out advantages of both. and someone here already mentioned headers work a lot better on a normally aspirated engine vs a forced induction engine {especially a positive displacement blower. and lets face it no header that is made to fit inside oem cars with twists/turns, unequal length tubes and collector designs that leave a lot to be desired!
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Old 11-11-2018, 02:36 PM
  #67  
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This hogwash about the stock manifold vs a coated header being said by some who clearly have no idea and are just blowing hot air around it is ridiculous!
They are being ignorant to the facts there is no advantage to the stock manifold. ACTAULLY is no good for the engine if you stick a large blower on it will NOT tune or have the output that the header combo will!

First off this cast iron manifold absorbs more heat and radiates more heat far more than the Coated header. Also doesn't flow near the volume of air out of the engine near what the header primary will do! You uncork that header like I used to on my 1968 Chevelle 396 and Also My cam and header 383 Roadrunner and that is when they really show the flow.
Far more restriction on the stock set up which must flow air past the tight factory bend to the cat pipe. The header will add Horse power everytime you put in on and take off the stock piece shown. Ben owner of Weapon X posted this already he installs headers, dyno's and tunes them daily everyday at their shops.
I think Ben is one of the top Guys on this forum for knowledge about the how it all works. To say other wise is simply making up garbage to try to sell us for the reason you do not want to spent the money or do the install so they say OH it is just as good for making HP! Well no it is not.
All from guys with stock exhaust and with O experience wrenching on a Z06.




Last edited by 3 Z06ZR1; 11-11-2018 at 03:02 PM.
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Old 11-11-2018, 03:09 PM
  #68  
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making comparisons from 50 year old bbc stock manifolds vs tube headers is just ridiculous!!!!!! so is your heat statement. take a good look at your header collector inside and out, shape and length. then do a little research on it. I know header builders are constrained to a lot when building headers to money/time building and fit. but even they know where they are lacking.
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Old 11-11-2018, 03:20 PM
  #69  
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Originally Posted by charlierogers View Post
making comparisons from 50 year old bbc stock manifolds vs tube headers is just ridiculous!!!!!! so is your heat statement. take a good look at your header collector inside and out, shape and length. then do a little research on it. I know header builders are constrained to a lot when building headers to money/time building and fit. but even they know where they are lacking.
Sorry Charlie you have no idea the modern ARH header is way better than the ones I put on 40 years ago. The stock ARH 2 inch will is the best base for 1000 hp plus the stock manifold will never ever come close
to doing that. My heat statement is 1000 percent accurate too! The coated header KEEPS THE HEAT IN THE PIPE hot gases flow a lot better than cold!

The old Steam heaters were made from cast iron BECAUSE made from cast iron they radiate heat! SAME which a cast iron skillet stays hot a long time too! The coated header passes the heat out! GM uses cast because it is cheap to make them
Real sorry you don't get it!

Last edited by 3 Z06ZR1; 11-11-2018 at 03:21 PM.
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Old 11-11-2018, 03:43 PM
  #70  
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Originally Posted by 3 Z06ZR1 View Post
Sorry Charlie you have no idea the modern ARH header is way better than the ones I put on 40 years ago. The stock ARH 2 inch will is the best base for 1000 hp plus the stock manifold will never ever come close
to doing that. My heat statement is 1000 percent accurate too! The coated header KEEPS THE HEAT IN THE PIPE hot gases flow a lot better than cold!

The old Steam heaters were made from cast iron BECAUSE made from cast iron they radiate heat! SAME which a cast iron skillet stays hot a long time too! The coated header passes the heat out! GM uses cast because it is cheap to make them
Real sorry you don't get it!
LOL, it's pretty obvious that 3Z06Z1R was never a thermodynamics engineer.
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Old 11-11-2018, 03:44 PM
  #71  
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An idea was brought up that I had never thought about. The cats really quiet down the car, without them it may be hard to stay under sound check at many tracks. doing a borla X makes it louder and doing the Norcal SS pipes will make it way louder. The stock mufflers are basically straight pipes under full throttle.

what about running the Norcal pipes with the stock X pipe in place?? Wrap the stock X pipe post cats so you get some benefit from the wrap to keep the chassis cooler.

norcalss have you tested running the car deletes on a stock x pipe car??
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Old 11-11-2018, 03:50 PM
  #72  
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what I do get is everything I have heard about you now. first off, no one here is talking about 1000hp, if they were I bet most if not all would agree headers is the route to go, including me. we were talking about a near stock {bolt ons} track car. just because I have built a few perf engines over the years and bolted on more headers on different cars than I care to even think about does not make me a expert in either! but what I can talk about intelligently IS thermodynamics and fluid dynamics. heat absorption/extraction and radiant heat. any builder/tuner here will tell you that your header WILL radiate more heat to the engine compartment!! btw the old steam heaters you mention were made of cast iron because it was cheaper to make not because they radiate heat better than other metals {copper} copper is what has been used since the 70's because of its efficiency to dissipate. in the future you should think before you type things like 1000% percent accurate because it makes you look like a fool. I would not make silly statements like that and I have been in the business of heat retention/extraction for 29 years now.
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Old 11-11-2018, 04:28 PM
  #73  
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Originally Posted by charlierogers View Post
what I do get is everything I have heard about you now. first off, no one here is talking about 1000hp, if they were I bet most if not all would agree headers is the route to go, including me. we were talking about a near stock {bolt ons} track car. just because I have built a few perf engines over the years and bolted on more headers on different cars than I care to even think about does not make me a expert in either! but what I can talk about intelligently IS thermodynamics and fluid dynamics. heat absorption/extraction and radiant heat. any builder/tuner here will tell you that your header WILL radiate more heat to the engine compartment!! btw the old steam heaters you mention were made of cast iron because it was cheaper to make not because they radiate heat better than other metals {copper} copper is what has been used since the 70's because of its efficiency to dissipate. in the future you should think before you type things like 1000% percent accurate because it makes you look like a fool. I would not make silly statements like that and I have been in the business of heat retention/extraction for 29 years now.
Don't listen to me, Listen to Ben who has far more knowledge than you or I. YOU didn't read his post? Just like them all when when they can't win the debate with any fact they turn to BS and they go low to condescending comments. Run what you WANT please you can bring the horse to water but you can't make him drink! The coated header is cooler keeps the heat in also adds to a cooler engine compartment because the cast manifold puts off more heat and so does the huge cat attached. You still don't get it ! Sorry
A few bolt on's will also produce much better with the headers well The dam header adds 40 rwhp attached to the x-pipe with still having the cats.
Educate yourself man!
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Old 11-11-2018, 04:56 PM
  #74  
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Originally Posted by 3 Z06ZR1 View Post
The coated header is cooler keeps the heat in also adds to a cooler engine compartment because the cast manifold puts off more heat ...
Educate yourself man!
No it doesn't. Educate yourself, man.

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Old 11-11-2018, 04:58 PM
  #75  
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I don't know ben, but did read his post and have heard he is a smart man and has great shop! with that said maybe we can all learn a little something today! how about we all go pop the hoods on are zo6 and start the engines for 2 minutes then shut them down and grab ahold of the exhaust manifolds or headers????? bet I can tell you who has a header and who has a stock manifold by pictures of hands lol. no degree needed for this,, just a little common sense? yes a coated header will have less heat loss {be cooler} compared to a un coated header but the coated header will be much,much hotter than a stock manifold! a tube header is probably 18 gauge plus maybe 2mm of coating. not much material to capture and hold heat compared to what 1/2 cast iron.i re read the start of this thread and he is looking to get 650-700 rwhp with a 2300 and no headers. simple answer is yes, my build clearly made this {I have a build post with dyno vids}. I personally could care less about the highest numbers but look for the baseline and final rwhp what I care about is the delta!! I believe are builds and cars are very similar though you have headers and I have cat delete. maybe we should post are graphs so people can actually see the delta difference????????? that should help answer the question.
Charlie,,,
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Old 11-11-2018, 05:10 PM
  #76  
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Originally Posted by charlierogers View Post
I don't know ben, but did read his post and have heard he is a smart man and has great shop! with that said maybe we can all learn a little something today! how about we all go pop the hoods on are zo6 and start the engines for 2 minutes then shut them down and grab ahold of the exhaust manifolds or headers????? bet I can tell you who has a header and who has a stock manifold by pictures of hands lol. no degree needed for this,, just a little common sense? yes a coated header will have less heat loss {be cooler} compared to a un coated header but the coated header will be much,much hotter than a stock manifold! a tube header is probably 18 gauge.
Charlie,,,
Dude keep digging and reaching like this totally senseless talk??? Then mention "common sense" you made me spit up from the laugh! You have "0" idea what you talking about I'm out here!


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Old 11-11-2018, 05:11 PM
  #77  
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everyone keeps saying that if something cools off fastest, it means it is always cooler, this is not the case whatsoever.

Just because something cools down quickly, does not mean it does not radiate more heat away and at a faster pace.

In fact, if you think about it, this is exactly what happens in most cases.

If the INSIDE of the header were coated well, and that coating remained in tact well, THEN the metal of the header would be more insulated from heat.

Again, surface area here, is the main factor in heat radiation.... not so much the material, or how fast that material goes from blistering hot to cool.

Just because something is cool 5 min later, does not mean that it did not radiate huge heat during the moments it was hot.

I hope this makes sense, we have already mentioned it once, and no one seems to be absorbing so far.
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Old 11-11-2018, 05:13 PM
  #78  
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Originally Posted by Warp Factor View Post
No it doesn't. Educate yourself, man.
I've noticed here just how fast now days the clueless quickly attract even more clueless!
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Old 11-11-2018, 05:23 PM
  #79  
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Originally Posted by Pacembellum View Post
An idea was brought up that I had never thought about. The cats really quiet down the car, without them it may be hard to stay under sound check at many tracks. doing a borla X makes it louder and doing the Norcal SS pipes will make it way louder. The stock mufflers are basically straight pipes under full throttle.

what about running the Norcal pipes with the stock X pipe in place?? Wrap the stock X pipe post cats so you get some benefit from the wrap to keep the chassis cooler.

norcalss have you tested running the car deletes on a stock x pipe car??
exactly, this is what Mike recommends, otherwise it is very loud.
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Old 11-11-2018, 05:39 PM
  #80  
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Originally Posted by 3 Z06ZR1 View Post
I've noticed here just how fast now days the clueless quickly attract even more clueless!
Wow, that's quite a compelling case you've made!
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