Dubai International Auto Show ZR1 Reveal
#242
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LT1 Z51, I respectfully disagree with many of your ME supposed facts and suppositions. You acknowledge that information is hard to obtain, yet proceed to inform others that they are incorrect — not even knowing who/what their sources are. And yes, some of the very folks who you have disagreed with, have multiple and direct GM connections. Additionally, you are disputing factual information provided by some members who have a strong record of being accurate about Corvette information.
Moving back to this thread’s focus, the only additional information I am wanting is, 1) is there going to be a live reveal from Dubai, and 2) if so, where do I and others find that link.
Moving back to this thread’s focus, the only additional information I am wanting is, 1) is there going to be a live reveal from Dubai, and 2) if so, where do I and others find that link.
Know one thing, I don't BS, so if I say something is true then its true. The stipulation I can say is that its with the information I have available at the time.
Take a look at posts from me from 2012 and 2013, oh wait, you can't find any? There is a reason they all got deleted. I'll just leave it at that.
Last edited by Steve Garrett; 11-11-2017 at 12:24 PM. Reason: Merged Posts-please use the Multi-Quote button (the middle icon) in the lower right hand corner of each post to make your reply look like this!
#244
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#245
Race Director
I would be surprised if the ME car offers a manual for one simple reason....Corvette buyers are buying automatics at an 80% rate. I have no "insider" info, but common sense tells you that if 4 out of 5 customers choose automatics, why go through the cost and time to engineer a manual when not many want it. Ferrari made the same decision years ago....90% of their customers were buying F1 transmissions, the market spoke and they reacted. Of course, that didn't stop keyboard warriors from damning Ferrari for selling out, etc.
#246
Losing 20% of your base is nothing to sneeze at. No manual would mean no future Corvette for me. I am brand agnostic, but I am also very hard core on the manual transmission. I purchased and tried to love both DCTs and the modern paddle-shift autos. I can't love them even though they perform extremely well in other cars, not the A8. I find them boring, which is what brought me back to the C7.
I'll simply purchase the best performing manual, convertible on the market when I'm ready for another sports car after the C7.
I'll simply purchase the best performing manual, convertible on the market when I'm ready for another sports car after the C7.
Last edited by Foosh; 11-11-2017 at 03:16 PM.
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#247
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C7 & C8 Events Correspondent
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For 2017, 7% of Stingrays, 6% of Grand Sports, and 3% of Z06s were verts. If those percentages don't bring about the end of Corvette verts, I doubt 20% transmission numbers will bring about the end of the manual transmission.
#248
Thanks Jeremy, and yes that's the other thing. No convertible means no interest in another Corvette for me either.
Last edited by Foosh; 11-11-2017 at 04:07 PM.
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E.T.D. Corvettes (11-11-2017)
#249
Safety Car
When the C7 was introduced, Tadge said in 2013 that while other brands are moving away from manuals, we are embracing them.
And Porsche is recently bringing back manuals to some of their models.
And Porsche is recently bringing back manuals to some of their models.
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E.T.D. Corvettes (11-11-2017)
#250
Given that Corvette targets sales of 35-40K units a year, 20% (the actual number is closer to 27%) means more manual Corvettes are sold annually in the US than total Ferrari and Porsche car sales combined.
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#251
And it shouldn't.
Manuals don't belong in Cadillacs...they belong in GM's Chevrolet brand, if anywhere (IMO).
There are lies, damn lies, and statistics.
I suggest you re-read what you wrote...
Manuals don't belong in Cadillacs...they belong in GM's Chevrolet brand, if anywhere (IMO).
I suggest you re-read what you wrote...
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E.T.D. Corvettes (11-11-2017)
#252
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Originally Posted by Foosh
Losing 20% of your base is nothing to sneeze at. No manual would mean no future Corvette for me. I am brand agnostic, but I am also very hard core on the manual transmission. I purchased and tried to love both DCTs and the modern paddle-shift autos. I can't love them even though they perform extremely well in other cars, not the A8. I find them boring, which is what brought me back to the C7.
I'll simply purchase the best performing manual, convertible on the market when I'm ready for another sports car after the C7.
I'll simply purchase the best performing manual, convertible on the market when I'm ready for another sports car after the C7.
So if no one offers a manual except in a FWD car or an off-roader (like a Wrangler). What do you buy? Old cars?
#253
Le Mans Master
I've been a Corvette fan since I was a kid, and a Corvette owner for +25 years, so you could call me a 'huge' fan.
That said, if Corvette stopped offering a manual transmission, my next car would likely be a manual Porsche. I've tried the DSG's and PSK's... they just don't give me the level of driving fun\engagement that a clutch pedal does, even if the autos are a little 'faster' around a track or dragstrip. For my personal needs, I would be giving up 50% of my desired flavor of driving enjoyment for a 5% decrease in lap times. Not a trade I am in any way interested or willing to make.
For me, I'd rather drive a 400hp sportscar with a manual than a 500hp sportscar with an automatic.
That said, if Corvette stopped offering a manual transmission, my next car would likely be a manual Porsche. I've tried the DSG's and PSK's... they just don't give me the level of driving fun\engagement that a clutch pedal does, even if the autos are a little 'faster' around a track or dragstrip. For my personal needs, I would be giving up 50% of my desired flavor of driving enjoyment for a 5% decrease in lap times. Not a trade I am in any way interested or willing to make.
For me, I'd rather drive a 400hp sportscar with a manual than a 500hp sportscar with an automatic.
Last edited by Kent1999; 11-11-2017 at 06:33 PM.
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#254
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Originally Posted by jagamajajaran
For 2017, 7% of Stingrays, 6% of Grand Sports, and 3% of Z06s were verts. If those percentages don't bring about the end of Corvette verts, I doubt 20% transmission numbers will bring about the end of the manual transmission.
Convertibles are totally different, they aren’t essential, but industry wise they will never go away. Therefore the supply base will continue to innovate and invest in them.
#255
Racer
Same for me except not necessarily a convertible.
But no manual tranny would mean no Corvette for Jim either.
I know that we are a small part of the overall market but we are some of the most committed owners and I think car makers are shortsighted and greedy if they don't make a car that I want to buy.
Whichever way this one goes is fine with me though. Unlike a lot of people on the forum my next car does not have to be a Chevy.
#256
Safety Car
Originally Posted by LT1 Z51
I think my record of posts speaks for its self. I can't remember a time so far where I've actually been wrong.
I am a mere mortal and I admit it, I make mistakes. I have made them in the past, and I am sure I will again in the future. (And I sure I made a least one today too.)
I just “tapped out,” e.g., unsubscribing from this particular thread. I am going to spend my forum and other time trying to find somewhere where, if there is one, we can find a link to a live feed for tomorrow morning’s 10:00 (EST) ZR1 reveal.
#257
Race Director
I can't explain the drop...2016 model year, convertibles were 19.3% of the total.
#258
Then I remembered the Wrangler I drove in Hawaii had an auto.
I just checked out the Jeep website to be sure a manual was still offered.
I know Grand Cherokees haven't offered them in decades, if at all.
EXACTLY.
Convertibles are totally different, they aren’t essential, but industry wise they will never go away. Therefore the supply base will continue to innovate and invest in them.
#259
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"Ask Tadge" Producer
I came into this thread looking to see if there was any info on a live stream for the Dubai event tomorrow, but then read this:
Uh. Hold the phone a moment. Before we go throwing body styles into the same bucket as drivetrain components, let's read what the head honcho of Corvette has already said about the topic:
Ask Tadge about Manuals
Different drivetrains need to be emissions and FE tested and certified. That stuff costs a butt-ton of money. Remember that while GM makes its own auto, it purchases the manual from TREMEC. If fewer and fewer people are buying manuals, it means GM will purchase fewer and fewer of them from TREMEC (who's also no longer selling them to Dodge for the Viper). At some point, it becomes an unfavorable business proposition from TREMEC to continue making and selling the transmissions, which leaves GM to either:
Guess which one the business guys will say to do, should the take rate continue dropping? Here's a hint: it's the last one. I promise.
Ask Tadge about Manuals
Different drivetrains need to be emissions and FE tested and certified. That stuff costs a butt-ton of money. Remember that while GM makes its own auto, it purchases the manual from TREMEC. If fewer and fewer people are buying manuals, it means GM will purchase fewer and fewer of them from TREMEC (who's also no longer selling them to Dodge for the Viper). At some point, it becomes an unfavorable business proposition from TREMEC to continue making and selling the transmissions, which leaves GM to either:
- Find another manufacturer
- Make their own
- Kill the manual car
Guess which one the business guys will say to do, should the take rate continue dropping? Here's a hint: it's the last one. I promise.
Last edited by jvp; 11-11-2017 at 07:44 PM.
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#260