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Target Times Have Been Set!

Old 01-22-2018, 02:53 PM
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the professor
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Default Target Times Have Been Set!

CarandDriver and MotorTrend posted their Ford GT reviews today along with some lap times for the ZR1 to shoot for.

C&D ran a special Lightning Lap 11.5 at VIR and the GT set a new record (for them) at 2:43.00 (2015 Z07 clocked in at 2:44.6).

MT had Randy run the FGT at Willow Springs and it came in fourth fastest they had ever run after the McLaren 720S, Huracan Performante, and 918 Spyder with a 1:23.69 (hoping to see a comparison with the 720S and Performante!). The fastest Z07 they have run there did a 1:25.76.

Very respectable times for the GT. Judging by how fast the C7Z's times are, I am hoping to see improvements when they run the ZR1 that can dethrone the Ford next Lightning Lap and compete with the 720 and the Lambo at Big Willow.

Super exctiting times to be a car enthusiast! I can't wait to see how things unfold at these tracks and at Laguna Seca for "Best Drivers Car." Hopfully we will also get to see what the GT2 RS does at these events.

http://www.motortrend.com/cars/ford/...t-test-review/

https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...at-vir-feature

Last edited by the professor; 01-22-2018 at 07:28 PM. Reason: Typo
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Old 01-22-2018, 06:19 PM
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I saw 2 of them at Barrett Jackson this past week and they look awesome, truly badass looking ride. Love the lines on it. But I have to say I'm a little underwhelmed with both magazine tests. The anticipation for this car has been insane...and to see it fall on it's face in one test, basically breaking (we all remember the comments when the C7Z did that). Then in the LL it set a very fast lap, but only .4s faster than the AMG GT Benz.

As a collectors car it'll always hold it's value...but in terms of being a value and a truly incredible performer...The early testing suggests not. It looks like a 720s will eat it's lunch AND you can actually buy one of those, whereas you can't get a new FGT.

I think the ZR1 will hold it's own quite nicely against this car.

One last point...for all the money/engineering they have into this thing...3353lbs is not exactly 'light.' I'm not trashing the car cause I'd own one and I think it's really cool...but I guess my expectations were much higher for such a rare 'halo' car and so much hype. When a run of the mill 720s or ZR1 can (likely) hang with it...that disappoints me. Just my opinion.
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Old 01-22-2018, 06:46 PM
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Well, first the VIR Grand Course lap times were 2:43.0 and 2:44.6, not 1:43 and 1:44.6. Jim Mero also already put down a 2:41.3 in the 2015 C7 Z06 three years ago. I realize that's comparing a GM employee to the C&D editor but everyone was also quick to point out that Mero wasn't a "professional driver" in the ZR1 ring time thread.


To top things off, GM also said that with the new suspension tune they just released and is standard on the 2018s knocked 2.5s off the C7 Z06 lap time at VIR Grand Course. So that puts the C7 Z06 lap time down to a 2:38.8 or over 4 seconds a lap faster than the Ford GT. That's before we even see the C7 ZR1 run which should be a fair bit better again.

Last edited by Steven Bell; 01-22-2018 at 08:04 PM.
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Old 01-22-2018, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Poor-sha View Post
Well, first the VIR Grand Course lap times were 2:43.0 and 2:44.6, not 1:43 and 1:44.6. Jim Mero also already put down a 2:41.3 in the 2015 C7 Z06 three years ago. I realize that's comparing a GM employee to the C&D editor but everyone was also quick to point out that Mero wasn't a "professional driver" in the ZR1 ring time thread.


To top things off, GM also said that with the new suspension tune they just released and is standard on the 2018s knocked 2.5s off the C7 Z06 lap time at VIR Grand Course. So that puts the C7 Z06 lap time down to a 2:38.8 or over 4 seconds a lap faster than the Ford GT. That's before we even see the C7 ZR1 run which should be a fair bit better again.
Good catch on the VIR times, I mistyped after flipping back and forth between articles so many times. It has been edited to correct my typo.
As to your point about Mero, I was keeping it limited to C&D LL for as close of an apples to apples comparison as possible. The Viper ACR Extreme still holds the overall record there with a 2:40.02 so that is really the time the ZR1 team should be aiming to beat.
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Old 01-22-2018, 07:53 PM
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All of the cars mentioned here turned unusually fast laps:
The Z06 fast for the money
The AMG fast for power/weight despite running the same Z06 tires
The 918 for such a heavy car
The Dalara chassis for running such a wimpy (Ford) engine

But if you really ask me, the Viper is the one that stands out. No forced induction, stick shift and arguably with the right driver the fastest.
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Old 01-22-2018, 11:12 PM
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Originally Posted by SBC_and_a_stick View Post
All of the cars mentioned here turned unusually fast laps:
The Z06 fast for the money
The AMG fast for power/weight despite running the same Z06 tires
The 918 for such a heavy car
The Dalara chassis for running such a wimpy (Ford) engine

But if you really ask me, the Viper is the one that stands out. No forced induction, stick shift and arguably with the right driver the fastest.
Don't know if I'd call the EB V6 wimpy...it still managed to trap 134mph in C/D's test.

In any case, I think the ZR1 should be close to or should beat the GT's time at most tracks. However, just as almost every tester has said, there's nothing close to the GT in terms of experience. It is the closest thing to a legit racecar for sale right now...

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Old 01-22-2018, 11:32 PM
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I'm sure it is a racecar. A Ford built by Multimatic is like a Chevy built by Dallara.

That is, you can take the Dallara built Chevy Daytona Prototype and get rid of the fixed aero to reduce drag, and any V6 turbo will propel it to great numbers. It will also be a racecar because it's a racecar.



http://www.corvetteblogger.com/image.../092314_25.jpg

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Old 01-23-2018, 03:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Poor-sha View Post


To top things off, GM also said that with the new suspension tune they just released and is standard on the 2018s knocked 2.5s off the C7 Z06 lap time at VIR Grand Course.
Yikes, I need to get that upgrade ASAP.
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Old 01-23-2018, 04:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Poor-sha View Post
Well, first the VIR Grand Course lap times were 2:43.0 and 2:44.6, not 1:43 and 1:44.6. Jim Mero also already put down a 2:41.3 in the 2015 C7 Z06 three years ago. I realize that's comparing a GM employee to the C&D editor but everyone was also quick to point out that Mero wasn't a "professional driver" in the ZR1 ring time thread.


To top things off, GM also said that with the new suspension tune they just released and is standard on the 2018s knocked 2.5s off the C7 Z06 lap time at VIR Grand Course. So that puts the C7 Z06 lap time down to a 2:38.8 or over 4 seconds a lap faster than the Ford GT. That's before we even see the C7 ZR1 run which should be a fair bit better again.
http://www.fordgtforum.com/forums/sh...at-VIR-C-amp-D

These guys would have a stroke.

This information makes me want a C7Z even more!
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Old 01-23-2018, 03:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Innovate View Post
http://www.fordgtforum.com/forums/sh...at-VIR-C-amp-D

These guys would have a stroke.

This information makes me want a C7Z even more!
Haha, these guys crack me up!

There are so many 100% race cars you can buy and none of those characters would buy one. But put a Ford GT badge on it and they all think it's better than any supercar will ever be.

car soul=branding. Someday cars will have souls and they might talk back and not even like their owner. Today they are machines.

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Old 01-23-2018, 04:13 PM
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Originally Posted by SBC_and_a_stick View Post
Haha, these guys crack me up!

There are so many 100% race cars you can buy and none of those characters would buy one. But put a Ford GT badge on it and they all think it's better than any supercar will ever be.

car soul=branding. Someday cars will have souls and they might talk back and not even like their owner. Today they are machines.
It is crazy the way they talk about how their car is a “Ford GT” and the McLaren 720S is “just another car.” The “other car” is faster than you, cheaper, and people can get their hands on one.
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Old 01-23-2018, 04:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Innovate View Post
It is crazy the way they talk about how their car is a “Ford GT” and the McLaren 720S is “just another car.” The “other car” is faster than you, cheaper, and people can get their hands on one.
It's not as compromised either, with better street manners. I would venture a guess that that the McLaren will be faster on the street 100% of the time. The Ford GT requires a super low setting for the aero to work, but on bumpier roads aero will stall, bump stops will be hit, or the car will lose contact with the road. If the aero is not working than the McLaren and many other cars will prevail by virtue of having a better engine. Even on track, the McLaren will keep up.

The 720s is the evolution of a car that's been out for many years. I think it will have fewer problems when ran hard compared to the Ford GT, which apparently has fuel pump cavitation issues. It's not "racy" to have pumps cavitate.
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Old 01-23-2018, 04:26 PM
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Originally Posted by SBC_and_a_stick View Post
It's not as compromised either, with better street manners. I would venture a guess that that the McLaren will be faster on the street 100% of the time. The Ford GT requires a super low setting for the aero to work, but on bumpier roads aero will stall, bump stops will be hit, or the car will lose contact with the road. If the aero is not working than the McLaren and many other cars will prevail by virtue of having a better engine. Even on track, the McLaren will keep up.

The 720s is the evolution of a car that's been out for many years. I think it will have fewer problems when ran hard compared to the Ford GT, which apparently has fuel pump cavitation issues. It's not "racy" to have pumps cavitate.
All true, Ford went a tad far on their race car for the street. The FGT should not have issues on track, for the price you would expect a near perfect or perfect car. Owell, to each his own.
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Old 01-23-2018, 04:39 PM
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Originally Posted by SBC_and_a_stick View Post
It's not as compromised either, with better street manners. I would venture a guess that that the McLaren will be faster on the street 100% of the time. The Ford GT requires a super low setting for the aero to work, but on bumpier roads aero will stall, bump stops will be hit, or the car will lose contact with the road. If the aero is not working than the McLaren and many other cars will prevail by virtue of having a better engine. Even on track, the McLaren will keep up.

The 720s is the evolution of a car that's been out for many years. I think it will have fewer problems when ran hard compared to the Ford GT, which apparently has fuel pump cavitation issues. It's not "racy" to have pumps cavitate.
Agreed. Obviously time will tell...but I personally think the 720s will be quicker than the NFGT on 'most' tracks, especially the longer tracks. It's lighter than the NFGT, and likely has close to 100hp more due to be underrated and is no slouch in the corners or under braking.

Sure the NFGT will hold value better and be more exclusive...but overall performance likely goes to the 720s. I'm blown away by it's performance envelope, it's pretty stunning. Hyper car fast...
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Old 01-23-2018, 05:57 PM
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Originally Posted by ZoratZ06 View Post
Agreed. Obviously time will tell...but I personally think the 720s will be quicker than the NFGT on 'most' tracks, especially the longer tracks. It's lighter than the NFGT, and likely has close to 100hp more due to be underrated and is no slouch in the corners or under braking.

Sure the NFGT will hold value better and be more exclusive...but overall performance likely goes to the 720s. I'm blown away by it's performance envelope, it's pretty stunning. Hyper car fast...
The only thing holding down the 720s are those skinny 305 section rear tires. I presume McLaren is doing this on purpose so their P1s, Sennas, and other top tier cars have room to grow. Nothing like product line cannibalism haha.
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Old 01-23-2018, 06:09 PM
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Ah, just order yourself a spiffy new AMG GT-R, drive it luxury on the street, and then put down some of the fastest laps on track of any car. I mean only 0.3 seconds slower than a Ford GT at C&D's VIR lap. Why bother, go for the blingmobile with the comfort option, and save over $300k. In any case you can't even buy a Ford GT.
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Old 01-23-2018, 06:35 PM
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Originally Posted by descartesfool View Post
Ah, just order yourself a spiffy new AMG GT-R, drive it luxury on the street, and then put down some of the fastest laps on track of any car. I mean only 0.3 seconds slower than a Ford GT at C&D's VIR lap. Why bother, go for the blingmobile with the comfort option, and save over $300k. In any case you can't even buy a Ford GT.
Hard to argue against that. The GT R is only using 19.x psi, there is room for at least 5 psi more, which is twice the increase from S to R model. Black edition could easily add more power.
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Old 01-24-2018, 03:02 PM
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Originally Posted by SBC_and_a_stick View Post
The only thing holding down the 720s are those skinny 305 section rear tires. I presume McLaren is doing this on purpose so their P1s, Sennas, and other top tier cars have room to grow. Nothing like product line cannibalism haha.
Par for the course right!! R&T ran the 720s, 9.9 at i believe 148!! For there performance car of the year test!! And they noted imagine if it had trofeo tires on!! MT just tested the FGT and ran 11.0 and C&D ran 10.8! That’s a large power difference
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Old 01-24-2018, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by SBC_and_a_stick View Post
Hard to argue against that. The GT R is only using 19.x psi, there is room for at least 5 psi more, which is twice the increase from S to R model. Black edition could easily add more power.
If there is company that can extract power from a turbocharged engine, it's MB:



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Old 01-24-2018, 07:31 PM
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Originally Posted by the professor View Post
Good catch on the VIR times, I mistyped after flipping back and forth between articles so many times. It has been edited to correct my typo.
As to your point about Mero, I was keeping it limited to C&D LL for as close of an apples to apples comparison as possible. The Viper ACR Extreme still holds the overall record there with a 2:40.02 so that is really the time the ZR1 team should be aiming to beat.
Actually the GT has the record now. A Ford factory driver took the car out same day as C&D. They just released his time. 2:38.62.
This car is seriously fast even though it is not likely many will be out trying to set lap times.
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