New article w/GT2 RS and 720S
09-02-2018, 03:17 PM
#21
Le Mans Master
Member Since: Oct 2005
Location: Metro Detroit Michigan
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09-02-2018, 04:11 PM
#22
Drifting
I agree Porsche make a good product but it's far from perfect. My good friend here in Colorado was the lead person in setting up the meeting with Porsche U.S. headquarters in Atlanta regarding the finger follower issue. Porsche acted like they didn't know about the issue despite many, many documented engine failures. Ultimately they handled the issue but lost a lot of goodwill as many owners had to park their cars for months until Porsche acknowledged the problem.
The 2014 and 2015 model years were effected and I'm fortunate that I was in a hurry to replace my 2007 Z06 and chose not to wait on the GT3 as I would have bought a 2014. Instead I bought a 2013 991S X51 which I owned until 2017. At the time of purchase it was the most powerful NA car in the Porsche lineup. It was a fun car but sorely under powered at 430/325. My car had squeaks and rattles following 12 months of ownership which the dealer couldn't fix. The dealer experience was so-so. The best thing about my Porsche was the PDK transmission and the cup holders.
Last summer my son and daughter rented me a Z06 for my birthday. Following that exhilarating experience I placed a for sale ad in autotrader. A few days later I got a call from my Porsche dealer offering me 50% of the retail price of my 911. My car was only 4 years old with low miles. What an insult. The only Porsche cars that hold their value are the GT cars.
Two weeks later I negotiated a trade in for a brand new 2017 Z07 3LZ M7. This car is in a totally different league. I still hang with my Porsche GT3 buddies with whom I made friends years ago and not once when we go for entertaining drives do I wish I had waited for the 991.2 GT3.
The 2014 and 2015 model years were effected and I'm fortunate that I was in a hurry to replace my 2007 Z06 and chose not to wait on the GT3 as I would have bought a 2014. Instead I bought a 2013 991S X51 which I owned until 2017. At the time of purchase it was the most powerful NA car in the Porsche lineup. It was a fun car but sorely under powered at 430/325. My car had squeaks and rattles following 12 months of ownership which the dealer couldn't fix. The dealer experience was so-so. The best thing about my Porsche was the PDK transmission and the cup holders.
Last summer my son and daughter rented me a Z06 for my birthday. Following that exhilarating experience I placed a for sale ad in autotrader. A few days later I got a call from my Porsche dealer offering me 50% of the retail price of my 911. My car was only 4 years old with low miles. What an insult. The only Porsche cars that hold their value are the GT cars.
Two weeks later I negotiated a trade in for a brand new 2017 Z07 3LZ M7. This car is in a totally different league. I still hang with my Porsche GT3 buddies with whom I made friends years ago and not once when we go for entertaining drives do I wish I had waited for the 991.2 GT3.
Best Regards,
Dave
09-02-2018, 05:23 PM
#23
Drifting
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Dave Schotz (09-02-2018)
09-03-2018, 04:39 AM
#25
Good read. Tried to keep my "geek head" out of it at least for the things that do not count... writer does his best to keep everybody happy...but for the important stuff... could not!..(again: good read):
1. GT2RS makes the "700" club by DIN standards.. don't mind the least but then the ZR1 is 768 DIN vs 755 SAE
2. ZR1 with A8 Weight: 3560. Incorrect; that is the weight of a base ZR1 with manual. Tested car with A8 is more.
3. GT2RS weight 3241: Incorrect; that is declared DIN dry weight. Base "street" US curb is 3465.
4. GT2RS massive Michelin Sport Cup 2 R tires, essentially the same compound as the Corvette wore.... Nice semantic play with "essentially" but incorrect. CUP 2 R tires so far have only been fitted to GT cars for marketing tests. Porsche GT OEM cars are still fitted with "regular" CUP 2s.. I tried to purchase CUP 2 Rs directly from Michelin (they do not exist yet) AND Porsche a month ago and was told first quarter next year (maybe)...
Render unto Caesar
1. GT2RS makes the "700" club by DIN standards.. don't mind the least but then the ZR1 is 768 DIN vs 755 SAE
2. ZR1 with A8 Weight: 3560. Incorrect; that is the weight of a base ZR1 with manual. Tested car with A8 is more.
3. GT2RS weight 3241: Incorrect; that is declared DIN dry weight. Base "street" US curb is 3465.
4. GT2RS massive Michelin Sport Cup 2 R tires, essentially the same compound as the Corvette wore.... Nice semantic play with "essentially" but incorrect. CUP 2 R tires so far have only been fitted to GT cars for marketing tests. Porsche GT OEM cars are still fitted with "regular" CUP 2s.. I tried to purchase CUP 2 Rs directly from Michelin (they do not exist yet) AND Porsche a month ago and was told first quarter next year (maybe)...
Render unto Caesar
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Palantirion (09-03-2018)
09-03-2018, 09:46 AM
#26
That was a good read! A breath of fresh air than all the nonsense currently on this forum. Thanks OP!
09-04-2018, 06:56 AM
#27
The weights quoted are heavily incorrect. GT2RS does not weigh 3200 lbs and neither does the ZR1 they got at 3560 lbs. We now know 3560 lbs is for manual. Furthermore, GM curb weight includes full tank of gas vs porsche quotes DIN dry weight with no gas. As a result, we also know GT2RS weighs 3400 lbs. The weight delta between two cars is more like 250 lbs (or 150 lbs with manual).
Depending on how you look at it though:
- GT2RS isnt as light as people think....
- Or even with all that weight and only 700hp and only 553 torque....
On that note, I am actually thinking maybe motor trend should have been given the manual car for their test. I think it may have lapped faster. 100 lbs of difference is no joke here in manual vs auto.
Depending on how you look at it though:
- GT2RS isnt as light as people think....
- Or even with all that weight and only 700hp and only 553 torque....
On that note, I am actually thinking maybe motor trend should have been given the manual car for their test. I think it may have lapped faster. 100 lbs of difference is no joke here in manual vs auto.
Last edited by UnhandledException; 09-04-2018 at 07:09 AM.
09-04-2018, 02:53 PM
#28
Instructor
Thread Starter
I agree, even if the auto is faster at Laguna Seca or Big Willow where MT tested the ZR1. They did the test with the car that they had for the Best Driver's Car competition and GM had to cost themselves several places in the finishing order (maybe not though, we will see when they release the results this month) by sending the less driver oriented car. The three-pedal option is unique to the ZR1 in this segment making it the most desirable one to me (no matter how perfect the 720S is or how fast the GT2 RS is on the 'ring or any other track).
09-04-2018, 11:27 PM
#29
Great one Glenn!
09-05-2018, 01:27 PM
#30
I've been sitting on this info not sure how private it was but Mike Levitas and his son Harris are in Germany right now taking delivery and tuning a GT2RS. They drove it straight to the ring, had the setup tweaked by Lucas Luhr, and now are at Spa. Mike also has already put a DSC controller in it. Those guys are awesome!
https://rennlist.com/forums/european...new-gt2rs.html
I'm hoping they bring it to the track in October and we can play a bit. Another SPDC member just picked up a 720S and is bringing it to the track next week on Hoosiers. I'm hoping I can make it out for a day to play. If I do I'll make sure I put video up on my channel no matter how the ZR1 fares. What a great time to be a car enthusiast.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDS...IkweraNN2199tg
https://rennlist.com/forums/european...new-gt2rs.html
I'm hoping they bring it to the track in October and we can play a bit. Another SPDC member just picked up a 720S and is bringing it to the track next week on Hoosiers. I'm hoping I can make it out for a day to play. If I do I'll make sure I put video up on my channel no matter how the ZR1 fares. What a great time to be a car enthusiast.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDS...IkweraNN2199tg
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09-05-2018, 03:38 PM
#31
Burning Brakes
I've been sitting on this info not sure how private it was but Mike Levitas and his son Harris are in Germany right now taking delivery and tuning a GT2RS. They drove it straight to the ring, had the setup tweaked by Lucas Luhr, and now are at Spa. Mike also has already put a DSC controller in it. Those guys are awesome!
https://rennlist.com/forums/european...new-gt2rs.html
I'm hoping they bring it to the track in October and we can play a bit. Another SPDC member just picked up a 720S and is bringing it to the track next week on Hoosiers. I'm hoping I can make it out for a day to play. If I do I'll make sure I put video up on my channel no matter how the ZR1 fares. What a great time to be a car enthusiast.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDS...IkweraNN2199tg
https://rennlist.com/forums/european...new-gt2rs.html
I'm hoping they bring it to the track in October and we can play a bit. Another SPDC member just picked up a 720S and is bringing it to the track next week on Hoosiers. I'm hoping I can make it out for a day to play. If I do I'll make sure I put video up on my channel no matter how the ZR1 fares. What a great time to be a car enthusiast.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDS...IkweraNN2199tg
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Poor-sha (09-05-2018)
09-05-2018, 05:01 PM
#32
Safety Car
On Rennlist a guy just had an awesome comparison between a GT2 RS and Porsche cup with factory driver Bryan Sellers at the wheel of each. Track was Road America. They still don't have the unobtanium CupR available for purchase so he couldn't get any so they ran it on Trofeo R. Box stock with factory alignment. Did a 2:17.0. He said it was quite lively at the limit with quite a bit of oversteer. But that time is fast!
Levitas can drive BTW. If you can keep up with him in one, you can keep up with anybody in one.
Levitas can drive BTW. If you can keep up with him in one, you can keep up with anybody in one.
Last edited by heavychevy; 09-05-2018 at 07:16 PM.
09-05-2018, 06:10 PM
#33
On Rennlist a guy just had an awesome comparison between a GT2 RS and Porsche cup with factory driver Bryan Sellers at the wheel of each. Track was Road America. They still don't have the unobtanium CupR available for purchase so he couldn't get any so they ran it on Trofeo R. Box stock with factory alignment. Did a 1:17.0. He said it was quite lovely at the limit with quite a bit of oversteer. But that time is fast!
Levitas can drive BTW. If you can keep up with him in one, you can keep up with anybody in one.
Levitas can drive BTW. If you can keep up with him in one, you can keep up with anybody in one.
It just seems a little bit too fast.....
Just making sure you did not "fat finger" that number?
Cheers
09-05-2018, 06:14 PM
#34
Drifting
I've been following the story on Rennlist and as an additional point of interest the GT2 RS burned through 1/3 a tank (extended) of gas and an entire tank of water in 5 laps. It exhibits a lot of oversteer when pushed hard through a corner. The 2RS was characterized as really well sorted out for street driving but a little less on the track. (It's all relative) Looking forward to Poor-sha's head to head.
Last edited by bcmarly; 09-05-2018 at 06:15 PM.
09-05-2018, 06:22 PM
#35
Drifting
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Telepierre (09-05-2018)
09-05-2018, 07:15 PM
#36
Safety Car
09-05-2018, 07:29 PM
#37
Le Mans Master
- No, Saleen's were not aftermarket, they were bespoke and made in-house like most of the serious parts of the S7. The ones on my BMW are made by Ground Control, and they have a very long history of making sway bars for BMW, Porsche and the like. Their products are, in many ways, superior to the OEM versions - that's why they are used.
Are the ones on your track car teflon-lined? Dinan was starting to make teflon-lined monos for their front control arm replacements. They were quiet longer than regular mono, but I don't know for how much longer.
Are the ones on your track car teflon-lined? Dinan was starting to make teflon-lined monos for their front control arm replacements. They were quiet longer than regular mono, but I don't know for how much longer.
09-06-2018, 03:53 AM
#38
Burning Brakes
- Like they didn't make their own engines in house? Oh, but they did. Besides since no OEM directly manufactures most of the parts that go on their car so there is no logic in assuming quality levels between major and minor manufacturers based on your fallacious implication.
09-06-2018, 04:03 AM
#39
Burning Brakes
I would love to see someone test the GT2-RS with and without the misters to see how much its performance falls off. It's only a little quicker than the ZR1 when the magazines are topping off the misters and controlling tests to reflect unrealistic tracking conditions.I must presume the German will fair poorly if lap times were taken 1/2 way through (or at the end of) a full session.
Last edited by Palantirion; 09-06-2018 at 04:04 AM.
09-06-2018, 04:58 AM
#40
Safety Car
- That was at Road America? If so then that translates to 8 laps at Willow, which if we estimate 1.34 minutes per lap (running 1:20s) it would mean that it would run out of gas in 32 minutes. So it could finish a single 25min session but with little reserve and hopefully no low-tank fuel starvation in 2 or the Omega. Geez, I thought the ZR1 was thirsty, but it can at least do a full session AND drive to town for gas and lunch.
I would love to see someone test the GT2-RS with and without the misters to see how much its performance falls off. It's only a little quicker than the ZR1 when the magazines are topping off the misters and controlling tests to reflect unrealistic tracking conditions.I must presume the German will fair poorly if lap times were taken 1/2 way through (or at the end of) a full session.
I would love to see someone test the GT2-RS with and without the misters to see how much its performance falls off. It's only a little quicker than the ZR1 when the magazines are topping off the misters and controlling tests to reflect unrealistic tracking conditions.I must presume the German will fair poorly if lap times were taken 1/2 way through (or at the end of) a full session.
