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C7 ZR1 M7 or A8 for track?

 
Old 05-14-2019, 02:32 PM
  #41  
SouthernSon
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Originally Posted by Tool Hoarder View Post
Just my $0.02 tracking/racing for 20 years... the rev match is anything but a joke/gimmick. It's amazing and works perfectly. I don't bother heel-toe shifting anymore. A big benefit for me is I can now brake with my entire right foot vs. the ball of my right foot and trying to roll over my foot to blip the gas. Being 6'3" I can't do a "traditional" heel-toe where you rotate your foot way over swinging it from 6 to like 4 o'clock. It's allowed me to brake with even more confidence which means harder and later.
Why not just use an auto and stay with left foot braking while keeping throttle loaded?

Let me just say I do understand that some can really enjoy the rev matching. But for me and others that are fairly proficient at heel/toe, admittedly some better than others, enjoy manipulating all the dynamics of a perfect downshift. Rev matching, by its very term, means doing the matching for you. You don't have to execute that part of the downshift, the program does it for you. I do find that just a little pretentious. However, I have friends with compromised ankles that can't really do heel/toe that well. It would work well for them.

Last edited by SouthernSon; 05-14-2019 at 02:44 PM.
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Old 05-14-2019, 02:40 PM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by SouthernSon View Post
Why not just use an auto and stay with left foot braking while keeping throttle loaded?
Because the A8 will overheat with advanced drivers in the summer and I like shifting gears on the street. But the reasons you mentioned are why my C8 will be a DCT.
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Old 05-14-2019, 02:48 PM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by SouthernSon View Post
As far as fit of the tranny, the size is the same as previous autos.

http://gmauthority.com/blog/2014/01/...a-dual-clutch/
Wrong

http://www.gminsidenews.com/articles...s-before-2018/
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Old 05-14-2019, 03:04 PM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by NW-99SS View Post
We have some conflicting articles it would appear. In the link I posted above it states:

"The gearbox is the same physical size as the existing six-speed automatic, but thanks to a lightweight aluminium and magnesium construction, its eight pounds lighter. Despite its light weight, the 8L90 can handle up to 738 lb.-ft. of torque."

Whoa! You are correct. We are talking two different trannys.

Last edited by SouthernSon; 05-14-2019 at 03:06 PM.
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Old 05-14-2019, 03:07 PM
  #45  
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A8 and A6 can fit in the same space, but apparently the A10 is larger.
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Old 05-14-2019, 03:09 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by Tool Hoarder View Post
Because the A8 will overheat with advanced drivers in the summer and I like shifting gears on the street. But the reasons you mentioned are why my C8 will be a DCT.
I believe the 13 coolers on the ZR1 have addressed that problem. At least, that is my understanding. I haven't talked with the guys at Spring Mountain yet but will in June. I will find out first hand what their experiences have been.
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Old 05-14-2019, 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by SouthernSon View Post
We have some conflicting articles it would appear. In the link I posted above it states:

"The gearbox is the same physical size as the existing six-speed automatic, but thanks to a lightweight aluminium and magnesium construction, its eight pounds lighter. Despite its light weight, the 8L90 can handle up to 738 lb.-ft. of torque."

Whoa! You are correct. We are talking two different trannys.
You bet, A6 and A8 are interchangeable, A10 is not.
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Old 05-14-2019, 03:13 PM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by SouthernSon View Post
I believe the 13 coolers on the ZR1 have addressed that problem. At least, that is my understanding. I haven't talked with the guys at Spring Mountain yet but will in June. I will find out first hand what their experiences have been.
ZR1 has shown heat issues at Area 27 in the lower mainland BC. It is a very big track with one of the longest back straights in NA...it's very taxing on supercharged cars.
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Old 05-14-2019, 03:31 PM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by SouthernSon View Post
I believe the 13 coolers on the ZR1 have addressed that problem. At least, that is my understanding. I haven't talked with the guys at Spring Mountain yet but will in June. I will find out first hand what their experiences have been.
Pahrump should be nice and toasty in June. I'm going on the 24-25 and have a manual reserved.
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Old 05-14-2019, 03:45 PM
  #50  
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Quick Question - Given the ZR1's revised cooling vs that of a C7 Z06, would LG's/GSpeed/TIKT Cooling Systems on a C7 Z06 show heat issues as well on this track?


Originally Posted by NW-99SS View Post
ZR1 has shown heat issues at Area 27 in the lower mainland BC. It is a very big track with one of the longest back straights in NA...it's very taxing on supercharged cars.
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Old 05-14-2019, 03:52 PM
  #51  
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Originally Posted by JG853 View Post
Quick Question - Given the ZR1's revised cooling vs that of a C7 Z06, would LG's/GSpeed/TIKT Cooling Systems on a C7 Z06 show heat issues as well on this track?
I am not aware of anyone running that setup at Area 27, but I know that even with extensive cooling mods, the 1.74 builds too much heat at Area 27. I can further inquire with a few other members to check their knowledge/experience.

Good question.
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Old 05-14-2019, 04:06 PM
  #52  
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Originally Posted by 09Z06pj View Post
Nobody local to me has an allocation and I haven't really looked elsewhere. Have never ordered a new car, as I like to see what I'm getting before pulling the trigger. If the right car comes along, I'll do it but I'm not aggressively looking. The only sure thing is it will have to be 3ZR with an M7. BTW, good luck with yours. Look forward to seeing pics very soon.
If allocation is available, do what I did: Go to the dealership, frankenstein the options you like from what's available and then order. Any vehicle over 50k, much less 100k, I'm ordering it if they let me. So not only it's the car that I want, it's configured and built for me. Not sure what the last day is for overall orders on the C7, but that's just my take.
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Old 05-14-2019, 05:39 PM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by SouthernSon View Post
As far as those articles there is nothing about the comparison to the A8 except the chart showing ratio differences. You stated that the A10 shifts faster and is in the powerband more. I don't see that either. The LT5 has a fairly wide power band. Also, the articles I have seen state the A8 is faster in shifts than the PDK's. As far as the comparison to faster shifts than previous trannys it appears to be comparing previous autos available in the camaro. Both articles are from 2016. But, if you know of a direct comparison to the 2019 ZR1 A8 that would be interesting. As far as fit of the tranny, the size is the same as previous autos.

http://gmauthority.com/blog/2014/01/...a-dual-clutch/
I'm not arguing that the ZR1 is not a better car, but the 10 speed transmission is a better transmission.

https://media.gm.com/media/us/en/gm/...0speed-gm.html

7.39 ratio spread and faster upshifts
The new 10-speed’s greater overall performance and efficiency are due primarily to its wider 7.39 overall gear ratio spread, which enhances off-the-line performance with a more aggressive first gear ratio than GM’s eight-speed automatic. Smaller steps between the gears also help the engine maintain the optimal speed for maximum power at almost all speeds, especially when exiting a corner on a track.


https://media.chevrolet.com/media/us...chevrolet.html

With faster upshifts than a dual-clutch transmission and a wider overall gear ratio spread to optimize performance and efficiency, the all-new available Hydra-Matic 10-speed automatic transmissionsets a new performance standard in the 2017 Camaro ZL1 – and raises the bar for the segment


The greater overall performance and efficiency are due primarily to the 10-speed’s wider 7.39 overall gear ratio spread, which enhances off-the-line performance with an aggressive first gear ratio of 4.70. Smaller steps between the gears also help the engine maintain the optimal speed for maximum power at almost all vehicle speeds, especially when exiting a corner on a track.

“The gear ratios are so tightly spaced that the transmission is in the right gear and the engine is at the best rpm for transitions from corners to straights,” said Link. “And with the power from the ZL1’s supercharged LT4 engine, the force you feel in your seat as you accelerate out of a turn will put a grin on your face every time.”

Chevrolet testing has shown the ZL1 with the available 10-speed has faster shift times than the Porsche PDK dual-clutch transmission. In fact, the 1-2 upshift is 36-percent quicker than the PDK, while the 2-3 and 3-4 upshifts are 27-percent and 26-percent quicker, respectively.
There's really no argument here. There's no class action lawsuit against it. It doesn't overheat. It has no lag with the paddles. It's eye watering when left in auto.

I am not saying the ZR1 with an A8 is a pig. But I am 100% saying (and so is GM) that the A10 is their best automatic to date in every category. The internals are new. The programming is new. You should drive one for yourself.
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Old 05-14-2019, 07:20 PM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by 94Lt1Vette View Post
I'm not arguing that the ZR1 is not a better car, but the 10 speed transmission is a better transmission.

https://media.gm.com/media/us/en/gm/...0speed-gm.html



https://media.chevrolet.com/media/us...chevrolet.html



[color=#7f7f7f]

There's really no argument here. There's no class action lawsuit against it. It doesn't overheat. It has no lag with the paddles. It's eye watering when left in auto.

I am not saying the ZR1 with an A8 is a pig. But I am 100% saying (and so is GM) that the A10 is their best automatic to date in every category. The internals are new. The programming is new. You should drive one for yourself.
I instructed a fellow in his C7 auto last week at the NCM MSP. He had to leave early because of concern with shifting vibrations. He had 35K on the odometer and had never changed his fluid. He had done other track events before. The ZR1 manual, and I suppose for others too, states the fluid must be changed after first track event. I did on mine and the cost came in a little less than $800. But, one must follow the correct procedures to get correct performance.
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Old 05-14-2019, 09:18 PM
  #55  
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Originally Posted by SouthernSon View Post
I instructed a fellow in his C7 auto last week at the NCM MSP. He had to leave early because of concern with shifting vibrations. He had 35K on the odometer and had never changed his fluid. He had done other track events before. The ZR1 manual, and I suppose for others too, states the fluid must be changed after first track event. I did on mine and the cost came in a little less than $800. But, one must follow the correct procedures to get correct performance.
How is a transmission fluid change cost $800? Chevy service department?
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Old 05-14-2019, 10:10 PM
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I have been driving for 25 + years....and have driven the ZR at 8 tracks nationwide from Daytona to Barber to most recently Mid Ohio where I broked the track record for a production Corvette by 1.5 seconds on a cold day with sport cup 2's. M7 users unless very highly qualified will never come close to an A8 equal driver. My times at tracks prove it. No overheating anywhere and sub 1:57 laps at Daytona 4-5 sessions a day over a three day weekend. Go with what you feel most comfortable with.
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Old 05-14-2019, 10:20 PM
  #57  
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Originally Posted by range96 View Post
How is a transmission fluid change cost $800? Chevy service department?
Holds a lot of fluid (with coolers) and requires extensive flush. Two hours labor. Service writer said he gave me a break on fluid price.
now it is every 15 hours track time. Everyone should address that first service in the rear end as well as transmission.
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Old 05-15-2019, 01:45 AM
  #58  
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Originally Posted by SouthernSon View Post
Holds a lot of fluid (with coolers) and requires extensive flush. Two hours labor. Service writer said he gave me a break on fluid price.
now it is every 15 hours track time. Everyone should address that first service in the rear end as well as transmission.
I saw the every 15 hours of track time trans fluid change requirement in the OM and I'm sure the first one is the most important one. Two hours labor is what $200, the rest is fluid? And they cut you a break on the fluid price? In your bill, was the rear end fluid change was also included? Perhaps, an engine oil change as well? They want you to change out to 0W-40 after the track event...
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Old 05-15-2019, 08:40 AM
  #59  
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Old 05-15-2019, 11:32 AM
  #60  
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Originally Posted by range96 View Post
I saw the every 15 hours of track time trans fluid change requirement in the OM and I'm sure the first one is the most important one. Two hours labor is what $200, the rest is fluid? And they cut you a break on the fluid price? In your bill, was the rear end fluid change was also included? Perhaps, an engine oil change as well? They want you to change out to 0W-40 after the track event...
The car holds a ton of fluid and they triple flush it per the latest TSB for the A8 shudder.
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