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CCB and Stability Control; Rubber vs Aluminum Weight
Originally Posted by Suns_PSD
I agree on CF wheels, however some forged aluminum 18" wheels (because they are 18", not because they are aluminum) would reduce the moment of inertia even more, ride and handle better, and be much less expensive to boot.
Large wheels have been detrimental to the performance of cars overall, there is a reason no race cars run large diameter wheels, just large enough to clear the brakes.
I'd really like the Z06 to be a street-able track version of the car that should have the following: large NA engine, manual trans, less electronics, lightweight battery, manual seat controls, 2 piece iron rotors, 18" forged wheels. It should still have AC, a nice radio, heated seats, basic things that a car needs to operate on the street.
Save the over the top luxury stuff with the pimp 21" wheels for the ZR1.
I've pondered such design constraints and I have equated the logic of it!
And, expensive is always better; nobodies stopping you!
Buy a light GS, mod and strip it?
And larger diameter tires have relatively more tire on the road for cornering!
CCB and unsprung weight...right!
Last edited by johnglenntwo; 04-05-2018 at 12:45 AM.
In the latest Ask Tadge response on the ZR1 he mentions this comment.
The LT5 engine pushes almost a kilogram of super-heated gas through the exhaust pipes every second at full power. The temperature and pressure of the exhaust was actually enough to inflate sections of the exhaust pipe like a water balloon under extensive track testing. We had to upgrade the steel in the system and redesign sections to cope with those stresses. Shields had to be added in strategic locations to insulate things like electrical connectors and half-shaft boots from the extreme temperatures.
Usually that entails using Inconel as the go to austenitic nickel-chromium-based superalloy for some mid engined exhaust manifolds. Ferrari is using this alloy for their new 488 Pista exhaust system. See at 1:13 of video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mgm0jRi2HmU
From Wikipedia
Inconel alloys are oxidation-corrosion-resistant materials well suited for service in extreme environments subjected to pressure and heat. When heated, Inconel forms a thick, stable, passivating oxide layer protecting the surface from further attack. Inconel retains strength over a wide temperature range, attractive for high temperature applications where aluminum and steel would succumb to creep as a result of thermally induced crystal vacancies. Inconel’s high temperature strength is developed by solid solution strengthening or precipitation hardening, depending on the alloy.
It probably makes sense to use this superalloy for the mid engined exhaust manifold since it is also has twin turbochargers like the Pista! The 488GTB exhaust manifold also appear to be 3D printed or at least could be precision cast. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qNk_T82iuHM
Joe, while there were comments on the Code Name Zerv thread indicating that the DCT/Transaxle looked like a ZF unit I don't know for sure if it has been validated as such. And if ZF does in fact build a rear wheel steering unit, does it show on any of Zerv's leaks? This list is for observations of identifiable components that we can see on his leaked CAD drawings.
No, it hasn't been written in stone that the mid engine will have a ZF transmission, but since it LOOKS like a ZF in the CAD drawings.....
Also since my original post was made, Cadillac has said that the new CT6-VSport WILL have rear wheel steering. That doesn't mean that it will be automatically be available on the mid engine, but it does indicate very strongly that it could since we now know that GM has a rear wheel steering unit in their parts bin.
Kind of difficult for me to grasp that Cadillac would offer rear wheel steering on a 4 door sedan and not offer it on it's hot sports car. But, knowing GM, stranger things have happened.
I'm 99% sure that the CAD drawings that we have seen, courtesy of ZERV, are of the mid engine Corvette, and were not fabricated by a mad Russian scientist who is trying to fool the members of the Corvette Forum.
Thank you very much skank for the above videos. Quite different when most of us started, with the old, extensive, expensive and so-time-consuming process to make a single part.
Wonder if two or more decades from now, 3D printing could print the majority of a vehicle at one location..., then the vehicle have robots and a few workers finish its assembly?
Thank you very much skank for the above videos. Quite different when most of us started, with the old, extensive, expensive and so-time-consuming process to make a single part.
Wonder if two or more decades from now, 3D printing could print the majority of a vehicle at one location..., then the vehicle have robots and a few workers finish its assembly?
John, one thing is for sure. The 3D printing process is heavily used now for patterning the die cast or mould box's to cast something. You can definitely see a lot of the parts on the new 4.2L engine were precision castings where 3D printing process was used to prototype them. F1 uses 3D heavily.
I don’t think that the ZF 7-speed dual-clutch transaxle will work for the Mid-engine Corvette unless they’ve made a new one with a much higher torque rating.
The strongest 7-speed DCT ZF offers is rated at 750 Newton Meters of torque, or 553lb-ft torque. The 4.2L Cadillac Motor is rated at 627lb-ft, and that engine platform isn’t close to its full capacity. HOWEVER, their 8-speed DCT can handle 737lb-ft. As I have stated in another thread, ZERV said that the DCT would be a Tremec 7-speed, and that GM’s 10-speed was/is under research for transaxle applications. The Tremec TR-9007 can handle 664lb-ft of torque, which should be enough for the application.
I'm 99% sure that the CAD drawings that we have seen, courtesy of ZERV, are of the mid engine Corvette, and were not fabricated by a mad Russian scientist who is trying to fool the members of the Corvette Forum.
But, placing parts in a preliminary design and even procuring them doesn't yeild a foregone conclusion of their ultimate use.
Not even close! They shelved DCT's years ago, I recall.
If our autos still have slower downshifts slowing down? Simply having the car effectively under more complete computer control shift point timing in a slowing down car would greatly negate that need in say a ZO6 (paddles aside).
In a say more serious ZR1$(racecar like), maybe!?
Last edited by johnglenntwo; 04-06-2018 at 10:13 AM.
The 2014 C7 Stingray won more major awards when it was revealed to within its one year anniversary, than every other vehicle that has ever debuted, e.g. over 20.
While we will excitedly get a ME, we still have a crush on our C7 Z06. Running errands = really good/makes doing it fun. Driving curvy country roads in a spirited manner = GREAT. Driving cross country on road trips = Super traveler. Taking it to visit friends = a ball. Being something to put a smile on every single time we drive it = always.
Looking outstanding (our race car with a license plate) = all the time.
In total agreement with above, except '07 Z with 80 thousand miles. Cross country..yep( Black Hills Rally twice). Grocery getter..all the time. Curvy roads Yes again (Road America, Toronto Mosport, Watkins Glen, Lime Rock, NJ Lightning, plenty curvy), Visit friends..Scottsdale's not that far..Smile factor?ALMOST every one of those miles.
So that makes two us, but I bet that there are several thousand owners out there who could add their adventures to this list of fun things to do in a plastic car...Just sayin'.
Revised list showing a conventional targa top like the C7 FE line up, a optional electric folding hardtop with vertical rear window as shown on recent photos, and a standard bolted in top panel (like C6 ZR1) for ultimate structural rigidity as shown on recent photos where top panel gap isn't visible.
Revised list showing a conventional targa top like the C7 FE line up, a optional electric folding hardtop with vertical rear window as shown on recent photos, and a standard bolted in top panel (like C6 ZR1) for ultimate structural rigidity as shown on recent photos where top panel gap isn't visible.
Nice to see your thread still going. The chassis stiffness thread can be incorporated here.
Alright Corvette fans, please forgive me if this is not the right place for this, but I thought it related:
Could this apparently hinged under-body panel be part of an active aero system (see red ovals)? If not, what the heck is it? If the hinge opens upward, towards the hood of the car, could there be some internal ducts that suck air up and out, pulling the car to the tarmac? I don't pretend to be an expert, or even a novice, in these aspects of aerodynamics, but It is a peculiar looking element of the car. I welcome your thoughts, ideas, speculation, dismissal... under-body aero feature?
After reviewing this link, starting with the article, you will see how spot on your could be. Even though all the illustrations are for a C7, as noted by Keith Cornett of CorvetteBlogger, he expects the patent will be appplied to the C8 mid-engine.
Alright Corvette fans, please forgive me if this is not the right place for this, but I thought it related:
Could this apparently hinged under-body panel be part of an active aero system (see red ovals)? If not, what the heck is it? If the hinge opens upward, towards the hood of the car, could there be some internal ducts that suck air up and out, pulling the car to the tarmac? I don't pretend to be an expert, or even a novice, in these aspects of aerodynamics, but It is a peculiar looking element of the car. I welcome your thoughts, ideas, speculation, dismissal... under-body aero feature?
Both Ferrari and Porsche use this area for passive downforce purposes.
I see no particular reason that making it active would be of useful benefit.
According to what I have read in the patent and elsewhere, the advantage of using the front “aeroblade” in an active manner would be to adjust the attitude/rake of the car, with perhaps additionally or consequently, top speed, accel, and decel advantages. And if it were differentially adjustable side-to-side heightwise, it could help in cornering.
Originally Posted by USPTO
The application appears to detail an adjustable spoiler, air dam, front splitter, rear diffuser and shutter. These aerodynamic parts would be controlled by a computer that could make minute adjustments to the various angles to either increase downforce or trim aerodynamics for speed based on the ride height of the Corvette.
The description of Adaptive Aerodynamics from the patent application:
A system is configured to control aerodynamics of a vehicle. The vehicle includes a vehicle body having a front end facing an ambient airflow when the vehicle is in motion relative to a road surface. The system includes an adjustable aerodynamic-aid element mounted to the vehicle body. The system also includes a mechanism configured to vary a position of the adjustable aerodynamic-aid element relative to the vehicle body and thereby control movement of the airflow. The system additionally includes a sensor configured to detect a height of the vehicle body relative to a predetermined reference frame and a controller configured to receive a signal from the sensor indicative of the detected vehicle body height. The controller is also configured to determine a ride-height of the vehicle using the detected vehicle body height and to regulate the mechanism in response to the determined ride-height to control aerodynamics of the vehicle.’
I thought that when I first saw these CAD images, as it does appear to line up with the Frunk shown in top view CAD images. But then, looking at the design of it here, the single bracket (or hinge?) on the leading edge, in contrast to the open seams on the side, and especially the black cut-out in the surrounding frame on the trailing edge, caused me to reconsider its function. Of course it could just be a CAD-generated cut-out view, but being aware of the Active Aero patent applications, I thought it may actually be part of that system.
Both Ferrari and Porsche use this area for passive downforce purposes.
I see no particular reason that making it active would be of useful benefit.
What's passive downforce? This this a skid plate to protect the titanium subframe and not a diffuser. Not to be confused with a splitter. Since the C4, Corvettes have had some form of component protection under the front of the car.
This Ferrari GTE has front and rear diffusers which are sensitive to ride height and pitch. Some exotic cars have active vari ramps on the rear diffuser. The radiator exit out of the hood provides some downforce. Mostly active air flow control of street cars is to reduce drag.
The ramp coming of the side sill on the C8 is directed to the side intake.
04-04-2018, 06:12 AM
CCB and Stability Control; Rubber vs Aluminum Weight
