List of components, technologies, and configurations of the Mid Engined Corvette
11-28-2018, 03:12 PM
#141
Le Mans Master
And now I'm caught up. Keep up the good work gentleman.
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skank (11-28-2018)
11-28-2018, 09:56 PM
#142
thats true...though it depends on your track... I dont wanna power slide into a bunch of tires.. my track for my gnx, ugr Gallardo and this new corvette when it comes ..is 1320... and rolling on the street.. smoking gtr's (unless they are built lol)... the absolute last thing I wanna do is roll 150 into a tight chicane ... im in my 40's.... its street light stuff for us old guys...
12-05-2018, 07:35 PM
#143
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
"69" just posted a Road & Track article on The Mid-Engine Corvette's Hatch Has a Unique Design to Aid Cooling.
https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...-hatch-patent/
This is going on the List !
https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...-hatch-patent/
This is going on the List !
Last edited by skank; 12-05-2018 at 07:35 PM.
12-06-2018, 06:01 AM
#144
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
UnlimitedPower divulged the new GT model and Jagamajajaran just posted this tidbit of info. GM's recently patented GT emblem. 
http://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?PageNum...Bemblem%252522
http://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?PageNum...Bemblem%252522
12-06-2018, 06:16 AM
#145
Le Mans Master
In the latest Ask Tadge response on the ZR1 he mentions this comment.
The LT5 engine pushes almost a kilogram of super-heated gas through the exhaust pipes every second at full power. The temperature and pressure of the exhaust was actually enough to inflate sections of the exhaust pipe like a water balloon under extensive track testing. We had to upgrade the steel in the system and redesign sections to cope with those stresses. Shields had to be added in strategic locations to insulate things like electrical connectors and half-shaft boots from the extreme temperatures.
Usually that entails using Inconel as the go to metal which is a austenitic nickel-chromium-based superalloy. It's used in the Aerospace Industry and many high heat applications which would include mid engined exhaust manifolds. Ferrari is using this alloy for their new 488 Pista exhaust system. See at 1:13 of video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mgm0jRi2HmU
From Wikipedia
Inconel alloys are oxidation-corrosion-resistant materials well suited for service in extreme environments subjected to pressure and heat. When heated, Inconel forms a thick, stable, passivating oxide layer protecting the surface from further attack. Inconel retains strength over a wide temperature range, attractive for high temperature applications where aluminum and steel would succumb to creep as a result of thermally induced crystal vacancies. Inconel’s high temperature strength is developed by solid solution strengthening or precipitation hardening, depending on the alloy.
It probably makes sense to use this superalloy for the mid engined exhaust manifold since it is also has twin turbochargers like the Pista! The 488GTB exhaust manifold also appear to be 3D printed or at least could be precision cast.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qNk_T82iuHM
The LT5 engine pushes almost a kilogram of super-heated gas through the exhaust pipes every second at full power. The temperature and pressure of the exhaust was actually enough to inflate sections of the exhaust pipe like a water balloon under extensive track testing. We had to upgrade the steel in the system and redesign sections to cope with those stresses. Shields had to be added in strategic locations to insulate things like electrical connectors and half-shaft boots from the extreme temperatures.
Usually that entails using Inconel as the go to metal which is a austenitic nickel-chromium-based superalloy. It's used in the Aerospace Industry and many high heat applications which would include mid engined exhaust manifolds. Ferrari is using this alloy for their new 488 Pista exhaust system. See at 1:13 of video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mgm0jRi2HmU
From Wikipedia
Inconel alloys are oxidation-corrosion-resistant materials well suited for service in extreme environments subjected to pressure and heat. When heated, Inconel forms a thick, stable, passivating oxide layer protecting the surface from further attack. Inconel retains strength over a wide temperature range, attractive for high temperature applications where aluminum and steel would succumb to creep as a result of thermally induced crystal vacancies. Inconel’s high temperature strength is developed by solid solution strengthening or precipitation hardening, depending on the alloy.
It probably makes sense to use this superalloy for the mid engined exhaust manifold since it is also has twin turbochargers like the Pista! The 488GTB exhaust manifold also appear to be 3D printed or at least could be precision cast.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qNk_T82iuHM
Based on the cad, they looked like swoopy tube manifods but I think that was the downstream plumbing and we'll see short stubby high flow manifolds with the turbos snugged up to the block. Possibly a waste gate that opens up on cold start to help cat light off temps for cold starts. And some nice twin scroll turbos that light off quick and maintain torq thorught the rev range.
Engine variants seem to be clearing up
a hot rod LT1 sneaking up over 500, a vettilac 4.2 TT, and the mauler 5.5 TT I'll have that.
I don't like the idea of a 4k mid engine car though. McLearen has done better than that and so can GM, hopefully at a 75 percent price point around 140 k similar to current ZR-1 That would be a raging bargain IMHO for the level of performance.
Last edited by Rkreigh; 12-06-2018 at 06:18 AM.
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skank (12-06-2018)
12-06-2018, 08:05 AM
#146
Le Mans Master
love to see it but I don't think it's feasible from a cost perspective those manifolds cost a pretty penny I think they will look to go turbos which changes the manifolds likely back to cast iron to hold the EGTs
Based on the cad, they looked like swoopy tube manifods but I think that was the downstream plumbing and we'll see short stubby high flow manifolds with the turbos snugged up to the block. Possibly a waste gate that opens up on cold start to help cat light off temps for cold starts. And some nice twin scroll turbos that light off quick and maintain torq thorught the rev range.
Engine variants seem to be clearing up
a hot rod LT1 sneaking up over 500, a vettilac 4.2 TT, and the mauler 5.5 TT I'll have that.
I don't like the idea of a 4k mid engine car though. McLearen has done better than that and so can GM, hopefully at a 75 percent price point around 140 k similar to current ZR-1 That would be a raging bargain IMHO for the level of performance.
Based on the cad, they looked like swoopy tube manifods but I think that was the downstream plumbing and we'll see short stubby high flow manifolds with the turbos snugged up to the block. Possibly a waste gate that opens up on cold start to help cat light off temps for cold starts. And some nice twin scroll turbos that light off quick and maintain torq thorught the rev range.
Engine variants seem to be clearing up
a hot rod LT1 sneaking up over 500, a vettilac 4.2 TT, and the mauler 5.5 TT I'll have that.
I don't like the idea of a 4k mid engine car though. McLearen has done better than that and so can GM, hopefully at a 75 percent price point around 140 k similar to current ZR-1 That would be a raging bargain IMHO for the level of performance.
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Shaka (12-06-2018)
12-15-2018, 05:46 AM
#147
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
After viewing the below video of the Lear Corporation which builds the seats for the C7 generation of the Corvette it now appears the C8 ZORA will also get Lear seats. Highly regarded forum member vetteb_69C has indicated that Lear most likely is the seat vendor. This is going on the list.
Since the C7 Corvette have Lear seats it only makes sense to use them again on the ZORA. Here is a video showing them making seats for not only Corvette but also Ferrari, Maserati, Lamborghini, Porsche, Audi, and others. Take a look at the white seat at the :35 second mark. I do believe the pass throughs appear to have the same shape as the key fobs. The seats could definitely be designed with that Key Fob shape for the ZORA seats. We shall see, as that is a consistent design technique of the Corvette Design Team.
http://lear.com
Since the C7 Corvette have Lear seats it only makes sense to use them again on the ZORA. Here is a video showing them making seats for not only Corvette but also Ferrari, Maserati, Lamborghini, Porsche, Audi, and others. Take a look at the white seat at the :35 second mark. I do believe the pass throughs appear to have the same shape as the key fobs. The seats could definitely be designed with that Key Fob shape for the ZORA seats. We shall see, as that is a consistent design technique of the Corvette Design Team.
Last edited by skank; 12-15-2018 at 05:49 AM.
12-15-2018, 06:10 AM
#148
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
GM Authority has an article out indicating a delay of the C8 ZORA because of an electrical redesign and reengineered system. A 48V system would most likely be the solution to the large use of electrically controlled components.
Evidently, they were possibly testing the top hp model with the front wheel hub electric motors in the AWD model. A 48V electrical system is way more efficient and reliable than the 12V system in regular cars. They are now adding the 48V system to all models of the new Zora since there are more electrically controlled parts than ever before (throttle by wire, brake by wire, clutch by wire, etc.). A 48V systems allows smaller copper cable bundling and switchgear that is smaller and reacts faster than the traditional 12V system. 48V is the next step in technology that electric cars use. Just advancing the tech so this will go on the list.
Evidently, they were possibly testing the top hp model with the front wheel hub electric motors in the AWD model. A 48V electrical system is way more efficient and reliable than the 12V system in regular cars. They are now adding the 48V system to all models of the new Zora since there are more electrically controlled parts than ever before (throttle by wire, brake by wire, clutch by wire, etc.). A 48V systems allows smaller copper cable bundling and switchgear that is smaller and reacts faster than the traditional 12V system. 48V is the next step in technology that electric cars use. Just advancing the tech so this will go on the list.
Last edited by skank; 12-15-2018 at 06:31 AM.
12-15-2018, 01:03 PM
#149
Safety Car
GM Authority has an article out indicating a delay of the C8 ZORA because of an electrical redesign and reengineered system. A 48V system would most likely be the solution to the large use of electrically controlled components.
Evidently, they were possibly testing the top hp model with the front wheel hub electric motors in the AWD model. A 48V electrical system is way more efficient and reliable than the 12V system in regular cars. They are now adding the 48V system to all models of the new Zora since there are more electrically controlled parts than ever before (throttle by wire, brake by wire, clutch by wire, etc.). A 48V systems allows smaller copper cable bundling and switchgear that is smaller and reacts faster than the traditional 12V system. 48V is the next step in technology that electric cars use. Just advancing the tech so this will go on the list.
Evidently, they were possibly testing the top hp model with the front wheel hub electric motors in the AWD model. A 48V electrical system is way more efficient and reliable than the 12V system in regular cars. They are now adding the 48V system to all models of the new Zora since there are more electrically controlled parts than ever before (throttle by wire, brake by wire, clutch by wire, etc.). A 48V systems allows smaller copper cable bundling and switchgear that is smaller and reacts faster than the traditional 12V system. 48V is the next step in technology that electric cars use. Just advancing the tech so this will go on the list.
12-16-2018, 02:25 PM
#150
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
Elegant has given us a very interesting read on new high tech glass from Corning Company called Gorilla Glass. It is a lightweight laminated, high strength, and UV protected glass that some manufacturers are already using. The new Ford GT, McLaren 720S, and Porsche GT3 RS have already used it. Expect the C8 ME ZORA to possibly use it since others have already done so. Read the article below for a better description. This is going on the list.
https://newsroom.porsche.com/en/tech...018-15798.html
https://newsroom.porsche.com/en/tech...018-15798.html
12-16-2018, 02:27 PM
#151
Le Mans Master
Member Since: Sep 2012
Location: Hagerstown MD
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St. Jude Donor '15-'16,'18
Gorilla Glass is being used in several brands of cell phones.
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John T (12-27-2018)
12-16-2018, 02:49 PM
#152
Safety Car
Still not entirely sure the base car has an LT1 variant. The second ring video has some exhaust trickery going on and you can hear it. The mechanical engine noise and the exhaust note don't match quite right and it is entirely possible they're playing with the sound to hide what's under the hood. I could be wrong though but it sounds a little more exotic than just a hot LT1
That's what tuned 180' headers do. My roadster 400 hp LS1 has 8 into one with a trick resonator and muffler. Sounds like a 458. Your brain can't process what you are seeing and hearing.
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John T (12-27-2018)
12-16-2018, 02:50 PM
#153
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
I've used Southwall Technologies film in Heat Mirror glass in quite a few of my last projects. It is amazing film ! It has a micro thin film of gold on it to get 99% UV protection. It appears Corning might be using this film from Eastman Southwall Technologies XIR films to get their UV rating. It also helps in their STC (Sound Transmission Coefficient ) rating to quiet down the internal environment.
https://www.eastman.com/Brands/XIR/A..._Overview.aspx
https://www.eastman.com/Brands/XIR/A..._Overview.aspx
Last edited by skank; 12-16-2018 at 02:59 PM.
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John T (12-27-2018)
12-17-2018, 09:34 AM
#154
Le Mans Master
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCUv6Bfu1H4 If you weren't watching this video, what engine would you think this Ford had? You would bet against a low revving 427 Ford with a 4 speed Xmission.
That's what tuned 180' headers do. My roadster 400 hp LS1 has 8 into one with a trick resonator and muffler. Sounds like a 458. Your brain can't process what you are seeing and hearing.
That's what tuned 180' headers do. My roadster 400 hp LS1 has 8 into one with a trick resonator and muffler. Sounds like a 458. Your brain can't process what you are seeing and hearing.
The test car at nurburgring doesn't sound as to have true 180 degree headers. I quick listened to a few YouTube videos of people tracking theirs and while on the gas it sounds exotic, on deceleration it still sounds like an ls to me.
Not trying to argue or anything, been around a lot of race crap (offshore) and may or may not be going deaf because of that and a lab explosion. So it is entirely possible I'm hearing things that don't even exist. And how it sounds is one of the more subjective aspects anyway. It wouldn't surprise me if it is LS based, I physically just can't hear it all anymore.
So if that doesn't make sense, I'm not disagreeing. They're playing with something. Also I agree it makes sense to do a high(er) voltage DC system. I have run into 12v problems with installing power inverters in company vehicles. When you need to run sds drills on remote sites it very quickly shows if the charging system is up to snuff or not. That and you have to run 2awg or larger to even have a shot at it working. Not apples to apples but with increased loading you retain the same sized wiring. The only real problem is switching gets expensive. Iirc D.C. tends to jump the gap and arc more than A.C. making the part having to be more resilient to it. Drops in a bucket to me though, not a ME or an ECE. Just a lowly CHE crawling through school right now lol.
12-17-2018, 07:50 PM
#155
Safety Car
The exhaust note wasn't what I was getting at, the physical engine noise, which for whatever reason can be heard (possibly intentionally) doesn't to me sound correct. Exhaust note removed, is to which I was referring.
The test car at nurburgring doesn't sound as to have true 180 degree headers. I quick listened to a few YouTube videos of people tracking theirs and while on the gas it sounds exotic, on deceleration it still sounds like an ls to me.
Not trying to argue or anything, been around a lot of race crap (offshore) and may or may not be going deaf because of that and a lab explosion. So it is entirely possible I'm hearing things that don't even exist. And how it sounds is one of the more subjective aspects anyway. It wouldn't surprise me if it is LS based, I physically just can't hear it all anymore.
So if that doesn't make sense, I'm not disagreeing. They're playing with something. Also I agree it makes sense to do a high(er) voltage DC system. I have run into 12v problems with installing power inverters in company vehicles. When you need to run sds drills on remote sites it very quickly shows if the charging system is up to snuff or not. That and you have to run 2awg or larger to even have a shot at it working. Not apples to apples but with increased loading you retain the same sized wiring. The only real problem is switching gets expensive. Iirc D.C. tends to jump the gap and arc more than A.C. making the part having to be more resilient to it. Drops in a bucket to me though, not a ME or an ECE. Just a lowly CHE crawling through school right now lol.
The test car at nurburgring doesn't sound as to have true 180 degree headers. I quick listened to a few YouTube videos of people tracking theirs and while on the gas it sounds exotic, on deceleration it still sounds like an ls to me.
Not trying to argue or anything, been around a lot of race crap (offshore) and may or may not be going deaf because of that and a lab explosion. So it is entirely possible I'm hearing things that don't even exist. And how it sounds is one of the more subjective aspects anyway. It wouldn't surprise me if it is LS based, I physically just can't hear it all anymore.
So if that doesn't make sense, I'm not disagreeing. They're playing with something. Also I agree it makes sense to do a high(er) voltage DC system. I have run into 12v problems with installing power inverters in company vehicles. When you need to run sds drills on remote sites it very quickly shows if the charging system is up to snuff or not. That and you have to run 2awg or larger to even have a shot at it working. Not apples to apples but with increased loading you retain the same sized wiring. The only real problem is switching gets expensive. Iirc D.C. tends to jump the gap and arc more than A.C. making the part having to be more resilient to it. Drops in a bucket to me though, not a ME or an ECE. Just a lowly CHE crawling through school right now lol.
I'm just saying, exhaust design, which can include headers and turbos, makes a huge difference in sound. Resonators can actually amplify internal mechanical sounds. A F458 and a 488 sound very different. Way back in the 60s, I watched Phil Hill race the Dino F1 Ferrari. The LeMans car had an identical engine albeit detuned. You just wouldn't believe the difference in sound, just because of the exhaust system. Even though the LeMans car was detuned, it had more HP. I actually heard that 66 Ford GT 40 down the Mulsanne. At shut down, it crackelled like the P4 Ferraris. I can still hear it. It was as glorious as the Ferrari. That Ford 427 engine came directly out of the Holman Moody 66 Galaxie Grand National stock car. The difference in sound was mind boggling. The FIA made the F1 cars sound better in 2018 over 2017. Fans were complaining. What are you doing at school?
12-17-2018, 08:22 PM
#156
Le Mans Master
I enjoy your very sensible posts. I doubt it has 180' headers. No space for them. Maybe it is a LS engine? The C8 has a transverse muffler like a Porsche. It is tuned for sound as well as performance.
I'm just saying, exhaust design, which can include headers and turbos, makes a huge difference in sound. Resonators can actually amplify internal mechanical sounds. A F458 and a 488 sound very different. Way back in the 60s, I watched Phil Hill race the Dino F1 Ferrari. The LeMans car had an identical engine albeit detuned. You just wouldn't believe the difference in sound, just because of the exhaust system. Even though the LeMans car was detuned, it had more HP. I actually heard that 66 Ford GT 40 down the Mulsanne. At shut down, it crackelled like the P4 Ferraris. I can still hear it. It was as glorious as the Ferrari. That Ford 427 engine came directly out of the Holman Moody 66 Galaxie Grand National stock car. The difference in sound was mind boggling. The FIA made the F1 cars sound better in 2018 over 2017. Fans were complaining. What are you doing at school?
I'm just saying, exhaust design, which can include headers and turbos, makes a huge difference in sound. Resonators can actually amplify internal mechanical sounds. A F458 and a 488 sound very different. Way back in the 60s, I watched Phil Hill race the Dino F1 Ferrari. The LeMans car had an identical engine albeit detuned. You just wouldn't believe the difference in sound, just because of the exhaust system. Even though the LeMans car was detuned, it had more HP. I actually heard that 66 Ford GT 40 down the Mulsanne. At shut down, it crackelled like the P4 Ferraris. I can still hear it. It was as glorious as the Ferrari. That Ford 427 engine came directly out of the Holman Moody 66 Galaxie Grand National stock car. The difference in sound was mind boggling. The FIA made the F1 cars sound better in 2018 over 2017. Fans were complaining. What are you doing at school?
And I agree, it's amazing how much exhaust can change the sound. You sync up those pulses just right and you have something truly amazing. I spent quite a bit of time searching for the right sound for my car. It sounded good with whatever flowmaster style no name mufflers were on it but they droned like hell and rotted out not terribly long after we got it. Then I did a full cat back with a magnaflow cat and factory style mufflers... while it sounded good, it was way too quiet. Then I spent around 2 years listening to various YouTube videos and ultimately picked up some muffler eliminator tips. Basically they're glasspacks but have a much deeper tone than your normal glass pack. To me I wanted the perfect blend of old school muscle and modern burble and I nailed what I wanted being honest. Its loud enough, vibrates the garage when you rev it, has the nice popping on down shifts and the sweet rasp when you get on it. Overpasses are great and everyone compliments me on the sound. It fits the car well imo. Just giving an example of how character is derived from sound. Perception drives what you see as reality I suppose.
As for school, I'm currently finishing undergrad. I was supposed to graduate this spring but I may have made a few mistakes that I would rather not get into at the moment. I have some minor concentrations in polymer science, fluid mixing and, after next semester, process safety. Those go along with the core fluid mechanics, thermodynamics I and II, processes in fluid transport, and reaction engineering among other things.
Also the university has a fellowship program for advanced pavement engineering systems (and testing) and that is what I currently do. We're DOT and DOD contracted (well on some of the projects I've worked on anyway) so I'm technically not allowed to talk about too much. I signed a non-disclosure agreement when I started and since most of it isn't classified that's that however I've also been in meetings where we were locked in a room to discuss project data so there is some pretty fun stuff going on as well.
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Shaka (12-17-2018)
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skank (12-28-2018)
12-27-2018, 06:58 PM
#158
Banned Scam/Spammer
Why are you reposting info that has been posted here multiple times? Also, what does the rest of your post mean? I don't understand what a bunch of random numbers and words with question marks and exclamation points mean without any real context associated with it. Please write a coherent sentence like everyone else.
12-28-2018, 12:03 PM
#160
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
Thanks to jagamajajaran for exposing the C8 ZORA coming with power swinging opening doors according to a GM patent application for a power opening door. While some might think it's a option I tend to think it might be necessary considering the purported upswing Swan style doors that ltomn reported a while back. Realizing the weight of the door and inclination that the door is swinging up to, it might be required. It's going on the list.
https://www.midenginecorvetteforum.c...er-door-patent
https://www.midenginecorvetteforum.c...er-door-patent