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I do like the design of Camaro tailights. They look like two tailights, yet are one continuous piece. Yes, change their shape and design, but keep the overall sleek and modern appearance, and they would be very nice on the ME.
I liked the C7’s taillights from the outset, but like many who have posted here who still love their C7’s, I want the ME to look completely different from the C7 — including its taillights.
Is there a front fender air vent behind the front wheel that guides air to the side scoop?
Perish that thought and no. Now pay attention. Look carefully at these CFD files and let the information guide your thoughts. Red is the highest pressure, dark blue is the lowest. Airflow is poor down the side of the car, any car. Especially behind the front wheel. Any separation is parasitic drag. (Pale blue, pale green, light brown). There are ways to energize this boundary layer separation. Vortex generators, dive planes, dams, shelves,splitters, airflow conditioners, etc.
The side vent in ME sports cars is usually used for secondary type cooling needs unless it sticks way out into the wind or where ever it is red. Most cases dating back to the 60s, the flow into the side vent is augmented by a very low pressure region at the rear of the car which sucks. IE. Gearbox, differential and ediff clutch packs, brakes and airbox intake which is sucked into the engine.
ME airbox intake is usually place behind the side glass or on top of the roof. Front engined cars have everything near the engine . Turbo intercoolers must be as close to the engine as possible to reduce throttle lag. It is placed between the turbine inlet and the airbox in the shortest possible distance. How do you cool it? Big problem. Hot air can't expand too much. Air to coolant is popular like on the C8 but it is still inadequate..
Primary cooling: IE: engine fluids is usually up front unless you can find space close to the engine. This requires some creative plumbing. You can't have hot stuff anywhere around aero stuff.
The huge shelf on the sill above the side splitter effectively energizes the boundary layer down the side.
The high HP C8 will be a sight to see after they address cooling needs.
Not sure why we should perish the thought of a vent behind the front wheels. Mclaren Senna , LaFerrari and Ferarri FXX seem to have this feature. I do appreciate the info and insight.
No doubt many here know better than me but based on existing cars and how they solved aero and cooling issues I see no problem in how the ME will address these issues based on what we have seen so far. We must make some assumptions that there will be additional shaping and forming of surfaces to optimize and direct air efficiently but nothing the GM team can't handle I am sure. More than one way to skin a cat ...as they used to say.
For the bottom of the side scoop ledge, We do not know what the door form is yet so a larger- higher ledge similar to the LaFerrari is possible. A front wheel vent would also set up a similar architecture as the LaFerrari and FXX so not sure why this would be bad or not work.
Note the images below. Based on the known and presumed inlets and outlets on the ME,there seems to be adequate cooling. If we presume that there seems to be between 9 and 12 air intakes (BLUE) and 6 outlets (RED) not including the wheel well vents.
Seems like the air inlets can be designated for different cooling needs and they could well be directing/vectoring surfaces to help guide the airflow.
If you compare the location and placement of the inlets and outlets on the Ferrari, Bugatti and Mclaren, you see very similar placement and locations. No reason I can see that modifying these builds to suit the shape of the C8ME is not possible or practical.
Since we do not know yet how big or what shape the rear fender top inlet is or IF there truly is a side Q window inlet we are left to speculate.
Last edited by firstvettesoon; 03-02-2018 at 05:02 PM.
Perish that thought and no. Now pay attention. Look carefully at these CFD files and let the information guide your thoughts. Red is the highest pressure, dark blue is the lowest. Airflow is poor down the side of the car, any car. Especially behind the front wheel. Any separation is parasitic drag. (Pale blue, pale green, light brown). There are ways to energize this boundary layer separation. Vortex generators, dive planes, dams, shelves,splitters, airflow conditioners, etc.
The side vent in ME sports cars is usually used for secondary type cooling needs unless it sticks way out into the wind or where ever it is red. Most cases dating back to the 60s, the flow into the side vent is augmented by a very low pressure region at the rear of the car which sucks. IE. Gearbox, differential and ediff clutch packs, brakes and airbox intake which is sucked into the engine.
ME airbox intake is usually place behind the side glass or on top of the roof. Front engined cars have everything near the engine . Turbo intercoolers must be as close to the engine as possible to reduce throttle lag. It is placed between the turbine inlet and the airbox in the shortest possible distance. How do you cool it? Big problem. Hot air can't expand too much. Air to coolant is popular like on the C8 but it is still inadequate..
Primary cooling: IE: engine fluids is usually up front unless you can find space close to the engine. This requires some creative plumbing. You can't have hot stuff anywhere around aero stuff.
The huge shelf on the sill above the side splitter effectively energizes the boundary layer down the side.
The high HP C8 will be a sight to see after they address cooling needs.
Depends on the design of the intercooler. Turbo's are not automaticly assigned air to air heat exchangers in the front of the car.
My Roots blower on my Mercedes has an air to air heat exchanger located in front of the engine coolant radiator, like most turbo's have. Yet most Root's blowers have a air to liquid intercooler combined with a liquid to air remote heat exchanger, like the C6 ZR1 and C7 Z06.
A turbo mounted at the rear of the mid engine car can also have a air to liquid intercooler combined with a liquid to air hat exchanger that is located in a remote location, either behind the rear quarter panel scoop or behind the grille in front of the car. The liquid coolant lines have nothing to do with the amount of turbo lag.
After watching the incredible amount of time and effort you have put it into these renderings, I think the entire forum needs to buy you a beer...or 3.
Truly epic, my friend.
I have to admit what you have done seems to match the camoed cars pretty close.
Wow. Really? Now your side view makes sense but not sure I like it... But you said it looked cool so I'll believe. Also makes the spy pics and video showing LEDs accurate.
...well... it sorta matches... backwards
I agree FVS that the key word regarding the LED’s is backwards. I posted this same thought a couple of weeks ago, that it was/is, IMO, a deliberate GM mis-direction, e.g., their installing the IVERS’ taillights “side to side reversed” to throw us off.
I hope also that they look much better in real life than just later reversed. IMO the above Camaro taillights above look great, looking far, far better than the ME’s large “dot” LED’s. Again, more of GM’s deliberate playing with us (which I totally would understand)?
GReat art work in the c8 renditions yet I believe the top of the rear quarter (just behind the B pillar and down the fender a bit) will have greater impact on air intakes to feed the engine.
That location is far superior to air intake than the lower side scoop we are being fooled into believing...that lower rear quarter panel is what we were taught to believe is the best location for air intake but it seems the upper portion of the rear quarter near the b pillar is superior for function as shown by ferraris 488.
We may have both but I can't see Chevrolet leaving that excellent air intake area on the area closer to the b pillar alone as your excellent renderings show.
I tend to think that area closer to the b pillar will in the final rendering have huge air intakes
Thanks for the great work.
Last edited by JerriVette; 03-03-2018 at 08:20 AM.
Todays Chicago Sun Times said the Detroit Auto Show might be moved from January 2019 to October 2018. If this happens, will GM have the new C8 at the show in October?
Todays Chicago Sun Times said the Detroit Auto Show might be moved from January 2019 to October 2018. If this happens, will GM have the new C8 at the show in October?
It will not happen until 2020---
>>>Any change would happen after the 2019 auto show, which is set for Jan. 14-27.
Thanks DebRedZR1. I did further investigating, and what the Chicago Sun Times is reporting is dead wrong. Here are two accurate sites, [B]confirming the NAIAS date move to October, IF there is a move at all, would not be before calendar year 2020, so this possible change in the show’s date will not have any effect on the ME’s reveal.
Organizers of Detroit’s big auto show are talking about moving it from frigid January to October starting as early as 2020. North American International Auto Show spokesman Max Muncey says a schedule change is being considered but is not final.
Now that we have gotten inaccurate information out of the way, just 315 days until the ME’s reveal on January 12, 2019. Think the identical Wilson Center reveal location as for the 1.13.1.3 Stingray reveal — and similarly before even the NAIAS charity event and the press days — though of course the ME will also be “secondarily revealed” at the NAIAS Press Days and be there the rest of the show.
GReat art work in the c8 renditions yet I believe the top of the rear quarter (just behind the B pillar and down the fender a bit) will have greater impact on air intakes to feed the engine.
That location is far superior to air intake than the lower side scoop we are being fooled into believing...that lower rear quarter panel is what we were taught to believe is the best location for air intake but it seems the upper portion of the rear quarter near the b pillar is superior for function as shown by ferraris 488.
We may have both but I can't see Chevrolet leaving that excellent air intake area on the area closer to the b pillar alone as your excellent renderings show.
I tend to think that area closer to the b pillar will in the final rendering have huge air intakes
Thanks for the great work.
I agree with everything you said. There is certainly some sort of intake in the top of the rear fender as seen in the CADs and since c7 team took a lot of time to perfect those intakes I suspect the ones on the ME will be even better. If there is a rear Q window intake as well, there should be ample air available.
I agree about the 488 upper intake as shown in the drawing which is for the engine and sits very near where the rear fender inlet on the ME would be so anything around that size should suffice. Also, the Mclaren 720 has that clever fender top inlet that is hidden from the side. I do like how it follows around to the rear to direct the air. Maybe ME will have something like this as well?
C7pimp has not commented on these inlets or the spoiler ...yet
I tend to think those rear fender top inlets will be substantial and important and have sculpted surfaces in the body to help guide the air.
Re the Z06 fender intake (and later for the GS and the ZR1):
Originally Posted by Tadge — speaking to Kirk during 2013
If we can’t get us 50% more CFM, we will not have a Z06.
That extra volume, which Kirk clearly successfully did by changing from the Stingray’s flat rear fender intake duct to the above NACA duct, was critical for required additional cooling of the Z06’s heat exchangers in the rear corners of the car.
We have not yet seen that part of the ME without camo. Perhaps, especially as we get to the ZORA model, that NACA duct will similarly grow as it has done during the C7 evolution.
Perhaps this could be only C7 exterior part shared with the ME? [I have grown to like that look, and hope that it does.]
03-02-2018, 01:41 PM
