It's Quite Obvious That The C7 Was Designed To Transition Into The Mid Engine Design.
#21
Le Mans Master
#22
Melting Slicks
I read this book cover to cover - its literally the "story" of the C7 from initial thoughts, to GM not making the Corvette, to designing the C7 to production lines... Absolutely an amazing book!
#23
Race Director
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St. Jude Donor '16-'17,'22,'24
Johan was the guy responsible for pushing a 2 seater Cadillac, mid-engine sports car and while he was around, it seemed like he might get his way. But he was dismissed (some would say fired) second quarter of this year. If you look at Cadillac's direction, you can see why. Sales are down double digits and what does Cadillac have in the hopper for 2019?, another high priced luxury sedan, the CT8. While the rest of the world like Lexus is introducing new SUVs and CUVs, Cadillac is following the Genesis with a high priced, sedan that won't sell (Genesis sales were bad but this year they're in the toilet). Mary apparently had enough of the mis-direction of Johan and told him to clean out his desk (one of her best moves). Now Cadillac is focused on it's core business, more SUVs/ CUVs the vehicles that people want.
I wouldn't rule out a Me-Too, 2 seater either the ME car or do the same move GM did with the C5 and turn over the C7 to Cadillac letting them sell a more traditional front engine sports car (this time with a correct engine, not an outdated Northstar). But being the leader of the new Halo car, especially with Cadillac's track record for failure with 2 seater cars, no way, Not going to happen. It's nothing personal, it's just business.
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JoesC5 (09-07-2018)
#24
Team Owner
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St. Jude Donor '15
"In honor of jpee"
You make some very good, historical points re Cadillac and 2-seaters, and esp. the departure of Johan de Nysschen.
#25
She is near perfect almost like the C8.....almost Naturally aspirated no silicone added that's what makes her look so spectacular.
Last edited by C5Driver; 09-07-2018 at 07:50 AM.
#26
Starting with the change from C4 to C5, a mid rear engine proposal was beyond the passion of any one person even if his name was Zora.
Last edited by Kodiak Bear; 09-07-2018 at 11:32 AM. Reason: Spelling
#27
If you believe "All Corvettes Are Red", a big transition occured between the C4 and C5 which was caught up in the financial troubles GM was having and the resulting confusion. In 1992 McLellan was pushing for a mid-rear engine design, while Davis and Spielman were pushing for a mid-front design with the transaxel in the rear. They alleged that this would give many of the benefits of a mid-rear design while maintaining the traditional Corvette style. Three approaches were underconsideration : momentum archecture - mid-front engine, rear transmissiuon and evoluntionary body style: Mid-engine: and a Stiffer and lighter Corvette, For various reasons the momentum archecture was chosen. The reason that's interesting is that the mid rear engined design made it to the strategic direction sellection process. An SAE paper 970089 picks up the chassis architedture story for the C5, which was designated by GM as the "C5 perimeter frame/structural tunnel uniframe". It;'s a backbone design with a perimeter. This same frame evolved into the C7 so called space frame SAE paper 2005-01-0466. I'm hard put to justify the name space frame for the evolved C5 frame. However, the C7 chassis is a very developed version of the original C5 with a lot of materials chnages as well as design changes. Never the less, it appears that at each generation change, C4 to C5 to C6 to C7, a mid design was at least a serious paper study and in some cases a viable choice for production. The weakest is probably the C5 to C6 transition but that's just my guess.
Starting with the change from C4 to C5, a mid rear engine proposal was beyond the passion of any one person even if his name was Zora.
Starting with the change from C4 to C5, a mid rear engine proposal was beyond the passion of any one person even if his name was Zora.
Last edited by C5Driver; 09-07-2018 at 12:04 PM.
#28
Team Owner
If you believe "All Corvettes Are Red", a big transition occured between the C4 and C5 which was caught up in the financial troubles GM was having and the resulting confusion. In 1992 McLellan was pushing for a mid-rear engine design, while Davis and Spielman were pushing for a mid-front design with the transaxel in the rear. They alleged that this would give many of the benefits of a mid-rear design while maintaining the traditional Corvette style. Three approaches were underconsideration : momentum archecture - mid-front engine, rear transmissiuon and evoluntionary body style: Mid-engine: and a Stiffer and lighter Corvette, For various reasons the momentum archecture was chosen. The reason that's interesting is that the mid rear engined design made it to the strategic direction sellection process. An SAE paper 970089 picks up the chassis architedture story for the C5, which was designated by GM as the "C5 perimeter frame/structural tunnel uniframe". It;'s a backbone design with a perimeter. This same frame evolved into the C7 so called space frame SAE paper 2005-01-0466. I'm hard put to justify the name space frame for the evolved C5 frame. However, the C7 chassis is a very developed version of the original C5 with a lot of materials chnages as well as design changes. Never the less, it appears that at each generation change, C4 to C5 to C6 to C7, a mid design was at least a serious paper study and in some cases a viable choice for production. The weakest is probably the C5 to C6 transition but that's just my guess.
Starting with the change from C4 to C5, a mid rear engine proposal was beyond the passion of any one person even if his name was Zora.
Starting with the change from C4 to C5, a mid rear engine proposal was beyond the passion of any one person even if his name was Zora.
2) and 3) were tossed because of high costs. GM was not interested in manufacturing an expensive car that would be out of reach for the average buyer. It took 34 years for 2) to become the 1997 Corvette and 57 years for 3) to become the 2020 Corvette.
#29
It goes all the way back to the late 1950's when GM was evaluating designs for the second generation Corvette(1963-1967). According to a SAE paper by Duntov, three RWD platform designs were considered. 1) A front engine with the transmission mounted to the engine. 2) A front engine with the transmission mounted to the differential(transaxle). 3) A mid engine with a transaxle.
2) and 3) were tossed because of high costs. GM was not interested in manufacturing an expensive car that would be out of reach for the average buyer. It took 34 years for 2) to become the 1997 Corvette and 57 years for 3) to become the 2020 Corvette.
2) and 3) were tossed because of high costs. GM was not interested in manufacturing an expensive car that would be out of reach for the average buyer. It took 34 years for 2) to become the 1997 Corvette and 57 years for 3) to become the 2020 Corvette.
#30
Race Director
Avoiding the argument that the C7 was or wasn't to be ME, it is clearly a statement to the designers that the C7 transitions into the C8 as well as some of you like. I, personally, see a hint, but just a hint, of C7 in there and that is ok with me. GM needs to keep corporate identity with this car, so the similarity is a good on that team of designers.