Mr Triple Black

I see a lot of people saying the car is going to priced incredibly high since it’s a mid engine and it’s going to be on a new tier etc.

Well, we have Porsche Cayman’s, a mid engine sports coupe that’s basically the same cost as a Corvette. Now it’s Porsche not GM so yes build quality in terms of materials might be a little higher but what the C8 lacks in materials it will make up for in power/ability.

Basically, going mid engine doesn’t mean huge increases in price.

C7pimp

Good point. Nobody has thought of any of this yet.

(sarcasm)

Jeff V.

Lotus and Alfa Romeo also make relatively affordable mid engine cars. The Toyota MR2 wasn't exactly a performance benchmark, but it was cheaper than any contemporary Corvette.

DaveFerrari458

There's nothing special about a Cayman's build quality! It's basically the same build quality as a $30K VW. This is not a total bash rather than just a fact! And I am 99.99% sure that GM doesn't have the Cayman in its sight.....much bigger fish in its sight.

NineVettes

Lotus uses a Toyota sourced Camry engine and Alfas appear to be about as reliable (or unreliable) as ever based on some reports. Caymans (now since they have gone to 4 cylinders) sound somewhat like VWs, though they perform very well. IMHO, no competition to the C7 Z.

Before buying my '19 Z, looked hard at 911 Carrera 4S and 911 turbos, about 4 year old models. Could not justify spending more for the much lower powered Carrera, and much-much-much more for the 911 turbos that were built circa 2014.

eyedeekay

smithers

I think some of you all are missing the point being made in the thread.

Many people on this forum seems to think mid engine means the car has to be considerably more expensive. The Cayman/Boxster, MR2, Alfa 4C, etc obviously aren't "targets" for the C8 to compete with, just examples of mid engine cars that don't cost a fortune. There is no real reason that a mid engine Corvette has to cost much more than the current car.

Jeff V.

Exactly. Mid-engine, in and of itself, it no reason for the car to cost a lot.

With that said, it seems every manufacturer is continually trying to push their models up market, which increases costs. There's also the question of whether or not this mid engine car will replace the C7, or live above it. Content and marketing position will drive costs and price much more than the drivetrain layout.

MitchAlsup

There are about 6 major things that are less expensive in a ME car {Torque Tube, Drive Shaft, transaxle versus transmission and differential}
There are about 6 major things that are more expensive in a ME car. {Radiator pipes, A/C pipes, PS pipes}

Overall, it should be close to a wash.

IF only one could snap his fingers and allow the blind to see.............

Suns_PSD

I think there will be one real thing that the Cayman might have over the C8, the manual trans.

bludrm

I don't care if the C8 is competitive with the Cayman. Those cars are way too expensive. If you want to compete with those very expensive cars make sure you order the ZR1 or whatever designation they use for the race model. I want a car that is fun to drive not for racing. Don't drive the base price up. Old guy (like me) with a lot of money (not me) can buy performance if they want it but if the base price goes too high there will be many former Corvette owners.

The HACK

I beg to DIFFER. The BASE Cayman is a 4 cylinder flat 4 turbo. The Alfa 4C is a 4 cylinder inline 4. The Lotus Elise is a 4 cylinder inline 4. All the examples cited has a tremendous packaging advantage from a rear mounted mid-engine perspective, as the flat 4 is TINY by comparison, and both of the inline 4 can be transverse mounted to save a ton of space in comparison to a V8. The amount of engineering, material, hardware, and bracing overall for any of the "affordable" ME cars in these examples, are far less than the cost it would take to put a V8 behind the driver in a Corvette. Plus the 4C, MR2, and Lotus examples are cars that are heavily de-contented compared to a Corvette. These are no frills, zero options car meant only for performance driving applications, therefore COST to build a power seat with power tilting and telescoping steering wheel, 12 speaker infotainment systems, with active ventilated seats, full leather dash, power adjusting mirrors, hood and hatch shocks...etc, all except the Cayman on this list have all these cost removed.

Even the base Cayman is pretty devoid of creature comforts. You tick off a few options that would make it equivalent to a base non-Z51 Stingray and the price on the Cayman (not the S, the BASE Cayman) shoots up to $71K. You option it out to the same as what a typically packaged, 2LT Z51 (performance exhaust, PACM, automatic transmission...etc) and you're staring at a $80K+ car that's down 160 HP in comparison.

And did I mention that the flat 4 in the Cayman is much MUCH easier to package for a Mid Engine application? Much easier to cool? Far less need for spacing, material, ENGINEERING to get it stuffed behind the driver's seat and in front of the rear axle?

The challenge to put a V8, even if it's a push-rod to keep the engine nice and low, behind the driver, is going to cost significantly more than that of a simple 4 cylinder IMO. Size, material, bracing, space, cooling...etc goes up exponentially as cylinder count increases. If anyone here expects a mid engine Corvette to be made for the same price as some of these cars cited above, the only way it's possible is if it came with 4 CYLINDER only.

The HACK

I dunno about that. There are significant packaging constraints to put an engine behind the driver. There's significantly less space for engine cooling, therefore your radiator will have to be either more efficient, or significantly larger. There are bracing issues with the engine, transmission, diff, and driveshafts ALL sitting on the same subframe. The space constraints in the engine bay means EVERY single component needs to fit neatly and you can't share parts across platforms. Radiator, reservoirs, fuel tank, brake vacuum cylinder, oil pump and reservoir, oil sump, EVERYTHING inside the engine compartment is likely unique to the ME layout, so based strictly on economy of scale, you can't expect the cost to put the engine behind the driver to be the same as in front, because the majority of what's in front of the driver on a front engine design can be repurposed from OTHER front engine cars in your line-up.

Especially if the engine itself is shared across platform, an engine designed to be used up front is likely going to have some significant tweaks to make it fit in the back (i.e. transverse mount vs. longitudal mount if driving same rear wheels). At some point you might as well consider bespoke engines, and bespoke engines cost $$$, especially on a lower production volume car like the Corvette.

I think the first 7 generation of Corvettes can be made relatively affordable, because it shares the engine with HIGH volume cars and truck that GM also produces. IF they have to make a bespoke engine for the C8 only, it ain't going to be cheap. And if they DON'T make a bespoke engine for the C8 only, the cost to fit a common, high volume engine designed for front engine applications fit in a mid engine application is not going to be CHEAP either.

smithers

What extra engineering, bracing, and material is needed in a mid engine V8 platform that isn't already done for a front engine car? I know it will be needed in the back of the car, but a lot of it will be replacing what isn't in the front anymore. If they are designing a mid engine platform from scratch, they would be doing all of that same work and adding similar stuff to a front engine platform they would design from scratch.

I'm not trying to be difficult, just trying to learn something that I could very well be clueless about.

smithers

That is definitely not the case at all. People have put engines originally designed for front engine cars into the back mid engine kit cars for decades now. In a mid engine car there isn't anything special about the engine itself. The frame just needs to have a place for motor mounts in the right location. The leaked CAD images appear to show an LT1 in the car.

AORoads

True Porsche-ofiles won't even admit to the very affordable Porsche 914 and 914-6....

MitchAlsup

Its pretty clear you have never been under a proper mid-engined car.

First of all, the oil pump is inside the engine (LT1) and there is no particular reason the dry sump of the Z51 can't be used in the ME.
Secondly, there is likely more volume behind the driver than in front to mount and cool an engine.
Certainly the steering rack is vastly easier to route without an engine sitting in the way.
I don't think the C7 fuel tank is used in any other GM platform.
So, it sounds like you threw up a lot of things; few of which may turn out to be true.

RJ-92

BIG Dave

Mr Triple Black