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Is there demand for a mid-engine Corvette?

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Is there demand for a mid-engine Corvette?

Old 11-29-2018, 08:01 PM
  #241  
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Originally Posted by JoesC5 View Post
and twice a year the county runs a street sweeper on the streets in my subdivision.
Just funnin' ya, but, seriously -- isn't that like washing your car 2X.year? I mean, why bother at all? Do you guys never get rain that washes that stuff down the storm sewers anyway?
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Old 11-29-2018, 08:05 PM
  #242  
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In a lot of states that gas tax just goes into the general operating fund, not for highway construction/maintenance.
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Old 11-29-2018, 08:09 PM
  #243  
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Originally Posted by Atomic Fred View Post
Not when it completely outperforms the competition. Example -- a Z51-equiped Vette is about the same price as a stripper 718, I believe. It offers way more performance to the consumer, really does not suffer much in terms of quality and content, and so does not lose. If somehow GM can build a $170K sports car that measurably outperforms the similarly priced Porsche, and is recognizably better in percieved quality than lesser Vettes, it also will not lose.

I still would not put it past GM to have a multi-model Vette strategy unfolding before us over the next 18-24 months. If they have made the business case AND can execute (big "ifs" I know) it would be really cool, don't you think?
What? You lose plenty. Quality and content are easily lost. The interior in the 718 is far superior. Also, the standard interor kit comes with plenty of bells and whistles already built in. In fact, the build quality of the whole car is better. It's not a bang for your buck comparison, and it never will be. If you want a decent steak for cheap, go to Outback. If you want higher quality, you have to go to Ruth Chris. Is paying triple for a steak that is arguably only 10%-20% better worth it? That's up to the user to decide based on what's important to them. Yes the corvette has more power, yes it may go around a corner faster, but there is so much more to what makes a car great than a few numbers that won't matter when the next fast car comes along.
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Old 11-29-2018, 08:16 PM
  #244  
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Originally Posted by JerryU View Post
Yep, Norway has put much of that North Sea money they made and "saved it for the people." They do have enough for folks retiring! Not like us!
Actually Venezuela and Nigeria have more oil reserves but those countries are so corrupt that all the wealth is wasted. Corruption in Norway is far less than the U.S.
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Old 11-29-2018, 08:27 PM
  #245  
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Originally Posted by Atari_Prime View Post
What? You lose plenty. Quality and content are easily lost. The interior in the 718 is far superior. Also, the standard interor kit comes with plenty of bells and whistles already built in. In fact, the build quality of the whole car is better. It's not a bang for your buck comparison, and it never will be. If you want a decent steak for cheap, go to Outback. If you want higher quality, you have to go to Ruth Chris. Is paying triple for a steak that is arguably only 10%-20% better worth it? That's up to the user to decide based on what's important to them. Yes the corvette has more power, yes it may go around a corner faster, but there is so much more to what makes a car great than a few numbers that won't matter when the next fast car comes along.
What's so superior about this interior over a C7?



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Old 11-29-2018, 08:30 PM
  #246  
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Originally Posted by pdiddy972 View Post


What's so superior about this interior over a C7?



The little clock up on the dashboard. Gotta have that!
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Old 11-30-2018, 12:28 AM
  #247  
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It's a sea of plastic. And it probably doesn't even have Android Auto or Apple Carplay integration. Or PDR. Or magnetic shocks.
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Old 11-30-2018, 12:41 AM
  #248  
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Originally Posted by JerryU View Post
Yep, Norway has put much of that North Sea money they made and "saved it for the people." They do have enough for folks retiring! Not like us!
Actually, Norway is selling(exporting) a lot of their oil and use the money they receive to pay for the "bribes" so their citizens can afford the Tesla's(and other EV's) that Norway mandates that they buy.

A lot of irony in that they sell dirty oil to pay for clean electric vehicles. Kind of like California importing electricity produced from burning coal(in surrounding states) so they can mandate their citizens buy clean electric cars. Oh, the irony.

Last edited by JoesC5; 11-30-2018 at 12:54 AM.
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Old 11-30-2018, 12:49 AM
  #249  
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Originally Posted by Atomic Fred View Post
Just funnin' ya, but, seriously -- isn't that like washing your car 2X.year? I mean, why bother at all? Do you guys never get rain that washes that stuff down the storm sewers anyway?
We get more ice than snow and they spread 1/4" crushed stone(with sharp edges to bite into the ice and get a grip on the tires), so they run sweepers to pick up the crushed stones after the season turns. The crushed stones don't wash away very easy with normal rainfall into the storm sewers.

I'm thankful they do sweep as I have had to have two windshields replaced from those little stones in town, because they don't wash away from rain or melting ice/snow. Hate to have to pay for a new windshield every year.

They are not trying to remove normal dirt..

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Old 11-30-2018, 06:59 AM
  #250  
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Originally Posted by Sin City View Post
I think the engineers have stated that the C7 is about as far as you can put the limits of a Front Engine car. So, to take the next step it has to be mid engine or you are just going no where better than before.
That's what the engineers say publicly. You need to remember that the engineers are told what they can say by the marketing department. This holds true regardless of what product is being sold. There are certainly areas to improve on the corvette, the most obvious one being undercarriage aerodynamics. For all-out performance on the track however, a mid-engine layout is a nice place to start.

Returning to the OP's question though, I'm divided.
Some have kept going on about mid-engine as if that would be the magical solution to all corvette-related problems though in many cases it just seems to be a case of F-car envy. If track performance and bragging rights are important factors then mid-engine is not a bad decision at the moment. That said, it's apparent that most drivers aren't up to the standards of the cars and that this has been the case for a very long time.
There are those, however, who aren't looking at corvettes as a lower-priced F-car alternative. Those who look at corvettes because they are corvettes. Those who actively buy a corvette instead of a P-car or F-car. Those who couldn't care less about ultimate track performance (but still enjoy seeing a corvette keep up with far more expensive alternatives). Those who buy a corvette for similar reasons why some people buy a porsche 911. Just like there are people who opt for a Ferrari F12tdf over a 488.

The question is what is going to lose them more customers.
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Old 11-30-2018, 11:17 AM
  #251  
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Originally Posted by JoesC5 View Post
Actually, Norway is selling(exporting) a lot of their oil and use the money they receive to pay for the "bribes" so their citizens can afford the Tesla's(and other EV's) that Norway mandates that they buy. A lot of irony in that they sell dirty oil to pay for clean electric vehicles..
Norway wants clean air. I don't find that ironic. Choking on pollution is not my idea of fun.
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Old 11-30-2018, 02:17 PM
  #252  
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Originally Posted by PCMIII View Post
Norway wants clean air. I don't find that ironic. Choking on pollution is not my idea of fun.
Then you believe it's okay to have your neighbor breath dirty air so you can breath clean air at your neighbor's expense? That's hypocritical, don't you think?

If Norway is so concerned about clean air, then why don't they stop selling dirty oil to their neighbors. It's called "man made GLOBAL warning, I believe, not "man made Norway warming".. Shut down their oil industry and make their citizens pony up the full price of an EV that the mandate their citizens to buy, or tax themselves to pay for the subsidies required in order for their "not so rich" citizens need to have in order that they can purchase the expensive Tesla's.

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Old 11-30-2018, 02:21 PM
  #253  
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Originally Posted by JoesC5 View Post
Then you believe it's okay to have your neighbor breath dirty air so you can breath clean air at your neighbor's expense? That's hypocritical, don't you think?

If Norway is so concerned about clean air, then why don't they stop selling dirty oil to their neighbors. It's called "man made GLOBAL warning, I believe, not "man made Norway warming".. Shut down their oil industry and make their citizens pony up the full price of an EV that the mandate their citizens to buy, or tax themselves to pay for the subsidies required in order for their "not so rich" citizens need to have in order that they can purchase the expensive Tesla's.
Yeah, I think your idea could really work. Why don't you propose it to Norway?
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Old 11-30-2018, 05:46 PM
  #254  
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Originally Posted by Tom73 View Post
In a lot of states that gas tax just goes into the general operating fund, not for highway construction/maintenance.




Not exactly, the federal gas tax goes into the Federal Highway Trust Fund, which is doled out by the Federal Highway Administration, which is part of the US Department of Transportation. The United States federal excise tax on gasoline is 18.4 cents per gallon and 24.4 cents per gallon for diesel fuel. The federal tax was last raised in 1993 and is not indexed to inflation, which increased by a total of 64.6 percent from 1993 until 2015.

That money is dedicated exclusively to Federal highway construction and maintenance (e.g. interstates and US highways). The fact that it has not been raised in 25 years and that it is tied to the gallon as opposed to mileage is the major reason US highways are crumbling. Not only has inflation eaten away at buying power for construction and maintenance, but vehicles are more fuel efficient leaving much less money in the trust fund.

Each state also imposes their own gas tax, and in some states some of that money might find it's way into the general operating fund, but not true for the Fed portion.

Last edited by Foosh; 11-30-2018 at 05:52 PM.
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Old 11-30-2018, 06:01 PM
  #255  
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Originally Posted by Foosh View Post
Yes, it won't be long before every gasoline and diesel engine left will be turbocharged. It's the only way to go, and turbo technology now is unbelievably good and reliable.
Every engine BMW sells, gas and diesel, is equipped with turbocharging. The 2.0L in my 5 series has 252 HP, 0-60 in just over 6 seconds and gets 34 mpg on the highway. The days of the NA engine is probably going the way of the Dodo bird just like manual trannies.
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Old 12-01-2018, 02:40 PM
  #256  
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Originally Posted by Atari_Prime View Post
What? You lose plenty. Quality and content are easily lost. The interior in the 718 is far superior. Also, the standard interor kit comes with plenty of bells and whistles already built in. In fact, the build quality of the whole car is better. It's not a bang for your buck comparison, and it never will be. If you want a decent steak for cheap, go to Outback. If you want higher quality, you have to go to Ruth Chris. Is paying triple for a steak that is arguably only 10%-20% better worth it? That's up to the user to decide based on what's important to them. Yes the corvette has more power, yes it may go around a corner faster, but there is so much more to what makes a car great than a few numbers that won't matter when the next fast car comes along.
I either missed your point or you missed mine. I obviously understand the tradeoffs. But, in the marketplace, which is what I was talking about, more performance at probably a slight decline in PERCEIVED quality (German stuff breaks too, and the "Porsche tax" makes the "Vette tax" look tiny) has never been a losing proposition for the Vette....
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