Mid engine maintenance cost?
11-02-2018, 04:14 PM
#41
Its always reassuring to know the same mechanic who works on a $15k Cruze will be working on your new $100k + C8. And dont even mention the sales staff. Working their butts off to get the couple with poor credit to buy that Cruze. Thinking buyers that pay for 911s, Lambos and above expect exclustivity for their high prices. The C8 is is a lowly Chevy, dont expect customers to pay Lambo prices for it.
11-02-2018, 04:45 PM
#42
Drifting
Its always reassuring to know the same mechanic who works on a $15k Cruze will be working on your new $100k + C8. And dont even mention the sales staff. Working their butts off to get the couple with poor credit to buy that Cruze. Thinking buyers that pay for 911s, Lambos and above expect exclustivity for their high prices. The C8 is is a lowly Chevy, dont expect customers to pay Lambo prices for it.
11-02-2018, 05:06 PM
#43
Yes, at the bigger dealers who sell a large number, Corvette specialists only work on Corvettes, unless none happen to be in on a particular day.
11-02-2018, 06:53 PM
#44
I don't get it. You all really believe that all the drawbacks of the rear mounted mid engine platform that no other manufacturer knows how to solve, will just magically DISAPPEAR now that GM is building it?
Audi R8. Built by the Volkswagen conglomerate, a company that builds hundreds of millions of cars. Look up how much that car's maintenance cost.
If building rear mounted mid engine cars were as simple as you all seems to suggest, and have ZERO drawbacks and it's all sunshines and unicorns, wouldn't all car manufacturers have moved to this platform long ago? If the ME Corvette is going to cost the same as the FE Corvette, have the same amount of practicality, interior room, weigh same or less, and as easy to service, wouldn't GM have switched to the ME platform last century?
There has to be a reason why the ME platform is not common, or at least, not as common as a FE rear drive, just as rear drive isn't as common as front wheel drive. There are certain draw-backs, compromises, and mechanical engineering hurdles to overcome. And if anyone believes that the new ME C8 is going to have all of the below:
1) Cost the same as the C7
2) Be as practical and have as much usable space as the C7
3) As easy to maintain as a C7
And all the while offer superior handling characteristics?
I'll have what you all are smoking.
Audi R8. Built by the Volkswagen conglomerate, a company that builds hundreds of millions of cars. Look up how much that car's maintenance cost.
If building rear mounted mid engine cars were as simple as you all seems to suggest, and have ZERO drawbacks and it's all sunshines and unicorns, wouldn't all car manufacturers have moved to this platform long ago? If the ME Corvette is going to cost the same as the FE Corvette, have the same amount of practicality, interior room, weigh same or less, and as easy to service, wouldn't GM have switched to the ME platform last century?
There has to be a reason why the ME platform is not common, or at least, not as common as a FE rear drive, just as rear drive isn't as common as front wheel drive. There are certain draw-backs, compromises, and mechanical engineering hurdles to overcome. And if anyone believes that the new ME C8 is going to have all of the below:
1) Cost the same as the C7
2) Be as practical and have as much usable space as the C7
3) As easy to maintain as a C7
And all the while offer superior handling characteristics?
I'll have what you all are smoking.
11-02-2018, 07:11 PM
#45
Melting Slicks
Member Since: Nov 2004
Location: Northcentral, Pennsylvania
Posts: 2,383
Received 135 Likes
on
81 Posts
St. Jude Donor '09-'11
Last edited by Wass; 11-03-2018 at 12:11 PM.
11-02-2018, 09:37 PM
#46
Race Director
Its always reassuring to know the same mechanic who works on a $15k Cruze will be working on your new $100k + C8. And dont even mention the sales staff. Working their butts off to get the couple with poor credit to buy that Cruze. Thinking buyers that pay for 911s, Lambos and above expect exclustivity for their high prices. The C8 is is a lowly Chevy, dont expect customers to pay Lambo prices for it.
11-04-2018, 12:44 AM
#47
I agree. My fieros are very easy to maintain. Even the v6 has 6 inches of space on either side of the engine. Oil changes are easy as any front wheel drive car. Even fieros with modern small block chevys are easy to maintain because the Fiero engineers intended and designed the fiero to take a small block from the get go. MEs are not inherently difficult to maintain it depends on how the manufacturer engineers it. There are many front engine cars that are extremely difficult and expensive to work on as well.
The following 3 users liked this post by formulaWA:
11-04-2018, 03:34 AM
#48
Race Director
My rear mid engine turbo lancia scorpion was actually easier to have serviced than my cousins front engine lancia beta couoe .
relax guys and enjoy the fruits of your labor...
the tight new turn in of rear mid engine vehicles will make you forget all about these made up worries about service.
relax guys and enjoy the fruits of your labor...
the tight new turn in of rear mid engine vehicles will make you forget all about these made up worries about service.
Last edited by JerriVette; 11-04-2018 at 03:40 AM.
The following users liked this post:
Wass (11-04-2018)
11-04-2018, 10:04 AM
#49
Melting Slicks
Else
Wow I had two MR2s first and second generation loved them both. I agree and felt both were very simple to work on. My Audi R8 is a nightmare to work on nothing is easy, changing the plugs was a major pain in the A. The MR2 was easy because it had a small displacement motor with more room, the R8 has a V8 or V10 shoehorned into the rear, this adds complexity and less room. IMO The push-rod motor could be the better option C8 ME which will have less complexity and a motor that has been tested to be very reliable. I still think it will be difficult to work on unless GM creates a modular rear cradle or something to help remove the motor on larger jobs.
R8 engine removal
R8 engine removal
Last edited by fasttoys; 11-04-2018 at 10:10 AM.
The following 3 users liked this post by fasttoys:
11-04-2018, 10:40 AM
#50
Le Mans Master
The Audi R8 engine removal and reinstall video shows how crazy it is. German engineering? What were they thinking? This is absolutely insane! I can't imagine the C8 will be anything this convoluted. That would pretty much destroy the Corvette marque. But again, I haven't seen the C7 fuel gage sending unit replacement videos yet.
The following users liked this post:
ArmchairArchitect (11-04-2018)
11-04-2018, 02:22 PM
#51
Racer
Are the cars become so complex, the designers cannot focus on multiple design criteria? Cannot performance coexist with relatively simple maintenance, and has cost become the least considerable factor. Obviously, the Audi is an example- initial cost and future maintenance are not considerations in the design. Can GM compromise and build a car which is marketable and affordable?
11-04-2018, 06:35 PM
#52
Does GM really care if the C8 is a nightmare to work on? I think they want the ME handling advantage this design will bring. And by making it very complex and more expensive be truly on the Supercar playing field. One thing you always here when they test the Vettes against the exotics is how much cheaper the Vette is and its the bdst bang for the buck. Understood, but maybe they want to sway the Ferrari, Lambo etc clientele to the Chevy showrooms. Sadly its still a Chevy showroom, maybe could have used the Japanese idea, Honda became Acura, Nissan, Infiniti , Toyota, Lexus. I dont know? Keep producing the C7 at Chevy. C8 becomes a Cadillac ? Then again i remember when Infiniti was pissed when Nissan didnt give them the GTR to sell. One thing is certain, we wil know in January !!!
11-04-2018, 07:20 PM
#53
Race Director
Does GM really care if the C8 is a nightmare to work on? I think they want the ME handling advantage this design will bring. And by making it very complex and more expensive be truly on the Supercar playing field. One thing you always here when they test the Vettes against the exotics is how much cheaper the Vette is and its the bdst bang for the buck. Understood, but maybe they want to sway the Ferrari, Lambo etc clientele to the Chevy showrooms. Sadly its still a Chevy showroom, maybe could have used the Japanese idea, Honda became Acura, Nissan, Infiniti , Toyota, Lexus. I dont know? Keep producing the C7 at Chevy. C8 becomes a Cadillac ? Then again i remember when Infiniti was pissed when Nissan didnt give them the GTR to sell. One thing is certain, we wil know in January !!!
gm actually designs their vehicles not only for superior durability but also ease of service. Their warranty coverage costs are calculated on the parts and labor for repairs.
i believe the service costs could include dropping the engine on specific service items but the time calculated will be much less than on european supercars.
one of the reasons i enjoy corvette ownership for decades is because the cost of maintaince and repairs are reasonable and fair. I fully expect that to continue.
i also have one of the best corvette gm world class technicians who does the carlisle, bowling green, mid america and i believe the bloomington gold service seminars for corvettes.
his name is Paul Koerner and he works out of the Jackson chevrolet middletown ct dealership.
great dealership, great staff, great service,
this is one of the reasons i keep buying new corvettes.
Last edited by JerriVette; 11-04-2018 at 07:21 PM.
11-07-2018, 12:10 AM
#54
I have had several mid engine Porsches, they are VERY easy to perform routine maintenance. oil changes, one of the easiest cars I have ever done, plugs, are easy. Air filter was a bit of pita as it required the top cover to be removed, 6-7 minutes to pull it off. Belts and hoses on the front of the motor, behind the seats/rear firewall is a bit of work. It all depends on how the car is designed. Entirely possible it could be very difficult, but i doubt it. Maybe a bit more of a pita but nothing earth shattering.
11-07-2018, 02:13 PM
#55
Race Director
Well I always change my own oil, $50 in mobil 1 and $50 for the filter, the dealer wants $400 to do it. Current clutch has 36,000 miles on it and no issues, the original 2004 clutches didn't last long but mine still went to 24k miles (some people ruined them in less than 10k miles). Car has over 60k miles now and no hydraulic hoses have been changed.
11-09-2018, 02:45 PM
#56
Race Director
Member Since: Apr 2007
Location: long Island NY
Posts: 17,987
Likes: 0
Received 53 Likes
on
48 Posts
So tired of hearing this, it's the answer to everything. Because I bought something expensive I should expect poor design (high cost of maintenance) or expect to get ripped off because I have money. Part of buying something that cost more than others is better design, more reliability. At least that's what I do when I buy something more expensive than the alternate choices, I expect it to last longer and be better made so in the long run I made a good choice. I know this is not a good analogy but as I first said, so tired of hearing this
Guaranteed, the oil change on the C8 will be as easy as the C7. A center shield will be removed and the dry sump will be assessable. The refill will be just as easy from the top. Don't think GM wants a royal PIA car and the expensive training needed UNLESS, they will be a handful of speciality dealers make car more special.
Last edited by Dave concrete; 11-09-2018 at 02:48 PM.
The following 2 users liked this post by Dave concrete:
ArmchairArchitect (11-09-2018),
JerriVette (11-11-2018)
11-09-2018, 04:04 PM
#57
Drifting
Well I always change my own oil, $50 in mobil 1 and $50 for the filter, the dealer wants $400 to do it. Current clutch has 36,000 miles on it and no issues, the original 2004 clutches didn't last long but mine still went to 24k miles (some people ruined them in less than 10k miles). Car has over 60k miles now and no hydraulic hoses have been changed.
11-10-2018, 11:24 AM
#59
Drifting
A high quality oil filter is about $15. And don't give me any bull about some Amsoil quantum flux filtering technology. An oil filter only needs to last between oil changes, which should be done according to recommened maintenance schedules.
https://www.autozone.com/external-en...ter/904898_0_0
https://www.autozone.com/external-en...ter/904898_0_0
11-10-2018, 04:33 PM
#60
Drifting
The one thing to consider on a ME car is that you are not going to work on it from the top.
You are going to have to get underneath, and probably have to have access to a lift.
As for oil changes, my NSX has nine drain plugs(!) since it is a dry sump.
Quotes for an oil change are about $350.00 and up.
Rumor is the oil is distilled unicorn ****.
You are going to have to get underneath, and probably have to have access to a lift.
As for oil changes, my NSX has nine drain plugs(!) since it is a dry sump.
Quotes for an oil change are about $350.00 and up.
Rumor is the oil is distilled unicorn ****.
Last edited by heavymetals; 11-10-2018 at 04:37 PM.