A recession and the C8
11-26-2018, 04:44 PM
#81
What we've got is EZ credit right now in America.
.Many here believe that real estate prices only go Up. Many here also believe that the stock market only goes Up.
.And why shouldn't they? 2% loans on new Chevrolets. 3% fixed 30 year APR, on real estate.
That's FREE MONEY, in some folks' minds.
.If GM can't move enough C8s, they're going to be offering the dirt cheap APRs on new Corvettes once again.
.Many here believe that real estate prices only go Up. Many here also believe that the stock market only goes Up.
.And why shouldn't they? 2% loans on new Chevrolets. 3% fixed 30 year APR, on real estate.
That's FREE MONEY, in some folks' minds.
.If GM can't move enough C8s, they're going to be offering the dirt cheap APRs on new Corvettes once again.
11-26-2018, 05:47 PM
#82
Burning Brakes
The new trends...
I understand where Barra is going with these changes but it really is schizophrenic. Thrust one is more truck's and SUV's - all gas guzzlers. Thrust two is all-eletric vehicles. I guess you get to the CAFE numbers by selling about 50/50 of each, but there are huge risks in abandoning the middle of the market - particularly over-reliance on electric vehicles. Everybody has to remember that A) every first time buyer in the USA gets a $7500 check from the government for buying an electric vehicle. That law ends this year and will not likely be renewed. B) the infrastructure required to allow long-distance travel in electric cars does not yet exist. Sure Tesla has installed supercharging stations along a number of major freeways, but not nearly enough to sustain the number of vehicles being contemplated by GM, Ford and everyone else. This is really a responsibility of the government - new infrastructure, but if anyone thinks this Congress and Administration is capable of long range planning and infrastructure investment while looking into the teeth of a $1T annual deficit is delusional.
I hope GM hedges their bet by keeping hybrid technologies alive and a few passenger cars in the line. I recently drove a Malibu and it was excllent. It is the right size for most families and gets great mileage. Hopefully it survives and can allow GM to still
make money when this whole plug-in electric dream falls apart. As for Corvette - it doesn't address any if this. As a niche it may survive, but only if it pays for itself, from Day 1 of the C8 introduction.
I hope GM hedges their bet by keeping hybrid technologies alive and a few passenger cars in the line. I recently drove a Malibu and it was excllent. It is the right size for most families and gets great mileage. Hopefully it survives and can allow GM to still
make money when this whole plug-in electric dream falls apart. As for Corvette - it doesn't address any if this. As a niche it may survive, but only if it pays for itself, from Day 1 of the C8 introduction.
Last edited by dcbingaman; 11-26-2018 at 05:49 PM.
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elegant (11-27-2018)
11-26-2018, 07:25 PM
#83
Melting Slicks
At the end of the day its the public that decides what they like and its seams to be SUV's. My wife hated SUV's back in 2005 and now that is all she is willing to drive. She prefers being upright in traffic with a higher seating position. Hates driving in my sports cars feels they are to low. I told my friend if Tesla built a small SUV instead of the 3, manufacturers would be in trouble. Once Tesla gets the cosmetic problems resolved and add more charging it will be tough to beat.
Last edited by fasttoys; 11-26-2018 at 07:28 PM.
11-26-2018, 07:40 PM
#84
I never knew how many libtards buy Corvettes. The economy is doing great and when China bends the knee it will be doing even better The fed raising interest rates won't cause a recession (even though they probably want it to before 2020). Turn off your favorite fake news tv channel and live by what you see not what you are told to think. Thats all
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ctmccloskey (11-27-2018)
11-26-2018, 09:05 PM
#85
Burning Brakes
At the end of the day its the public that decides what they like and its seams to be SUV's. My wife hated SUV's back in 2005 and now that is all she is willing to drive. She prefers being upright in traffic with a higher seating position. Hates driving in my sports cars feels they are to low. I told my friend if Tesla built a small SUV instead of the 3, manufacturers would be in trouble. Once Tesla gets the cosmetic problems resolved and add more charging it will be tough to beat.
The Corvette really is a niche product. The impact on it will be the ability of GM to adopt components and technologies from their extended line of SUV's to the Corvette's needs. That probably means a closer tie to the Silverado / GMC Sierra drivetrains. Sharing between the Corvette and the Cadillac CT6/CTS/ATS probably just went out the window. Does GM even build a Cadillac sedan after 2019 ??
11-26-2018, 09:13 PM
#86
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St. Jude Donor '15-'16,'18
BMW saw the future and produces only SUVs in their largest assembly plant the world, in SC. They build 5 different models in the same plant. GM is trying to refine their offerings to meet what people want to buy. I hope the C8 is one of them.
Last edited by rmorin1249; 11-26-2018 at 09:14 PM.
11-26-2018, 09:20 PM
#87
That plant outside of Toronto was built in 1953 (same year as the Vette intro by model year).
Oshawa Car Assembly (GM Oshawa) is a major manufacturing facility in the city of Oshawa, Ontario, Canada, building various automobiles for General Motors Canada. Vehicles are primarily produced for the US and Canadian market, but they also build exports for various countries around the world, particularly South America and the Middle East. At one time, the factory was one of the largest auto manufacturing facilities in the world, with 2 car plants, a truck plant, as well as producing Harrison radiators, AC Delco batteries (for both GM and other vehicle manufacturers) and America Axle production. Since 1999, it has won more quality and productivity awards than any other GM plant. The plant is part of the larger GM Autoplex.
The facility has over 10 million square feet (930,000 m²) of factory floor. It was converted to a state of the art Flexible Manufacturing facility in 2008, which involved the consolidation of two car plants under the same roof and the addition of a $1.3B paint shop which can accommodate 27 different body styles, including cars, pick up trucks and vans. Approximately 3,600 hourly and 400 salaried employees currently work at the plant, with many more engineers working at GM's Regional Engineering Center across the road .[citation needed] The hourly-rated workers are represented by their union, Unifor Local 222. In August 2017, it was rated highly by its employees in The Best Places to Work in Canada rankings by Indeed, garnering 4th spot overall, and 1st for wages and benefits.
Current products include the Buick Regal, 10th gen Chevrolet Impala, Cadillac XTS sedans, (including the Cadillac PRO model, which are later converted for use as hearses, stretch limos and armored limos), 9th Gen Chevrolet Impala, and Chevrolet Equinox until July 2017, after which one of the plants was retooled for production of the Chevrolet Silverado and GMC Sierra which began in early 2018. The next generation Buick Regal will be assembled in Germany for the North American market.[citation needed] On November 26, 2018, GM announced that the the plant would be unallocated in 2019.[1]
GM announced on November 26 2018 that they would be shutting down the Oshawa plant, affecting 2500 union workers and 300 management.[2]
The facility has over 10 million square feet (930,000 m²) of factory floor. It was converted to a state of the art Flexible Manufacturing facility in 2008, which involved the consolidation of two car plants under the same roof and the addition of a $1.3B paint shop which can accommodate 27 different body styles, including cars, pick up trucks and vans. Approximately 3,600 hourly and 400 salaried employees currently work at the plant, with many more engineers working at GM's Regional Engineering Center across the road .[citation needed] The hourly-rated workers are represented by their union, Unifor Local 222. In August 2017, it was rated highly by its employees in The Best Places to Work in Canada rankings by Indeed, garnering 4th spot overall, and 1st for wages and benefits.
Current products include the Buick Regal, 10th gen Chevrolet Impala, Cadillac XTS sedans, (including the Cadillac PRO model, which are later converted for use as hearses, stretch limos and armored limos), 9th Gen Chevrolet Impala, and Chevrolet Equinox until July 2017, after which one of the plants was retooled for production of the Chevrolet Silverado and GMC Sierra which began in early 2018. The next generation Buick Regal will be assembled in Germany for the North American market.[citation needed] On November 26, 2018, GM announced that the the plant would be unallocated in 2019.[1]
GM announced on November 26 2018 that they would be shutting down the Oshawa plant, affecting 2500 union workers and 300 management.[2]
11-26-2018, 09:26 PM
#88
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St. Jude Donor '15-'16,'18
Nothing is forever.
11-26-2018, 10:04 PM
#89
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St. Jude Donor '15
"In honor of jpee"
After reading Biker's copy of the article, I find some things eerily similar to BG except that it was just finished, has over 5 times the square footage and is a 10 year old conversion. Still, for all the employees it is a sad story to read---no question about it. They gave their all from what I read.
11-27-2018, 12:32 AM
#90
I never knew how many libtards buy Corvettes. The economy is doing great and when China bends the knee it will be doing even better The fed raising interest rates won't cause a recession (even though they probably want it to before 2020). Turn off your favorite fake news tv channel and live by what you see not what you are told to think. Thats all
What I have learned about living in reality is the importance of getting my house in order and keeping my personal debt to a minimum. I learned this lesson from what happened before and after 2008-you remember the before part when Greenspan was saying " the economy is doing great " yet the low interest rates were building bigger and bigger bubbles. Good thing I saved and lived within my means when the economy was supposedly doing so great because I was one of the few I knew who had cash to pay my bills and buy property for pennies on the dollar on the after 2008 part. That was property by the way that was bought before 2008 by those that thought " hey the economy is doing great and property prices just keep going up so what can go wrong "?
I am the last person who wants to see a recession but I am not going to bury my head in the sand and ignore the reality of what is coming. Shame on those of us who ask ourselves fundamental questions like " If the economy is doing so great why is it that so many countries-companies-cities-households keep going further and further into debt " ?
Last edited by 95tealconvert; 11-29-2018 at 07:33 AM.
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11-27-2018, 02:25 AM
#91
11-27-2018, 06:30 AM
#92
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St. Jude Donor '15
"In honor of jpee"
"Speaking of electric... In my old "FL Relocate Thread" I posted links to several FL car shows in post #63. Find the one in that post that links to the Amelia Island show last Mar. That electric C7 Vette was produced by a start-up company in Maryland. Wait till you see the cost: https://forums.corvetteforum.com/sho....php?t=3987105
It would not surprise me if GM is collaborating with that Md. Company on the future Corvette." 6GenVettes
And below is an article on the $750K all-electric Corvette. Really, if it took them that much to create one, my question is why would GM consult with them? GM does have some experience w. both hybrid and EV. But, I guess it can't hurt to see what young startups are doing and at least buy or use the technology. After all,, it is an 800 hp (equivalent) powerplant.
https://www.freep.com/story/money/cars/general-motors/2018/01/14/converted-electric-corvette/1026956001/https://www.freep.com/story/money/cars/general-motors/2018/01/14/converted-electric-corvette/1026956001/
It would not surprise me if GM is collaborating with that Md. Company on the future Corvette." 6GenVettes
And below is an article on the $750K all-electric Corvette. Really, if it took them that much to create one, my question is why would GM consult with them? GM does have some experience w. both hybrid and EV. But, I guess it can't hurt to see what young startups are doing and at least buy or use the technology. After all,, it is an 800 hp (equivalent) powerplant.
https://www.freep.com/story/money/cars/general-motors/2018/01/14/converted-electric-corvette/1026956001/https://www.freep.com/story/money/cars/general-motors/2018/01/14/converted-electric-corvette/1026956001/
11-27-2018, 07:41 AM
#93
I never knew how many libtards buy Corvettes. The economy is doing great and when China bends the knee it will be doing even better The fed raising interest rates won't cause a recession (even though they probably want it to before 2020). Turn off your favorite fake news tv channel and live by what you see not what you are told to think. Thats all
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ArmchairArchitect (11-27-2018)
11-27-2018, 10:05 AM
#95
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It's a downward spiral...when everyone has SUVs, the seating position is no longer upright and you can't see over other vehicles. Not to mention the higher center of gravity, longer stopping distance etc.
Crossovers are the way of the future, IMO. Sedans are outdated relics- they are just as long as crossovers/hatchbacks but don't utilize the empty space above the trunk and up to the roofline (which makes total sense to use for cargo space).
Crossovers are the way of the future, IMO. Sedans are outdated relics- they are just as long as crossovers/hatchbacks but don't utilize the empty space above the trunk and up to the roofline (which makes total sense to use for cargo space).
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Zaro Tundov (11-27-2018)
11-27-2018, 10:45 AM
#96
Melting Slicks
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11-27-2018, 12:03 PM
#97
Drifting
It's a downward spiral...when everyone has SUVs, the seating position is no longer upright and you can't see over other vehicles. Not to mention the higher center of gravity, longer stopping distance etc.
Crossovers are the way of the future, IMO. Sedans are outdated relics- they are just as long as crossovers/hatchbacks but don't utilize the empty space above the trunk and up to the roofline (which makes total sense to use for cargo space).
Crossovers are the way of the future, IMO. Sedans are outdated relics- they are just as long as crossovers/hatchbacks but don't utilize the empty space above the trunk and up to the roofline (which makes total sense to use for cargo space).
Honestly I think sedans aren't popular in the US because Americans have grown too fat. They need vehicles with easy ingress/egress and lots of space inside so they aren't reminded of how fat they are. The crux of the problem is that when faced with the prospect of not fitting in their cars, Americans didn't choose to make themselves thinner to fit, but instead traded for bigger cars with more cup holders to carry around their carbonated corn syrup and coffee-flavored sugar cream drinks.
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11-27-2018, 12:09 PM
#98
Drifting
I suppose one could argue big oil and their gas stations are merely extensions of the government (which they are not), charging stations as well as gas stations should be private business endeavors, not governmental IMO. Further, I would not rely on the government (whether this or any other administration) for anything long range. Innovation and its benefits come from the private sector and the potential financial gains associated w/ it.
Or without drilling subsidies?
I'm not saying those are bad things. Fossil fuels have created the most advanced civililization the planet has ever known. All I'm saying is that our crude oil supply didn't materialize out of the free market without any government intervention. The same will be true for any other energy source that society depends on. The whole point of government is to make society more stable and secure so of course the government plays a big role in securing a nation's energy needs.
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11-27-2018, 01:03 PM
#99
This qualifies as one of the most inane threads I've seen in the 7+ years I've been an active member here. Quick, someone post a thread about what happens to the C8 after the 2020 election. Others should be created to discuss how the C8 may be impacted by the recent Mars landing, Brexit, impending zombie apocalypse, WWIII and the potential emergence of paperless toilet paper. Oh, maybe we should also be talking about the resale value of the C8 when cars are no longer being purchased in ten years, as recently predicted by the Uber CEO...https://www.cnn.com/videos/business/...names-in-tech/
Last edited by Glenn Quagmire; 11-27-2018 at 01:15 PM.
11-27-2018, 02:08 PM
#100
Safety Car
I totally agree with Glen Quagmire, this thread is a joke!
What will happen to Corvette Prices when California is no longer above water?
I may be old but I still want to see a full time 4 wheel drive Corvette.....
We own several rental homes and have paid them off prior to getting ready to retire. My wife and I invested in these rentals 30 years ago and now that they are paid off we are getting ready to retire and enjoy our Corvettes. We lived frugally and made payments on every house every month. The other day I had a Bolivian woman who was mad at me because I would not rent her one of our houses. She told me that It was "HER RIGHT to have a home" and since mine was unoccupied she expected/demanded that I rent it to her. This new socialist attitude won't get far with me.
God Bless The United States!
What will happen to Corvette Prices when California is no longer above water?
I may be old but I still want to see a full time 4 wheel drive Corvette.....
We own several rental homes and have paid them off prior to getting ready to retire. My wife and I invested in these rentals 30 years ago and now that they are paid off we are getting ready to retire and enjoy our Corvettes. We lived frugally and made payments on every house every month. The other day I had a Bolivian woman who was mad at me because I would not rent her one of our houses. She told me that It was "HER RIGHT to have a home" and since mine was unoccupied she expected/demanded that I rent it to her. This new socialist attitude won't get far with me.
God Bless The United States!