Unlikely base MEC using “upgraded LT1”
12-24-2018, 06:11 PM
#21
16 Vettes and counting…..
12-24-2018, 07:47 PM
#22
Race Director
The first cars to utilize OHC engines was the Maudslay designed by Alexander Craig and introduced in 1902 and the Marr Auto Car designed by Michigan native Walter Lorenzo Marr in 1903. The first DOHC car was a 1912 Peugeot which won the French Grand Prix at Dieppe that year. 
12-24-2018, 10:02 PM
#24
Le Mans Master
12-24-2018, 10:29 PM
#25
With that said, I've been more than happy with the LT1's capabilities and would have no issue with it being in a ME car.
12-24-2018, 11:04 PM
#26
Le Mans Master
That means I wouldn’t buy a mid engine car w an engine architecture better suited for use in trucks.
Altho I wouldn’t put it past GM to blow an opportunity of inaugurating a completely different platform like the mid engine and then cheap it out with something like an “enhanced” in block cam motor. The first C4 came out w a carryover Xfire motor. The chassis was way ahead of the powertrain and they took a lot of crap for that. So they have a history of doing that.
Altho I wouldn’t put it past GM to blow an opportunity of inaugurating a completely different platform like the mid engine and then cheap it out with something like an “enhanced” in block cam motor. The first C4 came out w a carryover Xfire motor. The chassis was way ahead of the powertrain and they took a lot of crap for that. So they have a history of doing that.
Last edited by Dominic Sorresso; 12-24-2018 at 11:11 PM.
12-24-2018, 11:31 PM
#27
Le Mans Master
You seem to be confusing the current LT engine with a diesel. They share nothing in common.
That means I wouldn’t buy a mid engine car w an engine architecture better suited for use in trucks.
Altho I wouldn’t put it past GM to blow an opportunity of inaugurating a completely different platform like the mid engine and then cheap it out with something like an “enhanced” in block cam motor. The first C4 came out w a carryover Xfire motor. The chassis was way ahead of the powertrain and they took a lot of crap for that. So they have a history of doing that.
That means I wouldn’t buy a mid engine car w an engine architecture better suited for use in trucks.
Altho I wouldn’t put it past GM to blow an opportunity of inaugurating a completely different platform like the mid engine and then cheap it out with something like an “enhanced” in block cam motor. The first C4 came out w a carryover Xfire motor. The chassis was way ahead of the powertrain and they took a lot of crap for that. So they have a history of doing that.
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TightSS (03-14-2019)
12-24-2018, 11:36 PM
#28
I use my sports cars as daily drivers. I love the idea of a lt1 derived motor for the c8.
replacement parts are inexpensive and durability over the life of the engine is world class.
go replace a german engine in a german sports car. Good luck.
i fully expect a 10 percent increase utilizing the technologies that gm recently released in its 2.7 turbo four truck motor.
gm was able to create a 30 percent increase in hp from the 2.4 turbo four 238 hp motor in the cadillac xt4 to a full 310 hp in the 2.7 liter tirbo four...
remember the c5 to c6 gm was able to find 50 hp and in the third year of the c6 able to add an additional 36 hp in the ls3 for a total naturally aspirated v8 to gain 86 hp from the 350 hp ls1 in 2004 to 2008 c6s 436 hp powerplant.
I believe 500 hp or 40 more than todays lt1 is doable as is 60 hp...
think positive and wait for the release...
as far as the twin turbo v8...doubling the 2.7 turbo four to 5.4 or 5.5 liters does make some economic semse....same bore, same stroke..blah blah blah...we should see an easy620 hp from the turbo v8...
we are all just shooting the breeze...but where I sit...i like inexpensive ohv compact power durable engines for my daily driver sports cars that i plan toput over 100k miles on...
i especially lime the fact that maintaince cinsists mostly of changing the oil ever 7k miles or so...changing the spark plugs and wires at 50k miles and not much more...
i listen to maintaince and repair costs on using a finely engineered porsche engine to 100k and I cringe...
this video makes a crazy bleed on cashflow for an porsche motor...
f that..lol
Matt's Safari 911 Engine Needs a Rebuild - Here's What's Wrong (And How ... https://youtu.be/dPThjaYW2-Y via @YouTube
german craftmanship wtf?
replacement parts are inexpensive and durability over the life of the engine is world class.
go replace a german engine in a german sports car. Good luck.
i fully expect a 10 percent increase utilizing the technologies that gm recently released in its 2.7 turbo four truck motor.
gm was able to create a 30 percent increase in hp from the 2.4 turbo four 238 hp motor in the cadillac xt4 to a full 310 hp in the 2.7 liter tirbo four...
remember the c5 to c6 gm was able to find 50 hp and in the third year of the c6 able to add an additional 36 hp in the ls3 for a total naturally aspirated v8 to gain 86 hp from the 350 hp ls1 in 2004 to 2008 c6s 436 hp powerplant.
I believe 500 hp or 40 more than todays lt1 is doable as is 60 hp...
think positive and wait for the release...
as far as the twin turbo v8...doubling the 2.7 turbo four to 5.4 or 5.5 liters does make some economic semse....same bore, same stroke..blah blah blah...we should see an easy620 hp from the turbo v8...
we are all just shooting the breeze...but where I sit...i like inexpensive ohv compact power durable engines for my daily driver sports cars that i plan toput over 100k miles on...
i especially lime the fact that maintaince cinsists mostly of changing the oil ever 7k miles or so...changing the spark plugs and wires at 50k miles and not much more...
i listen to maintaince and repair costs on using a finely engineered porsche engine to 100k and I cringe...
this video makes a crazy bleed on cashflow for an porsche motor...
f that..lol
Matt's Safari 911 Engine Needs a Rebuild - Here's What's Wrong (And How ... https://youtu.be/dPThjaYW2-Y via @YouTube
german craftmanship wtf?
this post should be reviewed by us all.. well put.!
due to the recent problems at GM... the engine they put in the c8 will speak volumes...regarding the condition of the company as a whole... if they see blue sky.. it'll be dhoc TT..caddy motor... if they see bears.. it'll be LT based motor... in any case... the motor in the car is a HUGE flag, indicating the faith the top of gm have in the company as a whole... the company is concentrated in models now... thats the first step to retract variable parts.....
12-24-2018, 11:55 PM
#29
Advanced
Thread Starter
Facts:
The top 3 rated engine reliability manufacturers in the world, ie those with the fewest Reported Engine Problems, all use DOHC valvetrains. It’s probably the top 10 but I didn’t keep going down the list.
The argument that pushrod engines are lighter than Dohc engines is not necessarily true. Sure if you compare equal displacement engines that is probably the case, but the dohc engine can get by with lower displacement and generate equal hp by utilizing more efficient combustion and higher revs.(oversimplified I know)That’s why you have 4l Ferrari’s that go like stink.
Some seem to think the smaller displacement dohc engines need forced induction to make big hp. Not true. See again Ferrari, or better yet go to Mercury Racing and read about their work with the SB4. They sure make a hell of an engine out of that old ls block����
The top 3 rated engine reliability manufacturers in the world, ie those with the fewest Reported Engine Problems, all use DOHC valvetrains. It’s probably the top 10 but I didn’t keep going down the list.
The argument that pushrod engines are lighter than Dohc engines is not necessarily true. Sure if you compare equal displacement engines that is probably the case, but the dohc engine can get by with lower displacement and generate equal hp by utilizing more efficient combustion and higher revs.(oversimplified I know)That’s why you have 4l Ferrari’s that go like stink.
Some seem to think the smaller displacement dohc engines need forced induction to make big hp. Not true. See again Ferrari, or better yet go to Mercury Racing and read about their work with the SB4. They sure make a hell of an engine out of that old ls block����
12-25-2018, 07:52 AM
#30
Race Director
It means the 6.2L is used in the Silverado pick-up truck.
If the ME uses a small block Chevy motor that started life in 1955, it is going to have a serious marketing problem.
If it uses a twin turbo hot V DOHC that was just developed and produced this year, Corvette will not be seen as old tech 20th century engineering.
The Blackwing will be more powerful that the LT1 and likely more fuel efficient as well. Going old school on the motor makes no sense for a brand new Corvette.
If the ME uses a small block Chevy motor that started life in 1955, it is going to have a serious marketing problem.
If it uses a twin turbo hot V DOHC that was just developed and produced this year, Corvette will not be seen as old tech 20th century engineering.
The Blackwing will be more powerful that the LT1 and likely more fuel efficient as well. Going old school on the motor makes no sense for a brand new Corvette.
i have 128K miles on my third ohv purchased new corvette and We love the durability, simplicity ,compact ,lightweight, inexpensive and power of this ohv powertrain...
i dont want a oversized complicated expensive to maintain or replace engine in my corvette.
i dont keep garage queens ...i use my sports cars as cars...
i pity the exotic car owners who dont use their cars for fear of depreciation or maintaince costs..
life is too short for that crap..
when the party is over..its over...and the only things that matter are the experiences in life you get to enjoy..
jmo
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12-25-2018, 08:49 AM
#31
this post should be reviewed by us all.. well put.!
due to the recent problems at GM... the engine they put in the c8 will speak volumes...regarding the condition of the company as a whole... if they see blue sky.. it'll be dhoc TT..caddy motor... if they see bears.. it'll be LT based motor... in any case... the motor in the car is a HUGE flag, indicating the faith the top of gm have in the company as a whole... the company is concentrated in models now... thats the first step to retract variable parts.....
due to the recent problems at GM... the engine they put in the c8 will speak volumes...regarding the condition of the company as a whole... if they see blue sky.. it'll be dhoc TT..caddy motor... if they see bears.. it'll be LT based motor... in any case... the motor in the car is a HUGE flag, indicating the faith the top of gm have in the company as a whole... the company is concentrated in models now... thats the first step to retract variable parts.....
additionally, the 6 plus month delay on the release... is rumored (is this still true or debunked?? dont know) to be due to using an 'off the shelf' wiring harness... that was not adequate for the new me car..... (me) with tons of experience in product development and marketing... the decision to do this was made in an engineering meeting with 4-6 gm top mech//electrical. engineers.... and the COG won the argument.. ie. "we have this harness.. lets build it w proper lengths for the new car... save $ and time (also very important and may negate my argument)..
point being.. if COG on a "wiring harness" was won over... (ie.. lets save that money.. on a newly designed harness)... can you really imagine a dohc TT ??? The feel here is if your trying cut cost of goods on a wiring harness... you prolly dont stuff in a big money ...dohc TT motor. That would be really hard to imagine now... id love the TT caddy motor... though prolly not happening..
finally... what gm vehicle has gas motor on 2 wheels and electric motors up front , a la NSX??? they dont have one.. so why would they even "try" a factory wiring harness in the first place if they had electric motors on front wheels...
not that I like it... cause I dont.. but looks like we are gonna get a LT motor... rear wheel only... and no offer for front drive... unless its mechanical... (lambo yardo style)...
12-25-2018, 08:58 AM
#32
Le Mans Master
you say marketing problem and for most of us with 190 mph road rockets powered by ohv engine...we say a huge benefit..
i have 128K miles on my third ohv purchased new corvette and We love the durability, simplicity ,compact ,lightweight, inexpensive and power of this ohv powertrain...
i dont want a oversized complicated expensive to maintain or replace engine in my corvette.
i dont keep garage queens ...i use my sports cars as cars...
i pity the exotic car owners who dont use their cars for fear of depreciation or maintaince costs..
life is too short for that crap..
when the party is over..its over...and the only things that matter are the experiences in life you get to enjoy..
jmo
Last edited by Dominic Sorresso; 12-25-2018 at 10:09 AM.
12-25-2018, 09:11 AM
#33
If u were rhe market for the C8, GM wouldn't be developing a mid engine car. As long as Corvette uses an OHV motor, it will be viewed as an second tier “sports car”. The next generation Corvette is always described as the “best Vette yet” which comes off as a left handed compliment. The SBC is an American anachronism worrhy of its role in more mundane vehicles but not in a vehicle striving to demonstrate the capabilities of its manufacturer amongst all manufacturers. The real LT-5 put the C4 on the world map. Hopefully GM will decide to be bold again.
Hi Dominic ... Merry Christmas to all the great posters here...
The 32v c4 w Yamaha was spectacular... even by todays standards.s.. agreed... what is the news on this "wiring harness" issue??? that can give us really good clues... ive read just some rumor posts ..that the c8 delayed due to the wiring harness...
the other evidence that gm prolly takes into account is how strong the new-er. ls/lt engine is.. people tun them low on oil... bang the red line... abuse the hell out of the 5.3 and guys throw on 2atm of boost on a junkyard 5.3 it takes it daily... if it aint broke... im w you. I want the best tech.. .. the argument against a new dohc TT seems overwhelming if the rumor of the off the shelf wiring harness rumor is true.. if rumor is bogus... then ?????
we all have our fingers crossed for a super new c8 done right..
12-25-2018, 09:18 AM
#34
When they announced the new engines from CADILLAC. The head of CADILLAC said NO CADILLAC ENGINE will be used in the next CORVETTE.
12-25-2018, 09:19 AM
#35
Racer
just my opinion of course - but there is NO way I will shell out cash to buy an "all new" mid engine platform vette with a carryover C7 engine with some upgrades for slightly more power and cooling. I'm waiting for the complete all new platform, work out the bugs that we all know will be present and I'm realistically a 3rd year buyer. I will be glad if they don't come with an engine with an LT designation
12-25-2018, 09:26 AM
#36
They will sell everyone they make "old fashioned" or not
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TightSS (03-14-2019)
12-25-2018, 09:36 AM
#37
Team Owner
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vndkshn (12-26-2018)
12-25-2018, 10:14 AM
#38
Le Mans Master
Bebezote,
The KOTH C4 had a motor designed by Lotus not Yamaha. No one has duplicated what that motor did for 24hrs @ 175+mph in a production vehicle.
Ford used Yamaha heads on their 3L & 3.2L V6
for the SHO in late 80’s and early 90s. Another wonderful DOHC motor I enjoyed driving.
The KOTH C4 had a motor designed by Lotus not Yamaha. No one has duplicated what that motor did for 24hrs @ 175+mph in a production vehicle.
Ford used Yamaha heads on their 3L & 3.2L V6
for the SHO in late 80’s and early 90s. Another wonderful DOHC motor I enjoyed driving.
Last edited by Dominic Sorresso; 12-25-2018 at 10:15 AM.
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TightSS (03-14-2019)
12-25-2018, 10:15 AM
#39
Race Director
If u were rhe market for the C8, GM wouldn't be developing a mid engine car. As long as Corvette uses an OHV motor, it will be viewed as an second tier “sports car”. The next generation Corvette is always described as the “best Vette yet” which comes off as a left handed compliment. The SBC is an American anachronism worrhy of its role in more mundane vehicles but not in a vehicle striving to demonstrate the capabilities of its manufacturer amongst all manufacturers. The real LT-5 put the C4 on the world map. Hopefully GM will decide to be bold again.
i especially lime the repair and maintaince bills on youtube of thise finely engineered dohc german powertrains past 50k or 100k miles...
i own a nice italian afla stelvio ti sport tirbo and its a great car so Im not blind to other technology...but calling a corvette second teir shows your obvious intent ..
youll never buy a c8 for a variety of reasons and if you actually do...im sure youll change your tune ..
i look forward to the automotive press having orgasms over the first year c8 comapring it to mclaren 570s...oh wait...the c7 grand sport already matches the stunning mclaren 570 in lap time ...
so the next gen rear mid engine c8 with a dct and possibly 500 hp is not up to your standards...?
so simple...just wait for the twin turbo 5.5 liter v8 as it should have at least 620 ponies...
i think it will hold much of the technology just shown off in the silverados 2.7 liter four that produces 310 hp..
this way gm can satisfy both the normal corvette buyer like me and also cater to high rollers like you that need dohc engines so you can consider yourself first tier,
merry christmas ...we all win with the various engines coming to the c8
Last edited by JerriVette; 12-25-2018 at 10:19 AM.
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purple heart (02-08-2019)