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Well, here is the deal, if GM comes out with a super Corvette C8 ZR1 at 1000hp and still run 0-60 to at 2.6-2.8 secs, valued at $150k?! Why not get the Tesla Roadster that does 0-60 at less than 1.9 secs, it looks awesome, and +250 top speed, w/ 620mile range? (see roadster info, https://www.tesla.com/roadster)
I mean I love the Corvette, particularly my C7 but, that Tesla Roadster is a sexy mean fast machine! Potential C8 pricing aside, what would make the difference between the Tesla Roadster and the Corvette C8 in terms of perfomance? That Tesla would beat hands down all Ferraris, Lambo's and Buggatis out there at $200k isn't it a steal!? When the C8 Mid Engine Vette comes out, what features could make the C8 better than this Tesla vehicle? Should GM totally reconsider and build the C8 as an EV? or have a fully electric C8 Corvette 3-4 years down the road?
Anyway, I have so many questions... I know we don't have all the C8 answers yet, but could you please let me know what you think? thanks!
The Tesla reminds me of my 19 foot pontoon boat with a large Minn Kota electric outboard (only electric allowed in our Lake). At 1/4 throttle those four 60 lb batteries last 3 hours. At 90% throttle 15 minutes! Yep 0 to 60 under 2 seconds sounds great but don’t do that more than once.
The overwhelming majority of Americans do not drive 300 miles/day. I know that I have not in 30 years. When EVs average 500 or 600 miles on a charge it still won't be enough for the haters. Who wants to spend two days driving 1,000 miles? Fly and get there in 2 hours, forget about it. ICE vehicles are on the way out, might as well just accept this fact and let this evolving technology become part of your life.
Here in SoCal, EVs are all over the place. I would say I see at least a dozen or more every day. Also, charging stations are commonly found in office parking lots. I've never seen one on the side of the road or stranded because it is out of juice. They get around just fine and are growing rapidly in numbers.
Also, if you don't like the looks of the Model S or doors on the Model X, you're .
Tesla just announcing minutes ago. Model 3 on sale now, base price of $35,000, 162 MPH top speed. The car can be ordered online, world wide, completely eliminating the need to visit their storefronts. So much for the rumors of this car never becoming reality.
The overwhelming majority of Americans do not drive 300 miles/day. I know that I have not in 30 years. When EVs average 500 or 600 miles on a charge it still won't be enough for the haters. Who wants to spend two days driving 1,000 miles? Fly and get there in 2 hours, forget about it. ICE vehicles are on the way out, might as well just accept this fact and let this evolving technology become part of your life.
But, you and your comrades label anyone who points out that a EV is not for for everyone a "hater" or a "Luddite". Just because you haven't driven 300+ miles in a day, doesn't mean others haven't.
As for spending two days driving 1,000 miles... have you ever spent two days driving through the Grand Canyon? Or maybe the Tetons? Yosemite? Again, just because it is not YOUR personal style, the rest of us need to change? Yet we are the Luddites? If you want to fly over everything in a rush to get there, that's your call, but do me a favor and don't force it on everyone.
And my two examples... there is no airport in Waco, TX. Neither is there one in Bonham, TX. Austin, TX has one, but it is over an hour from Winding Road. While it is a 1 hour flight from DFW airport, you also have to factor in the hour and a half to get to DFW for me, plus the "arrive two hours before your flight", then add in getting a rental and that cost. So, four and a half hours just to get to Austin, another 30 minutes to get the rental, then an hour across town. Then rinse and repeat to go back. Oh.. plus the cost of parking at the airport. And two airline tickets. I drove it in about that same time, and got to stop anytime I wanted (I highly recommend the Chech Stop in West, TX). For the cost of two tanks of fuel.
Another little EV challenge. After several hurricanes/tornado outbreaks, my wife and I have gone out to my "prehistoric" diesel truck (which actually qualifies as a ULEV due to the catalyst system in it), hooked up my gooseneck trailer and loaded an 8,000 lb tractor on it, then a 2,000 side by side and usually at least one ATV, then filled the bed with chain saws, gas cans, all sorts of chains and drag ropes, tools, cases of water, food, etc. Then driven hundreds, even thousands of miles to go help with clean up and recovery. Show me a EV that can do that. Oh... and then recharge once it gets to that area where typically the power is out.
But, you and your comrades label anyone who points out that a EV is not for for everyone a "hater" or a "Luddite". Just because you haven't driven 300+ miles in a day, doesn't mean others haven't.
As for spending two days driving 1,000 miles... have you ever spent two days driving through the Grand Canyon? Or maybe the Tetons? Yosemite? Again, just because it is not YOUR personal style, the rest of us need to change? Yet we are the Luddites? If you want to fly over everything in a rush to get there, that's your call, but do me a favor and don't force it on everyone.
And my two examples... there is no airport in Waco, TX. Neither is there one in Bonham, TX. Austin, TX has one, but it is over an hour from Winding Road. While it is a 1 hour flight from DFW airport, you also have to factor in the hour and a half to get to DFW for me, plus the "arrive two hours before your flight", then add in getting a rental and that cost. So, four and a half hours just to get to Austin, another 30 minutes to get the rental, then an hour across town. Then rinse and repeat to go back. Oh.. plus the cost of parking at the airport. And two airline tickets. I drove it in about that same time, and got to stop anytime I wanted (I highly recommend the Chech Stop in West, TX). For the cost of two tanks of fuel.
Another little EV challenge. After several hurricanes/tornado outbreaks, my wife and I have gone out to my "prehistoric" diesel truck (which actually qualifies as a ULEV due to the catalyst system in it), hooked up my gooseneck trailer and loaded an 8,000 lb tractor on it, then a 2,000 side by side and usually at least one ATV, then filled the bed with chain saws, gas cans, all sorts of chains and drag ropes, tools, cases of water, food, etc. Then driven hundreds, even thousands of miles to go help with clean up and recovery. Show me a EV that can do that. Oh... and then recharge once it gets to that area where typically the power is out.
OK then and Thank You Sir for all the clarification. How simple my "comrades" and I are when we all know that EVs will never have ranges beyond what they are as of today and will never be able to match the herculean feats that you describe above.
The development of EV has progressed well beyond the wild dreams of Elon Musk:
There are a ton of recent news articles out there about GM's commitment to developing their entire line-up into electric vehicles, including trucks. They are currently in talks to acquire or partner with Rivian which is developing an electric light truck.
Ford is developing an electric F150, and an electric crossover based on the Mustang.
And of course, if you have a C7 donor car and a spare $750K laying around, you can turn your ICE C7 into an 800 HP twin electric motor Genovation GXE, keeping the manual transmission for fun and adding ROUND TAIL LIGHTS for style points!
And that, just the Americans. The auto industry is going electric whether we all like it or not. After that... this could be the C10 or C11
Tesla just announcing minutes ago. Model 3 on sale now, base price of $35,000, 162 MPH top speed. The car can be ordered online, world wide, completely eliminating the need to visit their storefronts. So much for the rumors of this car never becoming reality.
The overwhelming majority of Americans do not drive 300 miles/day. I know that I have not in 30 years. When EVs average 500 or 600 miles on a charge it still won't be enough for the haters. Who wants to spend two days driving 1,000 miles? Fly and get there in 2 hours, forget about it. ICE vehicles are on the way out, might as well just accept this fact and let this evolving technology become part of your life.
Man, you just can't let if go...anyone that dares question ANYTHING about EV is a "hater"
And when do YOU think we're going to see a 500 - 600 mile range EV? Elon claims the Roadster will have a 600 mile range but the physics don't line up with all the other claims. How big/heavy is a battery pack to achieve 600 mile range? How do you hit the 3,000 pound target weight with THAT battery? And if you miss the weight target (likely), is 1.9 second 0-60 still real? Etc....
BTW, unless you're 12, ICE's will still be around for your lifetime.
Man, you just can't let if go...anyone that dares question ANYTHING about EV is a "hater"
And when do YOU think we're going to see a 500 - 600 mile range EV? Elon claims the Roadster will have a 600 mile range but the physics don't line up with all the other claims. How big/heavy is a battery pack to achieve 600 mile range? How do you hit the 3,000 pound target weight with THAT battery? And if you miss the weight target (likely), is 1.9 second 0-60 still real? Etc....
BTW, unless you're 12, ICE's will still be around for your lifetime.
Let what go?
I'll let the physics to expert doubters like yourself who have this all shot down from the go. The simple fact here is that the vast majority of us do not drive 300 miles/day. An EV with a 300 mile range is appealing to a huge number of drivers looking for a new vehicle whether guys like yourself know it or not. The range of what is available now is fine for me and just about every other driver that I can think of.
powering up a stupid cell phone all the time is a PITA, not going to go through that hassle with a car
Thats not required. However, my phone is always "powered up" so I appreciate the convenience. I can also use a key fob or card at any time as well. Not all that different than my C7 fob. It is entirely possible to enjoy both technologies and cars as the both offer distinct advantages in their respective market segments.
Well, here is the deal, if GM comes out with a super Corvette C8 ZR1 at 1000hp and still run 0-60 to at 2.6-2.8 secs, valued at $150k?! Why not get the Tesla Roadster that does 0-60 at less than 1.9 secs, it looks awesome, and +250 top speed, w/ 620mile range? (see roadster info, https://www.tesla.com/roadster)
I mean I love the Corvette, particularly my C7 but, that Tesla Roadster is a sexy mean fast machine! Potential C8 pricing aside, what would make the difference between the Tesla Roadster and the Corvette C8 in terms of perfomance? That Tesla would beat hands down all Ferraris, Lambo's and Buggatis out there at $200k isn't it a steal!? When the C8 Mid Engine Vette comes out, what features could make the C8 better than this Tesla vehicle? Should GM totally reconsider and build the C8 as an EV? or have a fully electric C8 Corvette 3-4 years down the road?
Anyway, I have so many questions... I know we don't have all the C8 answers yet, but could you please let me know what you think? thanks!
The Tesla Roadster no doubt in one INCREDIBLE lightening fast machine, but MAN, I need to hear that bad *** SOUND of the internal combustion high performance motor! Also, when is the Tesla Roadster officially out, and you know there is going to be a HUGE stick mark up shock the first year it arrives.
So the best you can do is deflect from my valid points and talk about cell phones?
Your points are only valid for you. They are not valid for everybody. You are not an early adopter. We get it. If you took a few minutes to do the math, you would see that the lease on the three hydrogen cars available to the public are a bargain after you factor in they are giving you free hydrogen, and a week a year of free rental cars if you want to go out of town. You couldn't drive a stripped down Chevy Malibu with 4 cylinder for the cost of these loaded hydrogen cars. Life is full of trade-offs.
Why not get the Tesla Roadster that does 0-60 at less than 1.9 secs, it looks awesome, and +250 top speed, w/ 620mile range?
Because those numbers are likely complete bullshit, Musk has become harder and harder to believe as time goes by. He's gonna build a super loop, go to mars, the moon, rescue kids from a cave...all bullshit just like these numbers on this new Roadster. An electric car with a top speed of 250 . I'll believe it when I see it.
Isnt the SEC suing this guy for lying to investors?
Your points are only valid for you. They are not valid for everybody. You are not an early adopter. We get it. If you took a few minutes to do the math, you would see that the lease on the three hydrogen cars available to the public are a bargain after you factor in they are giving you free hydrogen, and a week a year of free rental cars if you want to go out of town. You couldn't drive a stripped down Chevy Malibu with 4 cylinder for the cost of these loaded hydrogen cars. Life is full of trade-offs.
The problem I have with the "dream" of some that EV's or hydrogen powered cars will "save the earth" is the cost to produce the power! Hydrogen is as bad. I worked for the largest Industrial Gas Company with 30% production capacity and market share. In the mid 80's when the dream of hydrogen powered cars was a hot topic, we were considering the production and distribution issues. Somewhat ironic, most of the hydrogen comes from petrochemical waste streams! Oh yea, those pushing it were telling everyone to remember that high school Lab where you produced hydrogen from water with electricity! That is so inefficient it's ridiculous, but hear that still used today!
If we were France with ~70% of our electricity coming from Nuclear power perhaps we could just build more but never happen in the US! About 80% of our electricity comes from burring a hydrocarbon (in China and India ~60/70% is still being generated by burning coal!) And "alternate energy cars" get a $7000 Federal Subsidy! Yep your and my Tax money are paying so Hollywood folks can buy a 2 second 0 to 60 Tesla (or one for $35,000!)
When will all those with electric or plug in hybrids pay the ~$300/year tax for the roads they use that currently are paid for by gasoline tax? Also for those that think solar is the solution, what happens when it rains for several days, like recently in the LA area. Those folks expect the Utilities to invest in the power generating equipment to handle that peak load during that time. Perhaps EV owner's should be required to buy their own back-up power! If the Utilities add capacity for those peak load percids, who do you think will pay for it?
Yep, like most things that sound great on the surface, if you look deeper there are costs far beyond with those pushing this "new technology" want to consider or are careful NOT to discuss! Maybe we'll find a way to produce clean fusion power! Don't hold your breath!
Yep been an early adopter for many things in my life, BUT on my dime! Recall buying the first PC in the State of OH in the mid 1970's for our R&D Lab to replace some tasks of my Ti59 programable calculator. Also an IBM XT and Okidata dot matrix printer for my home in 1985 for $3500 (~$10,000 in 2019 dollars!) Have no problem with folks buying Tesla's - just pay the full cost!
I'll let the physics to expert doubters like yourself who have this all shot down from the go. The simple fact here is that the vast majority of us do not drive 300 miles/day. An EV with a 300 mile range is appealing to a huge number of drivers looking for a new vehicle whether guys like yourself know it or not. The range of what is available now is fine for me and just about every other driver that I can think of.
You are so wound to argue you're not READING. I'm all for EV's (and have stated that numerous times in this THREAD). But, there are limitations that you CANNOT just sweep under the rug like they don't exist. It is not fully cooked technology....if stating the obvious makes me a hater/doubter, then so be it.
One of my most smug Tesla owning friends still has to borrow his brother's YUKON to take the family to the beach....why????
02-28-2019, 03:29 PM
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. I'll believe it when I see it.