RapidC84B

Skipshift comes up at like 900 rpm if you're at some very low throttle input and speed. In all my 60K miles in my C7 I've seen it come up a couple of times. Accelerate a couple hundred rpm more and it's gone. As for 7th gear... nobody says you have to use it. I do agree that a 6 speed would be better simply for weight. The 7th gear in my C7 cruises at the same highway rpm asn the 6th gears in my C5s.

vndkshn

If these cars were solely used on the racetrack, fair and valid point. But they are not.

jefnvk

Hmm, just had a though. What about a "manual mode" package for the DCT? Toss in a third pedal that activates the clutch, and an old school style shifter. You could even make it removable if the person didn't want it in the car all the time One tranny can satisfy both crowds

NY09C6

Even the manufactures call them autos because they are autos.

yes I have owned DCT cars

ZishanM

I have preference for the manual but a open to hearing what the DCT offers.

There is a lot of nuance in this discussion, and its been repeated as other enthusiasts had to decide on their transition.

- In some cases, Manufacturers don't think manuals have a future, so even when they're offered, they come with poor R&D behind them, leading to inferior gearing, and making the DCT the superior option.
- From some of the patents we see, even if the C8 had a clutch, it might be an electronic clutch, so still may not be the mechanical linkage we're looking for.

In the end it all depends on the final implementation of it all.

NY09C6

Even the manufactures call them autos because they are autos.

yes I have owned DCT cars

jefnvk

They call them autos because the overwhelming bulk of auto purchasers are never going to know or care the nuanced differences between a DCT and a traditional auto, they just want to know if they have to use a third pedal and shift.

Even then, I can't speak to regular cars, but most sports cars I've seen marketed take care to indicate that their "autos" are truly DCT (or whatever brand name is used).

Sub Driver

Words have meaning which is why you don't get to choose how to define something. This thing called the dictionary, maybe you have heard of it, sums it up nicely when referring to automatic vs manual. If it operates with little to no intervention it is an auto, it doesn't matter what bits are inside.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/automatic
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/manual

Apocolipse

No they are not making a mistake.

Sub Driver

What cars have a DCT that only shift upon request by the driver?

Apocolipse

My RS5 wont shift while in sport mode unless you tell it to. DL501 DCT transmission.

Supersonic 427

I think Chevy will be making a mistake by offering just a DCT transmission available on the C8. Even though only 20 or so percent want a manual in a Corvette that is still a significant number of the 30 to 40k cars produced annually.
I for one love the manual transmission in the Corvette or any high performance muscle car or sports car. It is all about the fun factor for me! My Corvette is strictly purchased for fun and I want it completely different than my daily driver. Automatic transmissions and yes, the DCT is still an automatic transmission, is boring in comparison! If only the DCT is offered in the C8 I will just hold on to my '19 Stingray Convertible with the 7 speed manual and enjoy it and save money!

vndkshn

The 2012-2016 Ford Focus have a DCT, they called it an automatic, but it was actually a DCT. And it drives exactly like an automatic. My daughter unfortunately has one and is going through the buyback with Ford on it now.

Apocolipse

A proper DCT will bring more customers than they will lose not offering a manual. Have to remember that sales are generational and peoples tastes / wants in cars change.

jefnvk

So, what you are saying is that when a DCT is not in automatic mode, everything is done by hand, therefore it is a manual? Where, exactly, does the line between the hand doing the work begin and end? Should we differentiate between mechanically linked mechanical transmissions and electronically linked manual transmissions?

Glad were on the same page with those clear definitions

But seriously, while I'll sit here and argue semantics all day long (or until some actual work drops in my lap), call it whatever the heck you want. I'm looking at it on a more technological level than the simple mode of how the gears are changed by the driver. Performance cars have, until recently, had manuals not because race car drivers like rowing gears, but the mechanics of previous automatic transmissions made them quite less than ideal for anything but drag racing. Now that you can get all those benefits AND none of the drawbacks from traditional autos. If you want to personally define manual as having to have a third pedal and a traditional stick, so be it, I view it as that same system, even if the clutch is being controlled by a computer and there is the possibility of a fully auto mode. That doesn't change the fact that unlike a traditional auto (at least a non-heavily modified one), the driver is still in complete control over the gearbox if they so choose.

RapidC84B

The question is how many manual buyers will accept the DCT? My guess is a majority and that's what GM thinks as well. I am a stick shift guy, but if I buy a C8 convertible as a nice weather daily driver I will try the DCT. I have been driving stick shift since 15, but at nearly 40 I sometimes secretly wish I had an auto some days. The DCT is a great all around solution. That said, it's very much intended-use dependent. If it's a pure weekend toy that you take on scenic drives only, then manual for sure.

mschuyler

Yes, that's how one defines it. Your definition makes no sense. It's like saying 2 + 2 = 6 because I define 6 to be 4. It's like saying "war is peace" and "freedom is slavery." A "manual," by definition, requires human intervention. An automatic, by definition, does not. It doesn't matter what the internals of the transmission are. Why not? Because you have no interaction with them. There are some gears and stuff in there somewhere and they turn around by themselves. They are "automatic." Grandma's Fleetwood Cadillac has an automatic. She just pushes the accelerator and it goes. If it had a DCT she would do the exact same thing, push the accelerator and it goes. To play fast and loose with definitions like this IGNORES the basic issue here: NO CLUTCH THAT YOU CAN CONTROL. Now you'll turn around and say, "Well, it has a clutch internally that is applied automatically." JUST STOP ALREADY!! You are not making any sense. What do you not get about this? It's like talking to a Hare Krishna guy in saffron robes who comes to the door and you ask him, "OK, what is this all about?" and with this mesmerized look on his face he says, "Pigs eat stool."

The ISSUE here is that many people still want a MANUAL transmission. Saying that a "DCT is a manual" is COMPLETELY IGNORING the issue. Nobody who wants a manual transmission gives a flying F that a DCT has clutches internally. That has NEVER been the point here. Arguing otherwise is like arguing over the number of angels that can fit on the head of a pin.

Apocolipse

Automatics have internal clutches too...hahaha

vndkshn

That's actually mostly untrue. DCTs orient the gears differently than traditional manuals (or even sequentials). Could you row them? Sure, but the pattern would be weird and undriveable. Picture 1st being what we consider 4th and 2nd being 7th, then 3rd being where 2nd is. Making those positions up, but it's something like that. At least that is how BMW did it (well, really ZF I guess, I think that is who made their DCT).

This was actually close to a reality. I drove an E60 M5 (from the time before they brought the manual back) that had a 3rd pedal and traditional gated shifter. The pedal and shifter feel was a combo of force feedback and springs, but given it was a beta unit, it felt pretty dang good. They abandoned it when BMW brought the manual back.

FactoryZ51

I think it's the guy from that movie about the scary girl that lives in a well....maybe?