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I'm thinking the engine mount broke and it went up and hit the glass

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I'm thinking the engine mount broke and it went up and hit the glass

 
Old 03-14-2019, 07:48 PM
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Mikec7z
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Default I'm thinking the engine mount broke and it went up and hit the glass

I'm starting to think the engine mount points snapped and the engine went up and broke the glass perhaps.

The reason I say this is, on previous 1000hp car I used to have, i remember having to add an aftermarket engine cradle. The mounting points from the motor mounts to the aluminum engine blocks could fail from the torque created when the car would hook up once in a while. (never happened to me, but happened to others, and i was proactive before i destroyed my engine)

The reason I bring this up is because yesterday I made it pretty clear that I thought the glass breaking this late in the game from "frame distortion" was a lie, (i hope it is, or i think GM is horrible at what they do, and their testing process is horrible)

or i think its an old story brought up to cover up the real problems they are having that they dont want people to know about and "bending frame" and broken glass sounds cooler.

If there is frame bending going on, i dont believe it is breaking the glass, since the glass is suspended. I think its more likely they are breaking the rear ends (transaxles) on the cars since they hook up with better grip than what GM is used to.

However, IF a motor mount broke on a car, and the engine went up and smacked the rear glass and broke it, that is a story that people would talk about and would be repeated. That could easily get twisted into a vague story about how the frame is failing.

I guess a better way for me to word this is, I HOPE it is just motor mounts breaking, and not the frame being so poorly engineered that the car is twisting so much that the rear glass is breaking.

Again, as i have mentioned in other threads, the rear glass is most likely suspended by the vent mesh, so this is like suspending the glass from ropes. This is important for hot to cold, cold to hot scenarios more than it is "frame warping"

There is no doubt in my mind, a 1000hp car with positive grip to the rear wheels, would absolutely break motor mounts, and even break the aluminum engine block at those mounting points.

We used to have these long flat motor mounts that spanned the entire length of the engine. They added weight, but it was better than throwing an iron block into the car.

And while im on that topic, the blocks themselves used to twist and sheer as well, from the torque, and the motor mounts/cradles we used to use would reinforce those engine blocks so they would stay together when we used to take LS aluminum block motors to the moon with turbos back in the day.

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Old 03-14-2019, 09:27 PM
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I think it may be a possibility. A frame bending that much would break other body panels and parts too.
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Old 03-14-2019, 11:51 PM
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All this frame bending crap is crap. They put the LT5 in the C4 corvette........ I simply took the top out of my 93 Vette and could feel the flex come on big time. Current frame tech is incredible and the ability to measure deflection of any sort is simply incredible as well.....But glass breakage.....not frame related, not in this time and age.

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Old 03-15-2019, 12:04 AM
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Are there actually any pictures of this so called "damage"? All seems like a bunch of fake news.
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Old 03-15-2019, 12:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Zora_Vette View Post
I think it may be a possibility. A frame bending that much would break other body panels and parts too.
my thoughts exactly. Other parts would get cracked and paint would lift. IF the glass was hard mounted in... MAYBE it would break, but its not hard mounted in. Even the patent shows its not hard mounted in. They broke it long ago, that is either an old story that got brought back to cover the real problem, or like I said, an engine mount or engine block literally broke.
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Old 03-15-2019, 01:28 AM
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If it's a case of a projectile or shrapnel shooting loose, GM's created a monster. No one knows what broke the glass. This's like The Outer Limits.
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Old 03-15-2019, 05:34 AM
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Nobody said that this whole frame bending issue occurred recently
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Old 03-15-2019, 05:57 AM
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c5 was stiff, c6 and 7 more so. The c8 frame is likely not the culprit as they are incredibly strong to handle well with likely the ability to handle the hp

on my old 71 ta, I put 4.88 gears, 454 LS7 style chevy with big solid cam, and sq port heads, and used a joe liberty crash box tranny

I busted the windshield on that old gal with a hard 2nd gear power shift at 7200

with those big gears that car would git it
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Old 03-17-2019, 09:06 AM
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Originally Posted by WhiteDiamond View Post
All this frame bending crap is crap. They put the LT5 in the C4 corvette........ I simply took the top out of my 93 Vette and could feel the flex come on big time. Current frame tech is incredible and the ability to measure deflection of any sort is simply incredible as well.....But glass breakage.....not frame related, not in this time and age.
The C7 frame is much different than my '88 and '93. I'm sure the C8 will be similar to the C7 and unlike older frames were, being shipped to BG by a sub supplier were, for shipping reasons, may have compromises in design, the C7 does not. It's all welded in BG and is reported to be much more ridged than even the C6.

In addition IF when a 1000 hp variant is ready for production a simple material thickness of shape change on a few of the many frame members could offset any extra torque related loads. Easily done when fabricating the frames in BG.

I recall when I went to have my '88 Vette inspected, as required by the State at that time, the local "service station" (yep still had those in 1988) would not put the car on his center post lift to check the exhaust- a requirement. He said he had cracked a Vette windshield because the body twisted when one lift arm contacted first! He recommended a muffler shop that had a drive on lift. Not sure if that was BS as the muffler shop tried to tell me I needed a repair (which I didn't.) Wondered if they got commission for sending folks his way! We no longer have State inspection.

The C7 Aluminum Frame, Welded in BG

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Old 03-17-2019, 09:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Mikec7z View Post
I'm starting to think the engine mount points snapped and the engine went up and broke the glass perhaps.
Could be. The torque reaction lifting the engine under acceleration would be much greater than on the C7, which has the engine way out on the end of a long torque tube.
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Old 03-17-2019, 09:48 AM
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All this frame bending, busted window talk is a bunch of nonsense. These rumors get started and go viral because there is nothing other than fake news. The computer models and design programs currently used would not allow this to happen period. The Porsche humpers and Corvette haters have this last chance to get in their digs. The C8 is a 911 fanboys worst nightmare and it is coming soon, I can't wait.
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Old 03-17-2019, 10:12 AM
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Originally Posted by JerryU View Post
The C7 frame is much different than my '88 and '93. I'm sure the C8 will be similar to the C7 and unlike older frames were, being shipped to BG by a sub supplier were, for shipping reasons, may have compromises in design, the C7 does not. It's all welded in BG and is reported to be much more ridged than even the C6.

In addition IF when a 1000 hp variant is ready for production a simple material thickness of shape change on a few of the many frame members could offset any extra torque related loads. Easily done when fabricating the frames in BG.

I recall when I went to have my '88 Vette inspected, as required by the State at that time, the local "service station" (yep still had those in 1988) would not put the car on his center post lift to check the exhaust- a requirement. He said he had cracked a Vette windshield because the body twisted when one lift arm contacted first! He recommended a muffler shop that had a drive on lift. Not sure if that was BS as the muffler shop tried to tell me I needed a repair (which I didn't.) Wondered if they got commission for sending folks his way! We no longer have State inspection.

The C7 Aluminum Frame, Welded in BG
Jerry, the little service station was accurate about the lift. I grew up at one of those places and I have seen plenty of flex on lifts. The two door American cars in the 60ís and 70ís were big offenders. I read that the C4 was supposed to have t tops and when it was decided to have a hatch the rigidity disappeared. Remember, my C6Z had the hatch bolted in place so not to remove. The Z8 BMWís have an aluminum frame bending problem. I love Corvettes but some issues are complete BS. My friendís 911 feels like all of one piece all the time. We canít do this? Give the die hards a rock solid car without a hatch or retractable top. Nothing feels better than a light weight bank vault.
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Old 03-17-2019, 10:33 AM
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^^^
Understand. Yep a metal unit body car can avoid stress on things like windshields easier than a perimeter frame with a separate, non stressed body. However the C7 has quite a bit of structure above the perimeter.

I was surprised when they had the Z06 and especially the ZR1 not come as non-removable roof models. Would not bother me as seldom have the roof off. But it must be a suffceintly ridged frame to deal with the extra torque. Especially in a Vert!

Last edited by JerryU; 03-17-2019 at 10:37 AM.
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Old 03-17-2019, 11:02 AM
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I’m thinking you’re thinking too much.
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Old 03-17-2019, 04:35 PM
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Frame bending...lmao....no. Tons of computer models have been done, and the stresses are well understood. Like stated, it's likely some sort of failure in a component, engine mount, etc. Frame twisting...sounds like something out of the 70's. Sounds like a very generalized statement for what is likely a very specific problem.
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Old 03-17-2019, 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted by K.I.T.T. View Post
Frame bending...lmao....no. Tons of computer models have been done, and the stresses are well understood. Like stated, it's likely some sort of failure in a component, engine mount, etc. Frame twisting...sounds like something out of the 70's. Sounds like a very generalized statement for what is likely a very specific problem.
Honestly it sounds to me like a marketing tactic. I can imagine all the "car guys" at bars have been bullshitting each other about a Corvette engine so powerful it breaks all the windows and twists up the frame like spaghetti. "Dude, the engine is so badass it destroyed their test cars like a beast!"
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Old 03-18-2019, 02:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Mikec7z View Post
I'm starting to think the engine mount points snapped and the engine went up and broke the glass perhaps.

The reason I say this is, on previous 1000hp car I used to have, i remember having to add an aftermarket engine cradle. The mounting points from the motor mounts to the aluminum engine blocks could fail from the torque created when the car would hook up once in a while. (never happened to me, but happened to others, and i was proactive before i destroyed my engine)

The reason I bring this up is because yesterday I made it pretty clear that I thought the glass breaking this late in the game from "frame distortion" was a lie, (i hope it is, or i think GM is horrible at what they do, and their testing process is horrible)

or i think its an old story brought up to cover up the real problems they are having that they dont want people to know about and "bending frame" and broken glass sounds cooler.

If there is frame bending going on, i dont believe it is breaking the glass, since the glass is suspended. I think its more likely they are breaking the rear ends (transaxles) on the cars since they hook up with better grip than what GM is used to.

However, IF a motor mount broke on a car, and the engine went up and smacked the rear glass and broke it, that is a story that people would talk about and would be repeated. That could easily get twisted into a vague story about how the frame is failing.

I guess a better way for me to word this is, I HOPE it is just motor mounts breaking, and not the frame being so poorly engineered that the car is twisting so much that the rear glass is breaking.

Again, as i have mentioned in other threads, the rear glass is most likely suspended by the vent mesh, so this is like suspending the glass from ropes. This is important for hot to cold, cold to hot scenarios more than it is "frame warping"

There is no doubt in my mind, a 1000hp car with positive grip to the rear wheels, would absolutely break motor mounts, and even break the aluminum engine block at those mounting points.

We used to have these long flat motor mounts that spanned the entire length of the engine. They added weight, but it was better than throwing an iron block into the car.

And while im on that topic, the blocks themselves used to twist and sheer as well, from the torque, and the motor mounts/cradles we used to use would reinforce those engine blocks so they would stay together when we used to take LS aluminum block motors to the moon with turbos back in the day.
or... it was a resonance issue
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