The C7 and FE Corvettes are dead...
04-17-2019, 12:34 PM
#241
while im still waiting for vetterman to edit his post to avoid future drama, I am not running from my belief. While the news caught me off guard at first... the more i thought about it, the more it made sense to me.
... if the c8 was developed along side the c7 back during the c6 era, which it was... and GM did not catch a problem, or "allowed for" a problem on the c7... then it stands to reason GM would not catch, or also "allow for" the identical problem to exist in similar fashion on the c8, during those same moments in time of development. Of course, GM may have assumed that platform was stable and good to go, and moved onto other aspects of development like transmission and electronics, etc.
Now, what they thought they had, is no longer a stable platform they had once assumed.
once i digested this, things started to make a lot more sense, and I was a bit less angry. The problem of course is the class action lawsuits which a federal judge just recently approved to be heard in court....
and while GM might have a leg to stand on with the c7 defending the topic, they wont have a leg to stand on with the c8 should the same problem present itself, everyone will be merciless, including judges im sure.
Meanwhile we have GM execs going to see just how good/bad the car is in the hot desert, so they could make their final call on what the next move was for the c8.
I could keep going, but i think that's enough.
... if the c8 was developed along side the c7 back during the c6 era, which it was... and GM did not catch a problem, or "allowed for" a problem on the c7... then it stands to reason GM would not catch, or also "allow for" the identical problem to exist in similar fashion on the c8, during those same moments in time of development. Of course, GM may have assumed that platform was stable and good to go, and moved onto other aspects of development like transmission and electronics, etc.
Now, what they thought they had, is no longer a stable platform they had once assumed.
once i digested this, things started to make a lot more sense, and I was a bit less angry. The problem of course is the class action lawsuits which a federal judge just recently approved to be heard in court....
and while GM might have a leg to stand on with the c7 defending the topic, they wont have a leg to stand on with the c8 should the same problem present itself, everyone will be merciless, including judges im sure.
Meanwhile we have GM execs going to see just how good/bad the car is in the hot desert, so they could make their final call on what the next move was for the c8.
I could keep going, but i think that's enough.
Last edited by Mikec7z; 04-17-2019 at 03:42 PM.
04-17-2019, 12:40 PM
#242
The Consigliere
Member Since: May 2006
Location: 2023 Z06 & 2010 ZR1
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I'd be surprised if thermal management hasn't received its due focus on the ME.
04-17-2019, 01:30 PM
#243
Tech Contributor
Member Since: Mar 1999
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 10,063
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"Ask Tadge" Producer
The following 5 users liked this post by jvp:
Mikec7z (04-17-2019),
Rapid Fred (04-17-2019),
ShagVette (04-17-2019),
smoove7410 (04-17-2019),
Zaro Tundov (04-17-2019)
04-17-2019, 02:31 PM
#246
Safety Car
04-17-2019, 03:14 PM
#247
while im still waiting for vetterman to edit his post to avoid future drama, I am not running from my belief. While the news caught me off guard at first... the more i thought about it, the more it made sense to me.
... if the c8 was developed along side the c7 back during the c6 era, which it was... and GM did not catch a problem, or "allowed for" a problem on the c7... then it stands to reason GM would not catch, or also "allow for" the identical problem to exist in similar fashion on the c8, during those same moments in time of development. Of course, GM may have assumed that platform was stable and good to go, and moved onto other aspects of development like transmission and electronics, etc.
Now, what they thought they had, is no longer a stable platform they once had assumed.
once i digested this, things started to make a lot more sense, and I was a bit less angry. The problem of course is the class action lawsuits which a federal judge just recently approved to be heard in court....
and while GM might have a leg to stand on with the c7 on the topic, they wont have a leg to stand on with the c8 should the same problem present itself, everyone will be merciless, including judges im sure.
Meanwhile we have GM execs going to see just how good/bad the car is in the hot desert, so they can make their final call on what the next move was.m
I could keep going, but i think that's enough.
... if the c8 was developed along side the c7 back during the c6 era, which it was... and GM did not catch a problem, or "allowed for" a problem on the c7... then it stands to reason GM would not catch, or also "allow for" the identical problem to exist in similar fashion on the c8, during those same moments in time of development. Of course, GM may have assumed that platform was stable and good to go, and moved onto other aspects of development like transmission and electronics, etc.
Now, what they thought they had, is no longer a stable platform they once had assumed.
once i digested this, things started to make a lot more sense, and I was a bit less angry. The problem of course is the class action lawsuits which a federal judge just recently approved to be heard in court....
and while GM might have a leg to stand on with the c7 on the topic, they wont have a leg to stand on with the c8 should the same problem present itself, everyone will be merciless, including judges im sure.
Meanwhile we have GM execs going to see just how good/bad the car is in the hot desert, so they can make their final call on what the next move was.m
I could keep going, but i think that's enough.
Mike the reason so many of the treads you are involved with get closed is because your continually posting as fact things that are not true and Heber have been.
I have yet to see on topic about the C8 that you and or your inside source are right about.
Now somehow you determined that 7 18 19 is a stall to buy time for GM to fix an unresolved overheating issue.
These are your post that implies there an overheating issue and that has been the delay and reason car has not been released.
I think this along with the car can't be shut off at the gas station and the 2020 C7 will be announced in 30 days which your source was again wrong.
STOP with the B.S. and stop with the lame insider info and the treads you post in won't be closed.
You know that you started a tread that stated you had INSIDE INFO that the C8 had an unresolved over hearing issue.
Then after multiple people called you out on it and one Mod who is in the know told you it was BS you then asked multiple time to have tread deleted. Not closed but deleted.
So I have nothing to Edit if you continue to spread BS folks are going to challenge your claims.
Seems you have more issuea and arguments with countless CF members who just can't stand by while you spread false rumors that are totally silly.
Like Tadge has a vendetta against the C7 his team designed because he hates front engine cars.
Do you even understand how stupid that sounds?
I am out have fun I am sure in 48 hours you will have some new inside info and conspiracy about the C8 and GM short coming and how GM is going to get over on the public.
04-17-2019, 03:17 PM
#248
if you guys are trying to get me to give you a name... not going to happen. I already said you win... for now.
Time will tell who was right and who was not
You'd better go help GM with their bending frames and their electronics issues (i bet frames that bend from engines also bend when bumps are hit... seems like a weak frame to me when I've owned 1000hp cars, and know people who have made 2-3000hp on the stock vette frames and are national drag champions, and none of our frames bent... but roadcourse cars with the same frames wear their frames over time and get weaker from all the bumps and curves and stresses... and that was on a c5/c6/c7... thus, the c8 will probably wear its weak frame out on the first race )
While you guys are solving those priority numbers 1's...
I'll be wasting my time messing with useless pointless oil coolers.
Haven't you guys realized yet... the only problem that GM could have with the car... where they would have to start false rumors of nonsense by having key respected people speak up and say is the frame, its the glass, its the electrical... is a problem where they know we would all lose our cool and become angry with GM.... a problem that they know, we know, should have been solved LONG ago.
....Frames bending.... glass cracking .... lol reasons for half/full year delay?... lol
All the mystery and speculation and wonder... we can talk for months and months in anticipation when those are the problems.
... but if someone says overheating... where do our minds go? Anger. You think they don't know this?
Time will tell who was right and who was not
You'd better go help GM with their bending frames and their electronics issues
(i bet frames that bend from engines also bend when bumps are hit... seems like a weak frame to me when I've owned 1000hp cars, and know people who have made 2-3000hp on the stock vette frames and are national drag champions, and none of our frames bent... but roadcourse cars with the same frames wear their frames over time and get weaker from all the bumps and curves and stresses... and that was on a c5/c6/c7... thus, the c8 will probably wear its weak frame out on the first race )While you guys are solving those priority numbers 1's...
I'll be wasting my time messing with useless pointless oil coolers.
Haven't you guys realized yet... the only problem that GM could have with the car... where they would have to start false rumors of nonsense by having key respected people speak up and say is the frame, its the glass, its the electrical... is a problem where they know we would all lose our cool and become angry with GM.... a problem that they know, we know, should have been solved LONG ago.
....Frames bending.... glass cracking .... lol reasons for half/full year delay?... lol
All the mystery and speculation and wonder... we can talk for months and months in anticipation when those are the problems.
... but if someone says overheating... where do our minds go? Anger. You think they don't know this?
Last edited by Mikec7z; 04-18-2019 at 04:29 AM.
04-17-2019, 03:42 PM
#249
Banned Scam/Spammer
if you guys are trying to get me to give you a name... not going to happen. I already said you win... for now.
Time will tell who was right and who was not
You'd better go help GM with their bending frames and their electronics issues (i bet frames that bend from engines also bend when bumps are hit... seems like a weak frame to me when I've owned 1000hp cars, and know people who have made 2-3000hp on the stock vette frames and are national drag champions, and none of our frames bent... but roadcourse cars with the same frames wear their frames over time and get weaker from all the bumps and curves and stresses)
While you guys are solving those priority numbers 1's...
I'll be wasting my time messing with useless pointless oil coolers.
Haven't you guys realized yet... the only problem that GM could have with the car... where they would have to start false rumors of nonsense... is a problem where they know we would all lose it and become angry with GM.... a problem that they know, we know, should have been solved LONG ago.
....Frames bending.... glass cracking .... lol reasons for half/full year delay... lol
All the mystery and speculation and wonder... we can talk for months and months in anticipation.
... but if someone says overheating... where do our minds go? Anger. You think they don't know this?
Time will tell who was right and who was not
You'd better go help GM with their bending frames and their electronics issues
(i bet frames that bend from engines also bend when bumps are hit... seems like a weak frame to me when I've owned 1000hp cars, and know people who have made 2-3000hp on the stock vette frames and are national drag champions, and none of our frames bent... but roadcourse cars with the same frames wear their frames over time and get weaker from all the bumps and curves and stresses)While you guys are solving those priority numbers 1's...
I'll be wasting my time messing with useless pointless oil coolers.
Haven't you guys realized yet... the only problem that GM could have with the car... where they would have to start false rumors of nonsense... is a problem where they know we would all lose it and become angry with GM.... a problem that they know, we know, should have been solved LONG ago.
....Frames bending.... glass cracking .... lol reasons for half/full year delay... lol
All the mystery and speculation and wonder... we can talk for months and months in anticipation.
... but if someone says overheating... where do our minds go? Anger. You think they don't know this?
The following users liked this post:
ShagVette (04-17-2019)
04-17-2019, 03:49 PM
#250
gas station thread was my most off the wall thread, and i admitted in the FIRST POST of that thread that it seemed funny to go there, but i believed if we did discuss it, we could maybe solve why it was happening or get a better timeline if we gathered more evidence,
...and eventually that thread brought a gas station owner out of the wood work that admits new cars with new key fobs and new frequencies, get confused by the gas station signals that the sensors in the tanks and pumps and store all use to communicate as a network.
... and he said that was the problem on the c6z
So, that was the solution to that gas station puzzle on the c8 i believe. We all learned something.
So, what other threads are there that you can hate me for?
...the 2020 c7? I predicted the c7 would be produced over the summer, while everyone else many months back said it was done in april. The "2020" potion of the prediction could still come true. Im not going argue that point, it does not matter.
My point was simple, c7 production over the summer. And here we are, its been confirmed.
now im telling you im willing to say a FE vette will be produced still on sept 30 2019. If anyone wants to say otherwise, put it in writing.
When im wrong i admit i'm wrong very quickly. I haven't been wrong about much when i say im very certain of something.
...and eventually that thread brought a gas station owner out of the wood work that admits new cars with new key fobs and new frequencies, get confused by the gas station signals that the sensors in the tanks and pumps and store all use to communicate as a network.
... and he said that was the problem on the c6z
So, that was the solution to that gas station puzzle on the c8 i believe. We all learned something.
So, what other threads are there that you can hate me for?
...the 2020 c7? I predicted the c7 would be produced over the summer, while everyone else many months back said it was done in april. The "2020" potion of the prediction could still come true. Im not going argue that point, it does not matter.
My point was simple, c7 production over the summer. And here we are, its been confirmed.
now im telling you im willing to say a FE vette will be produced still on sept 30 2019. If anyone wants to say otherwise, put it in writing.
When im wrong i admit i'm wrong very quickly. I haven't been wrong about much when i say im very certain of something.
Last edited by Mikec7z; 04-17-2019 at 03:52 PM.
04-17-2019, 03:53 PM
#251
In all seriousness do you even realize that all of your baseless conspiracy theories and multiple incorrect pronouncements have led to no one believing or caring about what you write? Every time we see a post from you we shake our heads and laugh at your nonsense....alright, I'll admit, some do face palm as well.
04-17-2019, 04:01 PM
#252
ill admit, the "electrical systems on the cars is not working right"... that had me off in la la land... as i was trying to pair that to the gas station no-starts before i created the gas station thread and learned what the real problem probably was.
in that other thread, mammoth and i went back and forth speculating electric motors and systems that jumper cables would not solve...
but i agree that was all based on "electrical systems on the cars not working right"..
and now, im telling you, i no longer buy that line. The delay is not over electrical systems, or frames bending.
It is on the issue that makes us all very angry.... that GM has not solved it yet.
Im out for today, goodluck having anything useful to talk about at this point. Nothing matters until 7 18 19, and im telling you if tadge says cars will be ready by christmas, i say "they will change their mind come oct/nov, and make it spring time" instead....
or they will produce a few prior to christmas, but only for racing qualifications etc... and model years etc...
but then there will be a delay in production and the lions share dont start being made until late winter early spring.
in that other thread, mammoth and i went back and forth speculating electric motors and systems that jumper cables would not solve...
but i agree that was all based on "electrical systems on the cars not working right"..
and now, im telling you, i no longer buy that line. The delay is not over electrical systems, or frames bending.
It is on the issue that makes us all very angry.... that GM has not solved it yet.
Im out for today, goodluck having anything useful to talk about at this point. Nothing matters until 7 18 19, and im telling you if tadge says cars will be ready by christmas, i say "they will change their mind come oct/nov, and make it spring time" instead....
or they will produce a few prior to christmas, but only for racing qualifications etc... and model years etc...
but then there will be a delay in production and the lions share dont start being made until late winter early spring.
Last edited by Mikec7z; 04-17-2019 at 04:10 PM.
04-17-2019, 04:05 PM
#253
ill admit, the "electrical systems on the cars is not working right"... that had me off in la la land... as i was trying to pair that to the gas station no-starts before i created the gas station thread and learned what the real problem probably was.
in that other thread, mammoth and i went back and forth speculating electric motors and systems that jumper cables would not solve...
but i agree that was all based on "electrical systems on the cars not working right"..
and now, im telling you, i no longer buy that line. The delay is not over electrical systems, or frames bending.
It is on the issue that makes us all very angry.... that GM has not solved it yet.
Im out for today, goodluck having anything useful to talk about at this point. Nothing matters until 7 18 19, and im telling you if tadge says cars will be ready by christmas, i say "they will change their mind come oct/nov, and make it spring time" instead.
in that other thread, mammoth and i went back and forth speculating electric motors and systems that jumper cables would not solve...
but i agree that was all based on "electrical systems on the cars not working right"..
and now, im telling you, i no longer buy that line. The delay is not over electrical systems, or frames bending.
It is on the issue that makes us all very angry.... that GM has not solved it yet.
Im out for today, goodluck having anything useful to talk about at this point. Nothing matters until 7 18 19, and im telling you if tadge says cars will be ready by christmas, i say "they will change their mind come oct/nov, and make it spring time" instead.
The following users liked this post:
Rapid Fred (04-17-2019)
04-17-2019, 08:48 PM
#255
Pro
It doesn’t really matter why (or even if) the C8 is “delayed. It doesn’t matter what issues might need to be resolved. In a machine as complex as the modern automobile there are bound to be issues discovered during testing. That’s why they do such extensive testing.
What really does matter is that when the car is released for sale it is as free of problems as possible. Owners will further test the car’s systems since every possible contingency can’t be exhaustively tested. Adjustments will have to be made. If a car had to be perfect before being released, no car would ever be sold. Name a car model from any manufacturer that never had a recall or service bulletin to fix a manufacturing problem and I’ll call you a liar.
i was at the Long Beach Grand Prix Corvette Corral this past weekend. Doug Fehan gave a talk about Corvette Racing and said very little about the C8. What he did say, accompanied by an eye roll, was something to the effect of, “Bending frames? Cracking glass? Electrical problems that engineers can’t solve? Where do people come up with this nonsense?”
Good question, Doug.
What really does matter is that when the car is released for sale it is as free of problems as possible. Owners will further test the car’s systems since every possible contingency can’t be exhaustively tested. Adjustments will have to be made. If a car had to be perfect before being released, no car would ever be sold. Name a car model from any manufacturer that never had a recall or service bulletin to fix a manufacturing problem and I’ll call you a liar.
i was at the Long Beach Grand Prix Corvette Corral this past weekend. Doug Fehan gave a talk about Corvette Racing and said very little about the C8. What he did say, accompanied by an eye roll, was something to the effect of, “Bending frames? Cracking glass? Electrical problems that engineers can’t solve? Where do people come up with this nonsense?”
Good question, Doug.
Last edited by Stingray Sam; 04-17-2019 at 08:49 PM.
The following users liked this post:
Mikec7z (04-17-2019)
04-17-2019, 09:10 PM
#256
Melting Slicks
i was at the Long Beach Grand Prix Corvette Corral this past weekend. Doug Fehan gave a talk about Corvette Racing and said very little about the C8. What he did say, accompanied by an eye roll, was something to the effect of, “Bending frames? Cracking glass? Electrical problems that engineers can’t solve? Where do people come up with this nonsense?”
Good question, Doug.
Good question, Doug.
04-17-2019, 09:31 PM
#257
Banned Scam/Spammer
Gotta love these guys who have an inside "man" at the factory. Sure they do. As if anyone with sensitive, privileged, information is going to risk a 6 figure salary and pension by giving info to some loser who is trying to be a big man on an internet forum.
04-17-2019, 10:25 PM
#258
Race Director
maybe i was searching for info on the forum to see if anyone else had heard this, and the way a couple "in the know people responded in the first 2 posts" to my thread, confirmed (in my opinion) that my friend was correct.
Most of you missed it... the first people confirmed it they way they responded (in my opinion), and then they edited their posts quickly after.
I don't KNOW 100% what the problem is obviously.
But if i had to guess and stake something on it, electronics, and bending frames, cracked glass, or the car dying at gas stations, are no longer my top belief on why the car is delayed.. that's all minor or fabricated silly stuff.
Time will tell if what I have heard is correct or not. I don't want that to become the topic of this thread.
I had the other thread deleted, because i had gained what I was after within those first 2 posts, and everyone after those 2 posts were going to be brain damage argument, so i agreed and said pull it down.
This thread is about how "the c7 are dead".... probably in the future they are dead, but not yet. Factory is still rolling them out as of today.
So if the future of this thread moving forward is to perhaps guess WHEN the c7 is dead, ill go ahead and say I believe a front engine vette will be produced past Sept. 30th 2019.
We will start there and see how many people want to claim that I am incorrect.
Most of you missed it... the first people confirmed it they way they responded (in my opinion), and then they edited their posts quickly after.
I don't KNOW 100% what the problem is obviously.
But if i had to guess and stake something on it, electronics, and bending frames, cracked glass, or the car dying at gas stations, are no longer my top belief on why the car is delayed.. that's all minor or fabricated silly stuff.
Time will tell if what I have heard is correct or not. I don't want that to become the topic of this thread.
I had the other thread deleted, because i had gained what I was after within those first 2 posts, and everyone after those 2 posts were going to be brain damage argument, so i agreed and said pull it down.
This thread is about how "the c7 are dead".... probably in the future they are dead, but not yet. Factory is still rolling them out as of today.
So if the future of this thread moving forward is to perhaps guess WHEN the c7 is dead, ill go ahead and say I believe a front engine vette will be produced past Sept. 30th 2019.
We will start there and see how many people want to claim that I am incorrect.
04-18-2019, 04:24 AM
#260
yes. I think a lightly/decently equipped one with the must have options will be up around 70 at least.
Its not more expensive to build a ME over a FE... technically, its less money. You dont need a drive shaft or a torque tube... exhaust is shorter, gas tanks are less complicated and easier to get to. Assembly of the car overall is simpler. Material used is the same/less. Technically they could sell the car for less than the c7 and probably be as/more profitable... but its what the market will bring and inflation in material prices.
Its not more expensive to build a ME over a FE... technically, its less money. You dont need a drive shaft or a torque tube... exhaust is shorter, gas tanks are less complicated and easier to get to. Assembly of the car overall is simpler. Material used is the same/less. Technically they could sell the car for less than the c7 and probably be as/more profitable... but its what the market will bring and inflation in material prices.