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Do you remember the C7....

 
Old 07-11-2019, 02:08 PM
  #21  
JDSKY
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Going to wait until I see one up close and personal before I decide if it looks good or not to me. I don't buy toys to please anyone but myself but understand that some need the approval and confirmation of others to feel good about their purchases.
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Old 07-11-2019, 02:10 PM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by Atari_Prime View Post
Really, big time hit? Shortest Corvette generation since 67'. Middling sales numbers. Styling still hated by half of the Corvette audience. Overheating issues. Sure, we can call that a hit...
Yes... big hit... the car sold nearly 40k units the first 2 years and then had a normal fall-off. The car is actually selling well right now compared to other generations as there are many who want the last FE manual trans car. At my local club meeting last week 4 members had bought new 2019 C7s (they ask if anyone got a new or new-to-them car each monthly meeting).

As for the 6 year run... that's the goal. It's 2019, product life cycles are shorter and aided by more rapid development/prototyping. We're used to longer generational runs due to economic factors; not intended run length. The C4 was supposed to run 1983-1992, but ran through 1996 because the 1993 C5 was pushed back to 1997. The C6 was supposed to run shorter, but got extended due to the 2008 BK.

When the C7 development was going on someone "in the know" posted something I will never forget. The gist was that the C7 was supposed to go ME, but the BK stopped that so the C7 was rushed (I had a C7, it was a nice car) to fill the gap and the intent was to have a shorter run and then the C8 would be the ME they wanted to design. That's exactly what has happened. The only variance was I think he said the C7 would be a warmed over C6 and only run 3-4 years max. We know it ended up being a much more thorough updated of the FE Corvette platform and sold very well.
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Old 07-11-2019, 02:18 PM
  #23  
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The point of my post is not to judge folks who don't like the C8. My point is for folks to wait until they see the car in person to decide if they like it. I did not like the C7 when the car was revealed and I saw actual photos. However, when i first saw it up close, I quickly changed my opinions. I will be at the reveal next week, so i am not forming any opinions until then.
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Old 07-11-2019, 02:18 PM
  #24  
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By the end of the run, close to 200K C7s in 6 MYs will have been produced. That defines a grand slam in the sports car world.

And yes, other Corvette MYs ran longer, but that had more to do with economic conditions coinciding with that gen. Lastly, look at all vehicles today, and time between generations grows shorter and shorter because of increasingly tough competition. Car makers today better develop new things faster or they die.

Last edited by Foosh; 07-11-2019 at 02:22 PM.
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Old 07-11-2019, 02:34 PM
  #25  
Laguna Fred
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Originally Posted by Atari_Prime View Post
Still not really a fan of either. Tastes don't change, only perception to those tastes. It's the culture around things that creates their identity. Take 'beer' as an example. Given the choice of water or beer, a caveman is going to choose water. However, throw in the fact that water may be contaminated with parasites, not to mention the nice funny feeling you get after you drink a lot of beer, and all of a sudden you have an 'acquired taste'. Still tastes like poo, but you crave the other attributes that come with it. It's the basis of addiction, no one 'craves' meth, they crave the feeling that comes with it. Even one of my favorites, hot wings, fall victim to this same scenario. Vinegar is smelly and nasty, but it is a core ingredient in hot wings. And the first time I tried them I hated them, but over time I saw past all the bad and started to crave the hidden sweetness and spice. Still poo, but created a lie around the bad to get to the good. And that is the C7. It's boring in the front and ugly in the back, and nothing will change that. Some people like it because that disjointed mess of a rear has an angry almost Darth Vader like expression and they want that angry look so much that they see past the mess that is the rear of the car. Some people are such fans of Corvette that they can't believe that any Corvette is bad looking, and so when Tadge says this is pretty, despite their better judgment they fall in line. You know when something is beauiful, and you know when something is ugly, and if you find yourself having to let it grow on you, that's the same as drinking a few more at the bar to try and convince yourself that the toothless girl who's interested isn't that bad looking. Its all just the lies we tell ourselves to get the result we want.
I don't find myself much agreeing with your analysis, Atari, but I have to give you props for your avatar. To this day the Aerobody is one of my favorite Vette styling exercises -- and of course the later C4 guts are so obviously the inspiration for the outstading C7 cockpit.

As to looks growing on us, here's an example. Sometimes stuff is just ahead of its time. The Lambo Miura is widely regarded as rolling art -- perhaps to this day the most beautiful ME design ever. Well, I remember when it came out. I did not like it much, particularly those folded-back-headlghts. With hindsight, of course, we see that the uniqueness of its look certainly predicted the future -- Porsche copied it in the 928 and 968, and further, once the requirement for standardized sealed-beam headlights was lifted, so many cars adopted something stylistically similar. I don't think Miuras were ever "pooh." I just think the Italians have a knack for seeing an advanced form of beauty which folks eventually get.

If a Corvette is bad looking, it's bad looking and people will register that. The C4 is a perfect example. This is a car whose looks were very widely admired when it came out. Yet today, it is the most panned generation among Vette folks and I don't think it is close (full disclosure, I still like the post 1990 version). Nobody TOLD so many Vette lovers to dislike it...THEY JUST DO
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Old 07-11-2019, 02:37 PM
  #26  
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I liked the C7 (including the rear) the first time I saw it. Thought it was very exotic looking, liked the interior and looked fast standing still. I'm thinking the C8 will look even more so.

Last edited by C6ness; 07-11-2019 at 02:46 PM.
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Old 07-11-2019, 02:51 PM
  #27  
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Some car fans will never like the C7 rear no matter how hard they try , good thing lot of other cars to buy, and bottom line it's just a toy. Hope the C8 is a knockout for GM.
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Old 07-11-2019, 03:02 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by RonnieC6Z View Post
I welcome the mid engine C8 with open arms. My guess is that the C8 will be a smash hit and will out sell every previous generation.
It's gonna be hard to top the 53,807 sold for the 1979 model year.
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Old 07-11-2019, 03:02 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by Laguna Fred View Post
I don't find myself much agreeing with your analysis, Atari, but I have to give you props for your avatar. To this day the Aerobody is one of my favorite Vette styling exercises -- and of course the later C4 guts are so obviously the inspiration for the outstading C7 cockpit.

As to looks growing on us, here's an example. Sometimes stuff is just ahead of its time. The Lambo Miura is widely regarded as rolling art -- perhaps to this day the most beautiful ME design ever. Well, I remember when it came out. I did not like it much, particularly those folded-back-headlghts. With hindsight, of course, we see that the uniqueness of its look certainly predicted the future -- Porsche copied it in the 928 and 968, and further, once the requirement for standardized sealed-beam headlights was lifted, so many cars adopted something stylistically similar. I don't think Miuras were ever "pooh." I just think the Italians have a knack for seeing an advanced form of beauty which folks eventually get.

If a Corvette is bad looking, it's bad looking and people will register that. The C4 is a perfect example. This is a car whose looks were very widely admired when it came out. Yet today, it is the most panned generation among Vette folks and I don't think it is close (full disclosure, I still like the post 1990 version). Nobody TOLD so many Vette lovers to dislike it...THEY JUST DO
Thanks for the props. My fav too on the Callaway. I get that the C4 is currently seen as the ugly duckling of the Corvette line, yet the 84' was the second best selling Corvette year in history despite a very high price for the time. Can't be that many haters if sales were so good. But, that is always how it works out, when the C4 and C5 were new, the C3 was seen as the ugly duckling, even though the 79' Vette is the highest selling year of all and the same basic design had been on the market for ten years already. As much as I (and others) may rant and rave, all the designs have their audience. Corvette is and has always been an enduring symbol of American sports cars. Rarely has it been the fastest car on the road, never has it been thought of as the one with the best interior, but it has earned its respect through good looks, good performance, and a price just on the edge of affordability for the average upper middle class citizen. It is the last stop before you step into foreign delights. The Viper stole the Corvette's thunder for a time, it never made a profit though, nor was it intended to, it was a figurehead, and great one. It will return one day soon, and the fight for best American icon will begin again. And we, the consumers, will benefit as they try to one up each other.
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Old 07-11-2019, 03:09 PM
  #30  
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There are so many more choices today than there were in the 70's and 80's, and the competition is a quantum leap more intense. I don't think any car maker is going to come close to selling in the numbers they did 40-50 years ago. Time between generations will likely continue to decrease.

Last edited by Foosh; 07-11-2019 at 03:10 PM.
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Old 07-11-2019, 03:35 PM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by ArmchairArchitect View Post
It's not about having a purist design (round tail lights), it's about having a good design.

And for the C7, many would still agree to this day the car on the whole looks fantastic, especially the front and sides, but the rear end is still the weak point and not widely considered good looking like the other parts of the car (except on perhaps the wide body cars where it looks better).
Exactly, how I feel about the C7. I like the front & side views but still the overall back end is my least favorite aspect of it. I only consider it to be okay looking on the Z06 with the clear taillights, which I actually like (I'm not usually a fan of clear taillights). I definitely don't like the red taillights on the Stingray/GS.

Originally Posted by Atari_Prime View Post
If it has to grow on you, you are just convincing yourself that something that is ugly, isn't.
Why is it that with a Vette certain aspects of it have to grow on me while with cars such as Ferrari, Lambo etc...they never had to grow on me. For example, I liked the looks of the 458, 488, F8, Huracan etc... from all angles the first time I ever saw pics and/or videos of them.

I just hope the C8 when seen in its entirety will look good. Though what I'm really waiting to see is how the higher hp versions turn out, which were the versions I was drawn to/interested in with the C6 & C7.
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Old 07-11-2019, 03:45 PM
  #32  
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A lot of Ferrari's and Lambos had to grow on me too, and some never did. If I just singled out certain rear-ends on some of those cars, I find them way uglier than the leaked C8 photo generating so much buzz here.

It's all personal taste, and first impressions are often very misleading. I think a lot of people just lust after anything exotic under the "if it costs that much it must be awesome" rule. Put one of those Lambo rear ends on a Corvette and this forum would erupt with folks going bat-shoot crazy, and not in a good way.

Last edited by Foosh; 07-11-2019 at 03:49 PM.
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Old 07-11-2019, 03:55 PM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by tcinla View Post

I wonder how may of the Current naysayers will have a change of heart when they realize their preference is not going to change the design...
IF the C8 bombs, you can bet GM will institute changes immediately.
They're not stupid.
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Old 07-11-2019, 03:56 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by Foosh View Post
A lot of Ferrari's and Lambos had to grow on me too, and some never did. If I just singled out certain rear-ends on some of those cars, I find them way uglier than the leaked C8 photo generating so much buzz here.

It's all personal taste, and first impressions are often very misleading.
I guess we all just have our preferences. I agree with you there are some Ferrari & Lambo models I never cared for either but out of the ones I do like I instantly liked them, no growing on me needed. I've seen posts on the CF from members who state that they don't like the looks of any mid-engine exotics. I guess it's a good thing car manufacturers make chocolate, vanilla, strawberry etc...otherwise there would be a lot of unhappy people.
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Old 07-11-2019, 04:20 PM
  #35  
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I have admitted here before that when I first saw pics of the C7 I wasn't all that excited and wasn't sure I liked it. It wasn't until I saw it in person that I realized the pics didnt really do the car justice. So far I like what I have seen with the C8 but I am not rushing to judge again and will wait to see one in person.
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Old 07-11-2019, 06:29 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by RedMercy View Post
Change that profile picture, every time you comment I read it with Mr. Burns voice lol
Excellent.
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Old 07-11-2019, 06:52 PM
  #37  
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I remember the C7 intro well:
  • "It looks like a damn Ferrari! I hate it!"
  • "Where's the twin turbo V6 and AWD? I hate it!"
  • "Fender vent looks like a GT-R! I hate it!"
  • "The black trim on the rear fascia extends slightly too high! I hate it!"
  • "TAILLIGHTS!!! REEEEEEEE!!!!!"
A prominent designer once said words to the effect of, If everybody likes your new car at first, you've screwed up - that probably means that you were way too conservative and people will quickly become bored with your design.
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Old 07-11-2019, 08:43 PM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by RedMercy View Post
Change that profile picture, every time you comment I read it with Mr. Burns voice lol
Funny, every time I read your comment I hear a bearded millennial.
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Old 07-11-2019, 09:41 PM
  #39  
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I remember the 1984 debut. 51,500+ Vettes, that year. 2nd highest production, and 1985 wasn't too shabby in numbers, either. It was pretty revolutionary from the 1982 design.
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Old 07-11-2019, 09:58 PM
  #40  
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It wasn't just before the reveal that a lot of people complained about C7. And they didn't all end up buying them.

Every new generation of the Corvette loses some old fans.
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