zturbo

Ok guys been researching some new ideas and have been kicking around running alcohol in the new motor for a while and talked to some turbo places about it and they have all told me that 11.5ish-1 isn't too high of compression on alchy. I just keep looking at if i have 11-1 compression i can spool the turbos super fast from the line.
Thanks for your time all
Steven

Monty

I don't see any benefit in it, except for the "wow" factor. You can make as much power as you could ever want with the right turbo, 2000+hp is readily available on gasoline. It's certainly alot easier to find 100+ octane gasoline than it is alcohol. Lag is going to be the least of your worry's with the combination you already have. Keeping tires on it is going to be the primary concern.

zturbo

Well i am building a new combo (396) so the compression can be changed at this point. I can get alchy here easy cause of the shops around me, but if i want race fuel i have a min of a 100 mile drive each way. To get good race fuel i either have a 150 each way trip which is crazy or try again at getting vp or the like to ship me some in.

Thanks for the reply just trying to get in some thinking.

DeenHylton

Running alcohol can be a real pain-in-the-arzz! Yes it makes more power (about 7%) and has a high octane rating but it's very hard on any fuel component that is not compatible with alcohol. Alcohol will absorb water which may leave you with a mysterious engine miss and it also requires half again as much fuel to travel the same miles since alcohol contains less BTU's per gallon than gasoline. If your car is a race only then go for the alcohol...if it sees street use I'd stick with the gasoline and run a little lower compression. Deen

gkull

For a race vehicle alky is the only way to go. It never ceases to amaze me to see frost on the intake on a 90+ degree day. Instead of overheating problems like most drag vehicles and using towing machines. You just fire it up in the pits and drive to the stagging lanes. At the end of a run you drive back to the pits.

I've heard only 3% more power. You burn twice as much, but at @ $2.00 per gallon for methanol the overall cost is the nearly same as high octane race gas. It's true that you have to flush and drain the system at the end of day.

Monty

There aren't any Citgo or Union 76 gas stations around you? Usually they have a 100 octane unleaded pump, at least they do around here. Not all of them, but some of them.

There was a '66 Mustang (I think it was a '66) in PHR or Hot Rod a couple of months go that was twin turbo'd and ran on methanol. The owner was quted as saying it worked real well. So maybe it isn't such an unusual idea afterall. But I still can't help but think that it ceases to be a streetcar at that point.

I'm all about pushing the limits of streetability, but not being able to run it on pump gas is a little too extreme for me, especially when you can make as much as 1400hp or so on pump gas without too much trouble. I've never done anything with methanol, so I'm probably biased against it because I don't know much about it.

I guess it boils down to what your goal and intent is. If it's a ture racing engine/car, methanol is probably a good option. If you intend to drive it on the street, I'd stick with good 'ole gasoline.

Also, isn't it sometimes difficult to get alcohol cars started, especially when it's cold?

EDIT: I just took a look at your website, your car and turbo setup look awesome. I guess I didn't realize it, but you are building a racecar. I thought you were building a street car. You cage looks awesome too!


[Modified by Monty, 10:54 AM 12/18/2002]

gkull

Your right Monty about cold starts and methanol. Without a good squirt of 87gasoline or better yet a 50/50 dose of gas/acetone you not going to start it. We rigged up a electric valve and gravity feed. Just push the button and dump in a couple of ounces of 50/50 and hit the starter

zturbo

Thanks again guys. Car is mainly a race car. I have a street toy as well up in the great NW there isn't alot of like of fast cars on the street. The whole issue of street track setup isn't a huge issue with me. Fuel system is setup so i could use alchy if i choose that route.
We have 76 up here and have used there 100 octane unleaded in the past. I was planing on using even higher octane cause of my intent to push the motor to its limit in trying to get the times i am after.

Thanks for the comment about the cage monty (actually cage has changed) We have now added a few more frontal bars for rigidity, and safety. Kinda funny watching a safety engineer build a car lol.

Steven :steering:

wallyknoch

You double the amount of fuel used as to gas. 3% increase? No! Much much more. It`s just one step under Nitro in HP output. :thumbs:

zturbo

Umm one step under NITRO :D A nitro swilling turbo monster umm ummm ummmmmmmmmm. lol :crazy:

Thanks all I am 99% sure i am going with the alcohol setup i just need to finialize a few things with selling my old motor.

thanks again all
Steven

gkull

Wally I understand that your the owner of a bunch of nitro cars. The 3% figure is taken from dyno tests done on some state of the art 358 ci N/A motors with 17:1 C/R that produced @750 hp with sunoco 116 octane leaded race gas. Then the only change was to an optimized same CFM alky carb. Then it was @3% accross the board increase.

During the test the gasoline was also run through a super cool can to help level out the cooling effect gains of methanol.

That was the most unbiased test I've ever seen. I've had a couple of alky injected motors for drag and boat racing. I believe the test data to be correct.

Now in blown motors alky is the correct choice short of nitro blends. You could build a top alky motor and run it on gasoline and it would make nearly the same amount of power. If you could keep it cool! :seeya