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Comments for Phoenix'97 on the TPI LT1 concept.

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Comments for Phoenix'97 on the TPI LT1 concept.

 
Old 05-13-2018, 02:26 PM
  #1  
Phoenix'97
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If anyone has thoughtful build suggestions for my desire to have a stockish built TPI second-generation LT1 using factory exhaust (including exhaust manifolds) with factory gear ratio, please state your peace in this thread!
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Old 05-13-2018, 02:50 PM
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leadfoot4
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Camaro/Firebird? What, exactly, are you trying to accomplish, and what is your budget?
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Old 05-13-2018, 02:56 PM
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Uhhhh, no. Starting your bullshit thread all over again because you didn't like the answers from the last attempt is not okay. You're just shitting up the forum. Reporting to the moderators now.
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Old 05-13-2018, 03:53 PM
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Originally Posted by leadfoot4 View Post
Camaro/Firebird? What, exactly, are you trying to accomplish, and what is your budget?
1997 Firebird Trans Am. What am I trying to accomplish? An improved daily driving experience from the one I get on my stock LT1. The car sees winter, the car is not a strip car and certainly not a spring/summer only car. I need it to be reliable, I need it to pass emissions, and I wish not to reduce the current fuel mileage that I am getting, the EPA rated mileage. The exhaust system has to remain stock, I don't have the luxury of being able to put on long tubes and not suffer a catastrophic failure from diving into a pot hole or having them dig into hardened ice/snow on the roads.

What I want is the experience from third generation F-bodies and fourth generation Corvettes with the TPI cars. I really don't rev my engine to redline, I have developed the habit of driving below 2000 RPM for conservative driving and fuel mileage while gunning it as high as 5000 RPM and then shifting. The more I have thought about it and read about it, the more it feels like the TPI set-up is a perfect fit for my car. However, it comes down to how to transplant this system onto my second-generation LT1 and get it to work properly with tuning and camshaft. I am torn between an LT1 B-body camshaft which is more torque oriented or using a ZZ4 camshaft which is small enough and with a tune should give me the torque of the B-body LT1 cam while helping to draw out the curve a little more in higher RPM to where the TPI intake cuts out.

As far as money is concerned, I don't want to throw out a figure but I want this to build to be somewhat budget and it is going to be financed.

Last edited by Phoenix'97; 05-13-2018 at 03:55 PM.
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Old 05-13-2018, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by MatthewMiller View Post
Uhhhh, no. Starting your bullshit thread all over again because you didn't like the answers from the last attempt is not okay. You're just shitting up the forum. Reporting to the moderators now.
This forum should be sufficient for my "trolling". Leave me be.
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Old 05-13-2018, 05:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Phoenix'97 View Post
This forum should be sufficient for my "trolling". Leave me be.
Leave us be. Or put another way: leave us.
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Old 05-13-2018, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by MatthewMiller View Post
Leave us be. Or put another way: leave us.
The answer is no. I may not own a Corvette but my car uses a Corvette engine. I sought out advice for this future project and I know now that I won't be getting anything more useful than I already have.
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Old 05-13-2018, 06:23 PM
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This thread serves as my inspiration:
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...-with-l98.html

I just have to figure out a decent set-up with regards to a second-generation LT1 block. It is clear I am going to have to talk to an engine builder on this one but at least I feel comfortable with where I want to go with my car.
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Old 05-13-2018, 06:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Phoenix'97 View Post
The answer is no. I may not own a Corvette but my car uses a Corvette engine. I sought out advice for this future project and I know now that I won't be getting anything more useful than I already have.
Then stop posting here! If you know you aren't going to get any more useful info from this forum, then there can only be one other reason for you to keep posting and starting new threads:

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Old 05-13-2018, 07:12 PM
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Originally Posted by MatthewMiller View Post
Then stop posting here! If you know you aren't going to get any more useful info from this forum, then there can only be one other reason for you to keep posting and starting new threads:
You got me off of the C4 Tech/Performance forum. Now I am here and you still are not happy. You are calling me a troll by pestering me as you are after crapping up my threads and continue to do the same here on F-Body General Discussion? Who do I contact for moderation? If you have nothing meaningful to contribute to this thread then back the hell off and cease commenting.
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Old 05-13-2018, 07:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Phoenix'97 View Post
You got me off of the C4 Tech/Performance forum. Now I am here and you still are not happy. You are calling me a troll by pestering me as you are after crapping up my threads and continue to do the same here on F-Body General Discussion? Who do I contact for moderation? If you have nothing meaningful to contribute to this thread then back the hell off and cease commenting.
Phoenix, I have some comments that I would like to discuss with you, I am a very busy guy and I cannot spend the time to comment on all of your questions and the other questions on your car, but I can spend the time to talk to you. Give me a call, my name is Brian and I would be happy to discuss your build with you. 920-627-0156.
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Old 05-13-2018, 09:06 PM
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Originally Posted by bjankuski View Post
Phoenix, I have some comments that I would like to discuss with you, I am a very busy guy and I cannot spend the time to comment on all of your questions and the other questions on your car, but I can spend the time to talk to you. Give me a call, my name is Brian and I would be happy to discuss your build with you. 920-627-0156.
Eh, I will stick with this forum for comments, Sir. I do appreciate your kindness. All you need to do is type your thoughts! Forums are supposed to be more flexible than phone calls, especially when God knows what number you gave me to call! If this idea of mine is so bad, let me know here. Give me that at least.
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Old 05-13-2018, 09:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Phoenix'97 View Post
Eh, I will stick with this forum for comments, Sir. I do appreciate your kindness. All you need to do is type your thoughts! Forums are supposed to be more flexible than phone calls, especially when God knows what number you gave me to call! If this idea of mine is so bad, let me know here. Give me that at least.
Why would you assume I gave you a bogus phone number?
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Old 05-13-2018, 10:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Phoenix'97 View Post
The answer is no. I may not own a Corvette but my car uses a Corvette engine. I sought out advice for this future project and I know now that I won't be getting anything more useful than I already have.
Lets debunk this right neither you nor I have a Corvette engine in our 4th generation F-bodies. The ONLY true cross over is the 97 Firehawks that came with the 4 bolt LT4. You and I have 2 bolt LT1's the C4 has 4 bolt mains. How does this matter? 2 bolts where never put in a Y-body and 4 bolts stayed out of an F-body. Also the Corvette and police package cars had lighter pistons, I hit this roadblock when rebuilding mine. Summit sent me a replacement piston for the lightweight pistons in the corvette. This had a significant weight difference from my piston and I could not mix them.

On your topic you want to know what?
Will the parts fit? Yes you can mate any head and or intake to any block with the right wallet.
Will you match emissions? No.
Why?- Combustion chamber size.
Heads CC size resulting compression ratio
LT1 Aluminum - 54cc ( I sized mine before porting) 10.4:1 ( what you are at now)
LT1 Iron - 64cc Link 9.32:1 Less than a 3800 V6
L31 Iron - 68cc Link 8.95 needs boost to be worth a damn
FYI the higher compression you can achieve the more efficiently you use the total output of the specific amount of fuel you burn directly tied to Tq and HP gains. This is why in the 1970's and early 80's even the mighty 454ci big block couldn't get out of its own way.

Will the TPI intake bring your torque peak lower? - simple answer is yes. With a full TPI 4 piece intake yes you will earn very similar numbers to a mildly cammed L98 from a 90 or 91 corvette

Will this improve your daily driving experience? No. You have a stick and that requires more grunt off idle. The L98 harmonizes about 2500rpm leaving a dead spot on the low and high end. My personal LT1 rolls off from a stop light a lot easier than my L98 corvette.

Will you get better gas milage? Only if you drive better. You have to keep the engine in its peak efficiency that on the TPI engines and the LT1 ( well any SBC) is right around 2k. Not at 1200 or 1500 but you have to stay around it ( 1800-2200 is ideal) Take this from a tuner.

If i have missed any part of your question please ask it directly and specifically.

Last edited by Space387; 05-13-2018 at 10:20 PM.
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Old 05-13-2018, 10:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Space387 View Post
Lets debunk this right neither you nor I have a Corvette engine in our 4th generation F-bodies. The ONLY true cross over is the 97 Firehawks that came with the 4 bolt LT4. You and I have 2 bolt LT1's the C4 has 4 bolt mains. How does this matter? 2 bolts where never put in a Y-body and 4 bolts stayed out of an F-body. Also the Corvette and police package cars had lighter pistons, I hit this roadblock when rebuilding mine. Summit sent me a replacement piston for the lightweight pistons in the corvette. This had a significant weight difference from my piston and I could not mix them.

On your topic you want to know what?
Will the parts fit? Yes you can mate any head and or intake to any block with the right wallet.
Will you match emissions? No.
Why?- Combustion chamber size.
Heads CC size resulting compression ratio
LT1 Aluminum - 54cc ( I sized mine before porting) 10.4:1 ( what you are at now)
LT1 Iron - 64cc Link 9.32:1 Less than a 3800 V6
L31 Iron - 68cc Link 8.95 needs boost to be worth a damn
FYI the higher compression you can achieve the more efficiently you use the total output of the specific amount of fuel you burn directly tied to Tq and HP gains. This is why in the 1970's and early 80's even the mighty 454ci big block couldn't get out of its own way.

Will the TPI intake bring your torque peak lower? - simple answer is yes. With a full TPI 4 piece intake yes you will earn very similar numbers to a mildly cammed L98 from a 90 or 91 corvette

Will this improve your daily driving experience? No. You have a stick and that requires more grunt off idle. The L98 harmonizes about 2500rpm leaving a dead spot on the low and high end. My personal LT1 rolls off from a stop light a lot easier than my L98 corvette.

Will you get better gas milage? Only if you drive better. You have to keep the engine in its peak efficiency that on the TPI engines and the LT1 ( well any SBC) is right around 2k. Not at 1200 or 1500 but you have to stay around it ( 1800-2200 is ideal) Take this from a tuner.

If i have missed any part of your question please ask it directly and specifically.
I guess I better have a stick shift TPI L98 to drive to see how it behaves then.
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Old 05-13-2018, 11:11 PM
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That is the only way to actually know how your but dyno will read. In all fairness you should also come drive my Formula to see what a cleaned up LT1 is like under your driving restrictions. If you make the trip this way I'll let you drive both to see first hand that the L98 is not the power plant fanatics make it out to be.
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Old 05-13-2018, 11:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Space387 View Post
That is the only way to actually know how your but dyno will read. In all fairness you should also come drive my Formula to see what a cleaned up LT1 is like under your driving restrictions. If you make the trip this way I'll let you drive both to see first hand that the L98 is not the power plant fanatics make it out to be.
I won't be leaving my state anytime soon. I am sure there is lots to be done with the LT1, it is just a matter of whether it suits my driving style. My goal is as much low end and mid-range torque production up to 5000 RPM as possible without a stroker, without a supercharger, and without altering the gear ratio. I need to experience this "dead spot" you speak of and whether or not it is something that can be overcome or just the design of the intake. I need a TPI L98 to drive.
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Old 05-13-2018, 11:37 PM
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That IS the only way to know...drive one, or some. You can ask questions until the cows come home...but you'll never "get it" until you drive something and see for yourself. In fact, I made a VERY SIMILAR SUGGESTION, 4 threads, 1000's of wasted posts, and over 6 months ago:
Originally Posted by Tom400CFI View Post
Where do you live?

I HIGHLY suggest that you use this forum to find an owner, local to you who has an LT1 w/gears or a stroker/383 LT1...go drive it. Then you'll know that you can save several thousands on a custom intake that won't do what several hundred on gears or stroker kit will.




Originally Posted by bjankuski View Post
Phoenix, I have some comments that I would like to discuss with you, I am a very busy guy and I cannot spend the time to comment on all of your questions and the other questions on your car, but I can spend the time to talk to you. Give me a call, my name is Brian and I would be happy to discuss your build with you. 920-627-0156.
Originally Posted by Phoenix'97 View Post
Eh, I will stick with this forum for comments, Forums are supposed to be more flexible than phone calls, especially when God knows what number you gave me to call!
Matthew Miller is right: Troll status? CONFIRMED.

Originally Posted by Space387 View Post
If you make the trip this way I'll let you drive both to see first hand that the L98 is not the power plant fanatics make it out to be.
Originally Posted by Phoenix'97 View Post
I won't be leaving my state anytime soon.
Doubly CONFIRMED.

I bet there is an L98 F-bod owner somewhere in what ever state you live in....I BET that there is.
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Old 05-14-2018, 12:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Tom400CFI View Post

I bet there is an L98 F-bod owner somewhere in what ever state you live in....I BET that there is.
On the TPI intake thread he informed me he lived in New York. Due to his car being an OBD2 car the emissions test will probably make him remove all the parts unless he see's a "friend" for a favor. I had to do this once or twice living up there.
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Old 05-14-2018, 07:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Space387 View Post
On the TPI intake thread he informed me he lived in New York. Due to his car being an OBD2 car the emissions test will probably make him remove all the parts unless he see's a "friend" for a favor. I had to do this once or twice living up there.
I live in NY. The days of having a "friend" overlook your engine modifications, in order to be able to register the car, are pretty much over. Part of the vehicle's "annual inspection" now includes a plug in to the ADL port of your car, by a system that ties directly into the DMV's computer network. No pass the emissions check, no get inspection sticker, PLUS the DMV has a record of this, as they also do a scan of the registration sticker, that your car has to display on the windshield.
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